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 Post subject: THE SPIRIT OF TRUTH
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A Question came to me this morning :idea:

WHY , Does it seem that the Spirit of Truth
Isnt doing its job in reaching oh so many
on our planet by showing them '' THE WAY''
Of their Errors in thoughts and beliefs
in regards to religions and spiritual realities?

I suppose their are many answers and reasons
for it , and may come down to that they
are not seeking further Truths and are merely
content with what they have found .

Thinkin I need more Coffee !


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coop wrote:
WHY , Does it seem that the Spirit of Truth
Isnt doing its job in reaching oh so many
on our planet by showing them '' THE WAY''
Of their Errors in thoughts and beliefs
in regards to religions and spiritual realities?

I guess a lot of people don't really accept this, but TUB does not refer to the Spirit of Truth as an "it".
Quote:
p1932:1 178:1.16 Let the Spirit of Truth do his own work.

The Spirit of Truth is the spirit of a person which means that a relationship is required. People are often afraid of having a relationship with the Spirit of Truth because of what might happen to them as a result.
Quote:
p2083:02 Thinking man has always feared to be held by a religion. When a strong and moving religion threatens to dominate him, he invariably tries to rationalize, traditionalize, and institutionalize it, thereby hoping to gain control of it. By such procedure, even a revealed religion becomes man-made and man-dominated. Modern men and women of intelligence evade the religion of Jesus because of their fears of what it will do to them--and with them. And all such fears are well founded. The religion of Jesus does, indeed, dominate and transform its believers, demanding that men dedicate their lives to seeking for a knowledge of the will of the Father in heaven and requiring that the energies of living be consecrated to the unselfish service of the brotherhood of man.

Even so, you are right. A person needs to be receptive to the mission of Jesus in order to benefit from his Spirit of Truth's ministry.
Quote:
34.5.5 Though the Spirit of Truth is poured out upon all flesh, this spirit of the Son is almost wholly limited in function and power by man’s personal reception of that which constitutes the sum and substance of the mission of the bestowal Son.


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Yeah , correct , Bonitia 8)
Forgive my early mornin museing
I Was in Error of calling the Spirit of Truth
An '' IT ''.

Did not mean to be disrespectful to the SOT.

The SOT Helps show me '' The Way ''
In my daily walk with '' Him ''

A Great Gift from Jesus Christ Michael
to mankind . His Liveing attribute of Spirit Guidance.

Faith son
Coop


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coop wrote:
A Question came to me this morning :idea:
Of their Errors in thoughts and beliefs
in regards to religions and spiritual realities?

I suppose their are many answers and reasons
for it , and may come down to that they
are not seeking further Truths and are merely
content with what they have found .

Thinkin I need more Coffee !


(((coop)))

The spirit of Truth Dwells within, therefor it can only be self realized.
In regards to those who believe in borrowed truths they seek the Truth out there and it can be found out there because, Truth is in all things, but out there the Truth has been interpreted already and translated according to their own personal ability. One must be able to understand their translation of Truth to be able to fully grasp it so to look into the world and recognize it. Unfortunately when we borrow the Truth it gets lost in 'translation' because the Truth can only be felt. We cannot convey what a feeling feels like except through metaphors .
Jesus said Unconditional Love is the Way. Unconditional is the key. How many Love Unconditionally? How many of us even stop to analyze what our idea of Love is?
I guess what I am saying here is that its easier to believe 'They' know the answers than it is to imagine that we could. When we put our faith in another persons translation of Truth we are being lead. We are at the mercy of their translation. I can learn -of- Truth and never feel it, never know it personally but that binds me to that source, It is only as clear as my ability to understand the translation. However, should I seek it within and come to know it personally I MYSELF will know Truth because I can sense it , because I can Feel it, therefore I will be able to recognize it in all that is. My source will be unlimited my opportunities will be vast. Truth is not compromised by condition when you know it without a doubt.

You asked;
WHY , Does it seem that the Spirit of Truth
Isnt doing its job in reaching oh so many
on our planet by showing them '' THE WAY''

There is only One Way and it must be realized personally.
Its like a river flowing one way and we are all blind. We can't tell which way it flows by standing along side of it we must get into it. Now we can choose to not get in and walk along the edge and hope we are not going contrary to the river, we must rely on how accurate our senses are or trust those who have chosen to so the same.
Only by getting in can we know for sure we are gong the right way because once in if we resist what IS we will know because we will find ourselves fighting to stay afloat. We will struggle because it is not meant for us to go against the flow. This is experienced as suffering in our every day lives. If we are suffering then we are resisting what IS.

Its obvious if your in the river/ not obvious if your on the bank.
We have to realize that there is a river/Truth before we can find our way to it then then we have to choose to get in on our own and learn how to allow ourselves to flow with it.
We may be blnd but we are not without senses.

I need coffee too :wink:

...love...


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iamuurme wrote:
Only by getting in can we know for sure we are gong the right way because once in if we resist what IS we will know because we will find ourselves fighting to stay afloat. We will struggle because it is not meant for us to go against the flow. This is experienced as suffering in our every day lives. If we are suffering then we are resisting what IS.


Hi iamuurme,

You wrote a beautiful response which I mostly agree, with exception to the last two sentences above. Before I explain why, I'd like to ask for permission from Coop to go off topic on this because I think a discussion of the meaning of human suffering is both important and controversial.

Coop, if you prefer, I'll start another thread.


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Bonita wrote:
iamuurme wrote:
Only by getting in can we know for sure we are gong the right way because once in if we resist what IS we will know because we will find ourselves fighting to stay afloat. We will struggle because it is not meant for us to go against the flow. This is experienced as suffering in our every day lives. If we are suffering then we are resisting what IS.


Hi iamuurme,

You wrote a beautiful response which I mostly agree, with exception to the last two sentences above. Before I explain why, I'd like to ask for permission from Coop to go off topic on this because I think a discussion of the meaning of human suffering is both important and controversial.

Coop, if you prefer, I'll start another thread.


Good Morning (((Bonita)))
I look forward to your thoughts in human suffering.
Personally, I feel there is purpose to all things created even the silly mental suffering that we create for ourselves. Ultimately I feel that suffering presents us with self awareness to bring our focus within. We assume it is real if we feel it personally so when we do not understand something we seek the answer as to why it is. When it is personal we pay way more attention as to why it Is happening as long as we can get past the mental reasoning . Instead of the mental reasoning if we could just allow ourselves to sense our inner guidance we can open ourselves up to that holy space 'within' where the answers to our questions are eminent.

Only after experienced great suffering was I brought to a place where I asked myself why I was so vulnerable to believe in something so temporary ? If nothing real can be destroyed then what was it that I believed that that allowed myself to become so Trust worthy? If that was not real then what Is? This kind of seeking lead me to my personal revelation or alignment with Truth.
I was lead my whole life and what I believed was a result of borrowed truths I was one of the ones who (((coop))) was referring to. I can identify, I thought that by following and doing what was being taught and not questioning anything that I would be able to create a life that would not be threatened and if something did happen answers would be emanate if I just trusted and had faith. I didn't understand why I was suffering? I didn't understand why my children were suffering? I stopped believing what I was taught and turned inward the only place where I could experience an answer that was unconditional.There I asked Why?

Then it came.... Everything that I had ever questioned in my life up until that moment was revealed to me. It was intimate and personal. It was not of my own doing it came into me or from within me. My suffering was mental completely self induced. The loss of my husband was with purpose. Through his moving on I was given the opportunity to grow in awareness from the experience. I could have continued to believe that my suffering was without purpose and that I was a victim. The world seems to condole suffering as a Divine Rite given to victims. It was clear to me that there are no victims. Nothing was happening to me - it was happening for me. If I had continued to believe his passing happened 'to me' I would have never allowed for the space to realize it was a gift to me. A gift of Spiritual Growth. I was able to understand the Beauty the Truth in his passing and have realized that nothing is 'as it seems' on a physical level. I know now that suffering IS due to my own inability to understand.
I can seek the truth in all that is no matter how grand or insignificant it may seem ,if I so choose.
I am new to TUB so I am not sure how to say what I have in TUB terms but I am sure I can find them if I take a moment to seek the Truth in it. That the wonderful thing about Truth it speaks for itself in any language. You just have to have ears to hear it.
I hope I haven't went overboard I have been told I ramble on but its just that I so enjoy expressing what I have come to know. Don't believe a word I say seek it for yourself... :wink:

...love...


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Hi iamuurme,

Your response is beautiful and I think I understand what you are saying. My first reaction to your statement that, "If we are suffering then we are resisting what IS", and to your user name, "I am you and you are me", I thought, "Wow, she must be a Buddhist or something! Kookookachoo, and I am the eggman too!" So thanks for clarifying that. (Not that there's something wrong with being a Buddhist, I just don't agree with the Buddhist philosophy on suffering.)

I do think, like you, that a good bit of our suffering is self-induced.

Quote:
"But, my son, you should know that the Father does not purposely afflict his children. Man brings down upon himself unnecessary affliction as a result of his persistent refusal to walk in the better ways of the divine will. Affliction is potential in evil, but much of it has been produced by sin and iniquity." 1661:05


And like you, I think that there is purpose in suffering. The world is a suffering place; in fact, so is our whole universe.

Quote:
Pain and suffering are essential to progressive evolution. 951:03

The universe of your origin is being forged out between the anvil of justice and the hammer of suffering; but those who wield the hammer are the children of mercy, the spirit offspring of the Infinite Spirit. 100:02

Is pleasure--the satisfaction of happiness--desirable? Then must man live in a world where the alternative of pain and the likelihood of suffering are ever-present experiential possibilities. 51:13


Yet we so misunderstand suffering. Look at the story of Job. And, you are right in saying that so many enjoy and wallow in their victimhood as a badge of honor for persevering through injustice and evil treatment of their personalities, when in truth, forgiveness and returning good for evil would relieve them of that very badge of victimhood, which stands for their sacrifice, and replace it instead with grace. There are no wars to fight but the war against one's own selfishness, the conquest of self through the sacrifice of pride.


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coop wrote:
A Question came to me this morning :idea:

WHY , Does it seem that the Spirit of Truth
Isnt doing its job in reaching oh so many
on our planet by showing them '' THE WAY''
Of their Errors in thoughts and beliefs
in regards to religions and spiritual realities?

I suppose their are many answers and reasons
for it , and may come down to that they
are not seeking further Truths and are merely
content with what they have found .

Thinkin I need more Coffee !


The Spirit of Truth is the life and teaching of Christ Michael in spirit form. How many people followed Jesus when he was here? The Son always stands at the door and knocks. Only those who opens and invites Him in will experience entertaining Him.

A huge reason is the planetary repercussion of Lucifer rebellion and Adamic default. There is not much corresponding external teaching forms (knowledge of deity) on the planet to cooperate with the work of the Spirit. Or there are not enough Deity identified mortals on the planet.

The Spirit of Truth can only show a person "This is the way" when that person will to follow Jesus each step of the way towards Paradise.


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HI ALL
THANKS
SOME REALLY GOOD STUFF :idea:

SIS BONITIA - PLEASE SIS , NO REASON AT ALL
TO EVER ASK FOR MY PERMISSION , I Do look forward to your
personal thots and shareing here , there , everywhere ...
AND I ALSO
FEEL THAT SUFFERING IS RELATED TO THIS
TOPIC OF THE SOT/ SPIRIT OF TRUTH.
FOR THE SOT IS NOT ONLY A TEACHER
BUT ALSO CALLED A COMFORTER,

SIS IAMUURME 8)

THANKS FOR YOUR PERSONAL SHAREING
AND THOTS . I THINK THAT WHAT YOU MAY BE
WISHIN TO EXPRESS IN BOTH THE UB AND BIBLE ETC
TERMS ,

IS THAT THAT BY FAITH , TRUST & GRACE :wink:

YOU HAVE FOUND THAT COMFORT AND PEACE :smile:
THAT SURPASS'S ALL UNDERSTANDING .
WHICH COMES FROM THE FATHER THRU THE SON AND THE
SOT & THE HOLY SPIRIT THAT DOES GIVE US COMFORT AND PEACE.

BLESS YOU IN YOUR PEACE

TONYMA 8)
DITTO = GOOD STUFF BRO

ABOUT SUFFERING
WELL SOMETIMES SHITE / STUFF JUST
HAPPENS , OTHER TIMES ITS CAUSED BY
OUR OWN ERRORS IN LIFESTYLE ETC , AN CHOICES .
A PERSONAL EXAMPLE , I HAVE CIRROSIS OF THE LIVER
... BECAUSE ,,, I WAS A ALCOHOLIC AND DRUG USER
FOR 35 + years , cause and effect eh .
SOME Suffering is INEVITABLE , AS IN OLD AGE
We will Naturaly often lose our hair our eysite our
minds even . :-$

I Found and find in my personal suffering
that the words of Paul helps inspire me thru it
when he said ; that , it is in my/our suffering
that I/WE Can truely find strengh , thru the father .
[ MY Paraphrase] will look for the Bible verse .

Michael Never promised that the path on our road
would ever be an easy one , but he did promise us
rest from our labor , comfort from the storms
along the way and
A PEACE THAT IS BEYOND ALL UNDERSTANDING

IN HIM With Him and thru him ALL Things are possible .

And thru A Liveing Faith trust with him he does shower us with
his grace and blessing gifts daily , his healing energy light
is real , yet we must have the faith trust in him ,
to have him help us , guide us to Help ourselves in every way we /
he can . As the Spirit of Truth can and does show us the Way .
We must tho , not so much to by led but rather guided ,
by our best possible choices of personal changes in bad
habits , Doctors advices , medical treatments , positive
mental health , ... we can then start to begin our Healing
from Suffering ,,, Physical , mental , emotional and spiritual .

THE Personal Healing can then become a reality !

The Personal religious experience is a healing in itself .
And be it Physical , mental , emotional and or spiritual .
IT Can be felt as a personal miracle .
Thats my thots on ... FAITH HEALING ..
For now .

I may share soma my personal sufferings an healing .
I Hope not to cause any personal sufferings to
anybody readin this . =; :-#

DO WE Suffer Sins of our Fathers ?
DNA :?

NO Need for a sin eater !

Sorry for any confusion , Errors in my thots , opinions
spelling etc ... as i think im gettin Old Timers . :-&

I AM THE EGG MAN
COOP 8)
I AM THE WALRUS



http://www.songfacts.com/detail.php?id=138

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Hi Coop, thought I'd add some great quotes on suffering to go along with what you wrote.

Quote:
When the suffering servant obtains a vision of God, there follows a soul peace which passes all human understanding. 148.6.3

Much of what a mortal would call good luck might really be bad luck; the smile of fortune that bestows unearned leisure and undeserved wealth may be the greatest of human afflictions; the apparent cruelty of a perverse fate that heaps tribulation upon some suffering mortal may in reality be the tempering fire that is transmuting the soft iron of immature personality into the tempered steel of real character. 118.10.9

Teach all believers that those who enter the kingdom are not thereby rendered immune to the accidents of time or to the ordinary catastrophes of nature. Believing the gospel will not prevent getting into trouble, but it will insure that you shall be unafraid when trouble does overtake you. If you dare to believe in me and wholeheartedly proceed to follow after me, you shall most certainly by so doing enter upon the sure pathway to trouble. I do not promise to deliver you from the waters of adversity, but I do promise to go with you through all of them. 159.3.13

That, then, is the primary or elementary course which confronts the faith-tested and much-traveled pilgrims of space. But long before reaching Havona, these ascendant children of time have learned to feast upon uncertainty, to fatten upon disappointment, to enthuse over apparent defeat, to invigorate in the presence of difficulties, to exhibit indomitable courage in the face of immensity, and to exercise unconquerable faith when confronted with the challenge of the inexplicable. Long since, the battle cry of these pilgrims became: "In liaison with God, nothing—absolutely nothing—is impossible." p291:3 26:5.3


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Hey Coop...awesome thread.

The quote Bonita gave that really shows the need for a relationship sure did hit home for me.
Quote:
Modern men and women of intelligence evade the religion of Jesus because of their fears of what it will do to them--and with them. And all such fears are well founded. The religion of Jesus does, indeed, dominate and transform its believers, demanding that men dedicate their lives to seeking for a knowledge of the will of the Father in heaven and requiring that the energies of living be consecrated to the unselfish service of the brotherhood of man.
Good teaching. A very powerful transformation indeed to become consecrated to unselfish service. It speaks to motivation too...."unselfish"...very important component to living the will of the Father...having that giving become natural.

Suffering....funny word....sounds so bad at first...but as someone who loves work and enjoys positive results from physical activity that can cause pain in the short term....I see suffering as part of the process of building and succeeding. Suffering is often how a polished character is built. It motivates change....a desire to do things differently...maybe better. For me...suffering has been a great process for learning....I had to go through to get through...experiencing the learning to get it...not so bad to suffer....just need to change the meaning a bit to learning and experiencing.....and add a dash of gratitude for the knowlege just for flavor. :mrgreen:

Peace :D :D


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See I knew there would be quotes to support what I have experienced. The Truth Book is filled to the brim with validation for me. Bonita, you are such a good student of the TUB how long have you studied it and how were you introduced to it? Personally, I was seeking validation to my own experience. Something other than the bible, not that the bible is not a good source of truth because it is a great source of truth provided you know what truth feels like. (if that makes since?). When I suddenly became aware of the truth within I wanted to know who else knew of this amazing reality. For a year and a half book after book was brought to my attention. Some screamed to me from the shelf when I was not even looking. Before my experience I had no time to read because I had priorities and kids to raise no time for fiction in my life (so I thought). Once my eyes and ears were opened it was as if I was being lead. I had books all over my house and I was reading them all at the same time. ( mind you one was more than I was use to so when I say books all over that could be two or three) LOL. I was facinated how many people sensed this reality and was able to express it in so many different ways. Some had no idea what they were expessing but not only were they able to express it into a book the fact that they were on the top selling book list proved that the metaphore they used was being recieved by many. Book after Book , Poem after Poem, seemed to speak directly to my heart. It was no longer jibberish it made perfect since.
The Urantia Book was one of those books. It came to me through a book that was channeled that I found facinating. Channeled information seemed to speak louder and clearer to me as it still does. I do not need to be sceptical because when somthing is not true It is self evident. The Truth shines so brite that a lie cannot exist in its presence. The UB is a book that has much light in it and even if I cannot understand the language at the moment I read it as soon as I experience it it becomes loud and clear. Experience seem to be my indicator , like a signpost pointing to truth and as long as I be silent truth will be revealed.
Just as you have shared quotes that have supported what I have come to know and shared here, Truth is all around us and in us. The Spirit of Truth is selvf evident should we become aware of it. It points and guides us to the Way.
The Truth is reflected in all that IS - but I find highlighted in the words of this wonderful book.
...love... O:)
Cat'n fnid slpel chcek srroy :oops:


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fishin'Mom wrote:
...not so bad to suffer....just need to change the meaning a bit to learning and experiencing.....and add a dash of gratitude for the knowlege just for flavor.


I still remember the exact time I realized this, the beauty that comes when my immediate reaction to the first hint of suffering, trouble or tribulation is to give thanks and praise. That impulse is so alien and backwards in our current culture, yet it is the only Way to succeed in discovering, recognizing and implementing God's will during those times, and maybe all times. At least it is so in my experience.

iamuurme wrote:
Bonita, you are such a good student of the TUB how long have you studied it and how were you introduced to it?


A stranger walked up to my husband during coffee hour after church and just handed it to him. He glanced at it and decided he wasn't interested so he passed it to me, and as soon as I held it, I started to tremble. I remember being a little afraid of it, and when I started to read it, I got even more afraid. I was almost 19 then, I'm almost 59 now. 40 years of amazing personal revelation ensued, the specifics I can't even begin to describe without sounding cuckoo.

I read a lot too and have a minimum of 10 books going at a time, not including TUB. I read a minimum of 3 hours a day, sometimes all day. When Jesus was teaching his apostles, he mandated that they spend 3 hours every evening with their studies, so that's what I do. I too soaked up a lot of the channelled works and even tried it in order to see what it was all about. But, I warn you, we are not allowed to discuss that on this forum. Although, I am able to say that because I took the time to really research it and find out for myself, I understand it better than most and have discovered that people have been doing this probably since the spirit of worship first started functioning on this planet. Even St. Paul fell victim to it. It's a peculiar mechanism with just enough truth to convince people that it is Truth. But, let's not go any further with that, lest we have the topic frozen or erased and I get punished for breaking the rules. Suffice it to say that the mystical tradition has some valuable and some not so valuable outcomes. There are unbalanced people who produce unbalanced works in every walk of life, in every human endeavor. It's a fine line that each of us has to assess on our own with help from above.

iamuurme wrote:
When I suddenly became aware of the truth within I wanted to know who else knew of this amazing reality.


This desire to find others and share the inner life is proof of the validity of the reality of your experience. I've made some critical observations which can be applied to all inner contactors.
1. They all recognize one another.
2. They all want to talk about it, write about it, or share it in some manner, even though it cannot be described.
3. They all realize that although it cannot be proven, their experience is not fantasy or self-generated.
4. The experience is so real, it is life changing.
5. The experience affects the whole person and is visible as fruits of the spirit, which cannot be hidden under a bushel.
6. So often, the inner contactor's desire to share the experience is to help others have it too, not to boast about it. But, that is so frequently what others see it as and they often label it spiritual egotism, flights of fancy or demon possession.
7. And such vilification only intensifies the inner contactor's desire for the inner life which renews the cycle of personal religious experience of love and the need to share it even more, even to the point of giving up one's life so others might have it.


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Bonita wrote:
fishin'Mom wrote:
...not so bad to suffer....just need to change the meaning a bit to learning and experiencing.....and add a dash of gratitude for the knowlege just for flavor.


I still remember the exact time I realized this, the beauty that comes when my immediate reaction to the first hint of suffering, trouble or tribulation is to give thanks and praise. That impulse is so alien and backwards in our current culture, yet it is the only Way to succeed in discovering, recognizing and implementing God's will during those times, and maybe all times. At least it is so in my experience.

iamuurme wrote:
Bonita, you are such a good student of the TUB how long have you studied it and how were you introduced to it?


A stranger walked up to my husband during coffee hour after church and just handed it to him. He glanced at it and decided he wasn't interested so he passed it to me, and as soon as I held it, I started to tremble. I remember being a little afraid of it, and when I started to read it, I got even more afraid. I was almost 19 then, I'm almost 59 now. 40 years of amazing personal revelation ensued, the specifics I can't even begin to describe without sounding cuckoo.

I read a lot too and have a minimum of 10 books going at a time, not including TUB. I read a minimum of 3 hours a day, sometimes all day. When Jesus was teaching his apostles, he mandated that they spend 3 hours every evening with their studies, so that's what I do. I too soaked up a lot of the channelled works and even tried it in order to see what it was all about. But, I warn you, we are not allowed to discuss that on this forum. Although, I am able to say that because I took the time to really research it and find out for myself, I understand it better than most and have discovered that people have been doing this probably since the spirit of worship first started functioning on this planet. Even St. Paul fell victim to it. It's a peculiar mechanism with just enough truth to convince people that it is Truth. But, let's not go any further with that, lest we have the topic frozen or erased and I get punished for breaking the rules. Suffice it to say that the mystical tradition has some valuable and some not so valuable outcomes. There are unbalanced people who produce unbalanced works in every walk of life, in every human endeavor. It's a fine line that each of us has to assess on our own with help from above.

iamuurme wrote:
When I suddenly became aware of the truth within I wanted to know who else knew of this amazing reality.


This desire to find others and share the inner life is proof of the validity of the reality of your experience. I've made some critical observations which can be applied to all inner contactors.
1. They all recognize one another.
2. They all want to talk about it, write about it, or share it in some manner, even though it cannot be described.
3. They all realize that although it cannot be proven, their experience is not fantasy or self-generated.
4. The experience is so real, it is life changing.
5. The experience affects the whole person and is visible as fruits of the spirit, which cannot be hidden under a bushel.
6. So often, the inner contactor's desire to share the experience is to help others have it too, not to boast about it. But, that is so frequently what others see it as and they often label it spiritual egotism, flights of fancy or demon possession.
7. And such vilification only intensifies the inner contactor's desire for the inner life which renews the cycle of personal religious experience of love and the need to share it even more, even to the point of giving up one's life so others might have it.


(((Bonita)))
Your name suites you...
You have brought me to tears I must go and sit with this for a bit before I return. I have needed your words for some time and must admit they could not have come in a better time.
Thank you so very much
...much love to you ....
O:)


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 Post subject: Re: THE SPIRIT OF TRUTH
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Joined: Tue Dec 26, 2006 9:44 am +0000
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iamuurme wrote:
You have brought me to tears I must go and sit with this for a bit before I return. I have needed your words for some time and must admit they could not have come in a better time.
Thank you so very much
...much love to you ....


Proof again that you are there. Much love and many blessings to you too!


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