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No, but there's this statement about the dispensational resurrection. A seasoned reader pointed out the word "living" in this quote:

...Many other loyal souls had already been translated at the time of Adam’s arrival, which was attended by a dispensational adjudication of both the sleeping survivors and of the living qualified ascenders.... 76:6.2 (853.3)

And there was another quote about living humans being removed:

The Edenic caravan was halted on the third day out from the Garden by the arrival of the seraphic transports from Jerusem. And for the first time Adam and Eve were informed of what was to become of their children. While the transports stood by, those children who had arrived at the age of choice (twenty years) were given the option of remaining on Urantia with their parents or of becoming wards of the Most Highs of Norlatiadek. Two thirds chose to go to Edentia; about one third elected to remain with their parents. All children of prechoice age were taken to Edentia. No one could have beheld the sorrowful parting of this Material Son and Daughter and their children without realizing that the way of the transgressor is hard. These offspring of Adam and Eve are now on Edentia; we do not know what disposition is to be made of them.... 75:6.3 (844.5)

So, do you think the angels removed their souls, their Adjusters seized their "mind transcripts", and they all took off for the mansonia resurrection hall and put in new forms? And their human bodies were consumed in translation?

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rick warren wrote:
...Many other loyal souls had already been translated at the time of Adam’s arrival, which was attended by a dispensational adjudication of both the sleeping survivors and of the living qualified ascenders.... 76:6.2 (853.3)

That's fascinating Rick. Never noticed that before.

The following always made me wonder:

(51:2.3) While there is this dematerializing technique for preparing the Adams for transit from Jerusem to the evolutionary worlds, there is no equivalent method for taking them away from such worlds unless the entire planet is to be emptied, in which event emergency installation of the dematerialization technique is made for the entire salvable population. If some physical catastrophe should doom the planetary residence of an evolving race, the Melchizedeks and the Life Carriers would install the technique of dematerialization for all survivors, and by seraphic transport these beings would be carried away to the new world prepared for their continuing existence. The evolution of a human race, once initiated on a world of space, must proceed quite independently of the physical survival of that planet, but during the evolutionary ages it is not otherwise intended that a Planetary Adam or Eve shall leave their chosen world.


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rick warren wrote:
So, do you think the angels removed their souls, their Adjusters seized their "mind transcripts", and they all took off for the mansonia resurrection hall and put in new forms? And their human bodies were consumed in translation?

I suppose so, yes.


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nodAmanaV wrote:

The following always made me wonder:

(51:2.3) While there is this dematerializing technique for preparing the Adams for transit from Jerusem to the evolutionary worlds, there is no equivalent method for taking them away from such worlds unless the entire planet is to be emptied, in which event emergency installation of the dematerialization technique is made for the entire salvable population. If some physical catastrophe should doom the planetary residence of an evolving race, the Melchizedeks and the Life Carriers would install the technique of dematerialization for all survivors, and by seraphic transport these beings would be carried away to the new world prepared for their continuing existence. The evolution of a human race, once initiated on a world of space, must proceed quite independently of the physical survival of that planet, but during the evolutionary ages it is not otherwise intended that a Planetary Adam or Eve shall leave their chosen world.


Me too, nodA. Which brings even more questions about how that actually happens (when/if it does), doesn't it?!

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Here's something I noticed lately about being "consumed in translation".

I've often wondered whether or not there have been many or just a few who have been taken up "in chariots of fire".

What do you think the use of the word "most" means here?


(110:7.2) When a human being has completed the circles of cosmic achievement, and further, when the final choosing of the mortal will permits the Adjuster to complete the association of human identity with the morontial soul during evolutionary and physical life, then do such consummated liaisons of soul and Adjuster go on independently to the mansion worlds, and there is issued the mandate from Uversa which provides for the immediate fusion of the Adjuster and the morontial soul. This fusion during physical life instantly consumes the material body; the human beings who might witness such a spectacle would only observe the translating mortal disappear "in chariots of fire."

(110:7.3) Most Adjusters who have translated their subjects from Urantia were highly experienced and of record as previous indwellers of numerous mortals on other spheres. Remember, Adjusters gain valuable indwelling experience on planets of the loan order; it does not follow that Adjusters only gain experience for advanced work in those mortal subjects who fail to survive.


To me it must mean that it happens a lot more than we're apt to think.


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Being transported off the planet and being translated off the planet are not the same thing.


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katroofjebus wrote:
Being transported off the planet and being translated off the planet are not the same thing.



That's something I was pondering. Which was it for the pre- and post Adamic dispensations?


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katroofjebus wrote:
Being transported off the planet and being translated off the planet are not the same thing.


Although translate appears to have two or more meanings as well...on planet fusion but one.

But I agree, to translate and to transport are different I think.


Last edited by fanofVan on Sun Aug 18, 2019 9:04 am +0000, edited 1 time in total.

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rick warren wrote:
Which was it for the pre- and post Adamic dispensations?


I don't think we are on the same page here. Let's define the terms.

Translation: This occurs when a personality has spiritually progressed to the point of needing a newer and higher life form to continue in the ascension scheme.
Transportation: A means of conveying a personality from one place to another.

When personalities are removed from the planet it is not always a step along the ascension scheme. Sometimes they're just traveling from one place to another.

When personalities fuse, they are translated because they have progressed in the ascension scheme. When personalities must leave a planet for other reasons not related to the ascension scheme, they are transported. Sleeping survivors are translated because they take on new life forms as part of the ascension scheme.

In the reference cited at the beginning of this thread, mention is made of Adam and Eve's children being transported off the planet. They were not translated as part of the ascension scheme. They were simply moved from one place to another, from Urantia to Edentia. Although they do not expressly state this, one assumes they had to be dematerialized prior to transport which is something the transport seraphim are capable of doing. Once Adam and Eve's children arrive on Edentia, the Life Carriers can restore them to their normal life forms.

(582.2) 51:2.2 Adams and Eves are semimaterial creatures and, as such, are not transportable by seraphim. They must undergo dematerialization on the system capital before they can be enseraphimed for transport to the world of assignment. The transport seraphim are able to effect such changes in the Material Sons and in other semimaterial beings as enable them to be enseraphimed and thus to be transported through space from one world or system to another. About three days of standard time are consumed in this transport preparation, and it requires the co-operation of a Life Carrier to restore such a dematerialized creature to normal existence upon arrival at the end of the seraphic-transport journey.


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not clear to me if the passage referring to Adams' arrival is arrival on earth or the resurrection hall but i think the latter? the technique of terrestrial escape for the living candidates at this special roll call of distinguished survivors of the Adamic default doesnt seem to fit squarely into one of the norms...sounds like death not required (like those fused) but still somewhere in the circle progression...plus whatever distinguished them. i wonder if they were given a choice or warning?

the way i read the paragraph the 1,316 associates translated along with Adam and Eve would comprise both the sleeping survivors and the living candidates...so not a lot of living candidates. correct me if i'm reading it wrongly....

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76:6.2 (853.3) They did not long rest in the oblivion of the unconscious sleep of the mortals of the realm. On the third day after Adam’s death, the second following his reverent burial, the orders of Lanaforge, sustained by the acting Most High of Edentia and concurred in by the Union of Days on Salvington, acting for Michael, were placed in Gabriel’s hands, directing the special roll call of the distinguished survivors of the Adamic default on Urantia. And in accordance with this mandate of special resurrection, number twenty-six of the Urantia series, Adam and Eve were repersonalized and reassembled in the resurrection halls of the mansion worlds of Satania together with 1,316 of their associates in the experience of the first garden. Many other loyal souls had already been translated at the time of Adam’s arrival, which was attended by a dispensational adjudication of both the sleeping survivors and of the living qualified ascenders.


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I believe that in the Ages of Life and Light, and at places such as "Morontial Temple", the Authors have indicated how when a human individual has completed his service to his world, achieved finality of perfection, these individuals will become actually "subsumed" or "enraptured" by the spiritual flame in order to leave future individuated destinies behind on Urantia, for other human individuals, and to begin the path of morontial progress.

When people cite the Book of John's Revelation, "as rapture", there is also the rational thought that accompanies this: it is called "the rapture" only by people who believe that "the kingdom of heaven is within themselves, their minds". They read his Revelation, and become spiritually enraptured, sharing the life that John Zebedee experienced in the life of the Supreme Being as a human individual, a mortal ascender. This why I think "Rapture" really describes the experiences of the "Son of Man", or Enoch, becoming the most important concept when you discuss the "exchange of nature, from being constituted into a human tabernacle, to that of a being constituted in will." That type of realisation is a precondition of Rapture, but rapture is not bound to Cristian texts solely. For instance, the Book of Enoch is part of the Bible in the Egyptian Orthodox Christian Church, but not of the Protestant or Roman Catholic Christian Church, not included in the Vulgate but included in the Piby.

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SEla_Kelly wrote:
I believe that in the Ages of Life and Light, and at places such as "Morontial Temple", the Authors have indicated how when a human individual has completed his service to his world, achieved finality of perfection, these individuals will become actually "subsumed" or "enraptured" by the spiritual flame in order to leave future individuated destinies behind on Urantia, for other human individuals, and to begin the path of morontial progress.

When people cite the Book of John's Revelation, "as rapture", there is also the rational thought that accompanies this: it is called "the rapture" only by people who believe that "the kingdom of heaven is within themselves, their minds". They read his Revelation, and become spiritually enraptured, sharing the life that John Zebedee experienced in the life of the Supreme Being as a human individual, a mortal ascender. This why I think "Rapture" really describes the experiences of the "Son of Man", or Enoch, becoming the most important concept when you discuss the "exchange of nature, from being constituted into a human tabernacle, to that of a being constituted in will." That type of realisation is a precondition of Rapture, but rapture is not bound to Cristian texts solely. For instance, the Book of Enoch is part of the Bible in the Egyptian Orthodox Christian Church, but not of the Protestant or Roman Catholic Christian Church, not included in the Vulgate but included in the Piby.


Actually Stephen the UB does not teach that translation OR fusion, either one, comes to those who have "achieved finality of perfection". Text PLEASE!!!! Fusion is not perfection but barely the beginning of our long journey of perfecting, which does NOT result in mortal perfection. Have you read the book Stephen?

Also, we begin the morontial adventure by the birth of soul which is morontial mind and existence in the material life.

Also...all the fundamentalists I have ever met, and that's a lot, being born and raised among them and trained for their pulpit, believe the rapture is related to the material kingdom of God and Heaven on Earth, much like the Apostles believed.

And Enoch is not and was not the Son of Man...a title reserved for Michael as the incarnated mortal born Jesus. Text please!!!!

So many falsifications of the Revelation in each post. Truly amazing. Can it really be accidental and mere carelessness or ignorance???!!! I wonder....

:roll:


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Makalu wrote:
the way i read the paragraph the 1,316 associates translated along with Adam and Eve would comprise both the sleeping survivors and the living candidates...so not a lot of living candidates. correct me if i'm reading it wrongly....


The reference says nothing about living people except in the last sentence which is referring to the roll calls at the beginning of the Adamic Dispensation and end of the Planetary Prince Dispensation. I believe the living at that time would have been the faithful members of the Prince's staff along with their associates, (Van and like people). I'm unable to find who the 1,316 associates of Adam and Eve in the first garden were, but there were plenty of evolutionary creatures who voluntarily served in the garden, as well as the Amadonites and some northern Nodites, all who were mortal and died.

(759.6) 67:6.3 These Amadonites were derived from the group of 144 loyal Andonites to which Amadon belonged, and who have become known by his name. This group comprised thirty-nine men and one hundred and five women. Fifty-six of this number were of immortality status, and all (except Amadon) were translated along with the loyal members of the staff. The remainder of this noble band continued on earth to the end of their mortal days under the leadership of Van and Amadon. They were the biologic leaven which multiplied and continued to furnish leadership for the world down through the long dark ages of the postrebellion era.


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55:2.3 [the midwayers and their associates recognise] "the approaching status of probable soul-Adjuster union and signify this to the destiny guardians"

I believe that actual rapture is described in tUB as follows: [55:2.4] "the “life flash” which delivers the ascension candidate from the bonds of material flesh, thereby doing for such an evolutionary mortal everything that natural death does for those who are thereby delivered from the flesh."

126:3.8 "There was one passage which particularly impressed him, a passage in which this term “Son of man” appeared. The writer of this so-called Book of Enoch went on to tell about this Son of man, describing the work he would do on earth and explaining that this Son of man, before coming down on this earth to bring salvation to mankind, had walked through the courts of heavenly glory with his Father, the Father of all; and that he had turned his back upon all this grandeur and glory to come down on earth to proclaim salvation to needy mortals. As Jesus would read these passages (well understanding that much of the Eastern mysticism which had become admixed with these teachings was erroneous), he responded in his heart and recognized in his mind that of all the Messianic predictions of the Hebrew scriptures and of all the theories about the Jewish deliverer, none was so near the truth as this story tucked away in this only partially accredited Book of Enoch."

The observence of a life flash is the truth of rapture, though it cannot be attested to by mortals of Urantia, is to say, "God has taken him." A world has the chance to look onto the departure of an individual in such selfless service, as in "the probable fusion of the post mortal." In my life, I hope to witness such occurences, but I do not know if I can describe it for you. I can just say, that the future holds this potential for all Urantians, so how is that possible, a person should learn to act in accordance with the father of all.

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katroofjebus wrote:
Makalu wrote:
the way i read the paragraph the 1,316 associates translated along with Adam and Eve would comprise both the sleeping survivors and the living candidates...so not a lot of living candidates. correct me if i'm reading it wrongly....


The reference says nothing about living people except in the last sentence which is referring to the roll calls at the beginning of the Adamic Dispensation and end of the Planetary Prince Dispensation. I believe the living at that time would have been the faithful members of the Prince's staff along with their associates, (Van and like people). I'm unable to find who the 1,316 associates of Adam and Eve in the first garden were, but there were plenty of evolutionary creatures who voluntarily served in the garden, as well as the Amadonites and some northern Nodites, all who were mortal and died.

(759.6) 67:6.3 These Amadonites were derived from the group of 144 loyal Andonites to which Amadon belonged, and who have become known by his name. This group comprised thirty-nine men and one hundred and five women. Fifty-six of this number were of immortality status, and all (except Amadon) were translated along with the loyal members of the staff. The remainder of this noble band continued on earth to the end of their mortal days under the leadership of Van and Amadon. They were the biologic leaven which multiplied and continued to furnish leadership for the world down through the long dark ages of the postrebellion era.


The loyal staff was long gone....except for 2 I think...Amadon and Van. Evidently the other loyal staff did not survive mortality by the Tree of Life. Their leaven was the same as the Nodites...a few centuries at best of active breeding prior to mortal death. Or did the loyal staff survive as did Van and Amadon for all that time?


Last edited by fanofVan on Sun Aug 18, 2019 11:57 am +0000, edited 1 time in total.

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