Urantia Book Forum

Urantia Book Discussion Board : Study Group
It is currently Tue Oct 15, 2019 1:10 pm +0000

All times are UTC - 7 hours




Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 10 posts ] 
Author Message
PostPosted:  
Offline

Joined: Sun Aug 03, 2014 5:02 am +0000
Posts: 937
Location: Brooklyn NY
Mystery Monitors (MM) mainly are referred to as a Thought Adjuster in the text. That suggests to me the primary age range of the host the mind papers concern themselves with is 20 - 40 years. However, what is little spoken of is the designation of MM for a host age 40 and upward. During this stage of the host's life, MM is referred to as Thought Controller (TC). I think henceforward I will make a conscious effort to refer to the Monitor as TC because of the fact I am over forty years old.

What does Thought Controller mean? Is it that the Monitor seeks to control the thoughts? The title, Thought Controller, implies the idea of controlling. Yet, the following revelation says to the contrary, or does it?

Quote:
110:2.3 (1205.1) The Adjuster is not trying to control your thinking...


Initially when I read this, I thought there seemed to be a contradiction between the title TC and what the above states. Now I do not think there is because the Thought Adjuster is an earlier phase of the Mystery Monitor, and during this phase, TA does not control the thoughts of its host. When the mind of the host reaches the age of discretion, I am of the opinion that that is exactly when MM begins to control the thoughts.

What are your thoughts?

_________________
BB, the Urantian Gnostic606


Top
 Profile Send private message  
Reply with quote  
PostPosted:  
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Sun Jan 22, 2012 11:16 pm +0000
Posts: 989
Location: Nanticoke NY
Well, the permeance of the Mystery Monitor, if you apply this perspective to the life of Jesus: when Jesus reached the age of thirty (30), any beyond, he had become a trustworthy companion of God, the Universal Father. By conforming to both society and the inward leadings of the individuated Fragment of the First Source and Center, we have seen how Jesus was able to become one who is self-directed. Self-directedness, and yes actual detachment from the Thought Adjuster after such a robust stage of growth and psychological development, is not only the goal of the seraphic planetary government, the spiritual administration of the third source and center: also, if young minds can develop independent habits and healthy relationships, they will become self-directed individuals, and I hold this in the capacity of every human individual to become self-directed (through inward innate guidance of the First Source and Center, the part of God that emerges in the human mind). If you become self-directed, there are many expressions, outward attributes that become more embracing to total universe possibilities, yet inwardly let it be seen if the actual purpose of such person, becomes unified: focused. As Jesus says, if my words are of my own self-gratification, and not of the father, they will become fixed finite moments of time, serving no ultimate purpose. If I direct my effort, my resources, and all of my love towards the fulfillment of God's plan in the next generation, then there is a chance I will have the privelege of being able to perform more lasting feats in the Supreme Service/Servitude. This chance is all that I can ask for, and the way that I utilize my opportunities means everything in the way I would negotiate for further proofs of why I am a good candidate to be of service unto the First Source and Center. If I know I must seek such a purpose through the Adamic Regime, through Jesus as the Door, then what the Authors of tUB are telling every human individual, about "the Mystery Monitor" who becomes "the Thought Controller" at this certain stage of psychological development, I would not want to tell anyone how that is true, or the means to which this would become possible. As there are unique destiny for every human individual, I withhold such knowledge until such times as the heart and mind of the person has awakened to the truth, that God sends his spirit into the heart of every man.

_________________
to the Underlaying Unity of All Life so that the Voice of Intuition may guide Us closer to Our Common Keeper


Top
 Profile Send private message  
Reply with quote  
PostPosted:  
Offline

Joined: Sun Mar 25, 2012 5:29 am +0000
Posts: 3738
brooklyn_born wrote:
Mystery Monitors (MM) mainly are referred to as a Thought Adjuster in the text. That suggests to me the primary age range of the host the mind papers concern themselves with is 20 - 40 years. However, what is little spoken of is the designation of MM for a host age 40 and upward. During this stage of the host's life, MM is referred to as Thought Controller (TC). I think henceforward I will make a conscious effort to refer to the Monitor as TC because of the fact I am over forty years old.

What does Thought Controller mean? Is it that the Monitor seeks to control the thoughts? The title, Thought Controller, implies the idea of controlling. Yet, the following revelation says to the contrary, or does it?

Quote:
110:2.3 (1205.1) The Adjuster is not trying to control your thinking...


Initially when I read this, I thought there seemed to be a contradiction between the title TC and what the above states. Now I do not think there is because the Thought Adjuster is an earlier phase of the Mystery Monitor, and during this phase, TA does not control the thoughts of its host. When the mind of the host reaches the age of discretion, I am of the opinion that that is exactly when MM begins to control the thoughts.

What are your thoughts?


The MM NEVER controls thoughts. Always do we have absolute free will. Not relative or partial or limited or subject-to will...but uncontrolled free will. We choose motive, intentions, priorities, directions, and make all decisions.

So BB...did you not then read Paper 110, Section 2? Please do so, for the answers to your questions are there.

Never do the God Fragments control thoughts or free will. If given our knowing consent, blessing, and request, they spiritualize our thinking "process" or spiritize the mind. They honor our thoughts and will as we mature enough to discern their presence and cooperatively respond to their guidance.

We are the captain of our ship and they are the guide and pilot who knows the way home and the shortest course there no matter where we are or the conditions of the high seas of our voyage. Captain and pilot. Two minds. Two wills. Our free will choices rule and determine prigress...and direction.


Top
 Profile Send private message  
Reply with quote  
PostPosted:  
Offline
Moderator

Joined: Sat Dec 30, 2006 9:13 am +0000
Posts: 1016
Location: Denver CO
It might be helpful to add some UB passages that talk about these three phases of God's indwelling for those reading along:

https://truthbook.com/urantia-book/paper-107-origin-and-nature-of-thought-adjusters#U107_0_7

Quote:
107:0.6 The Adjuster is an absolute essence of an infinite being imprisoned within the mind of a finite creature which, depending on the choosing of such a mortal, can eventually consummate this temporary union of God and man and veritably actualize a new order of being for unending universe service. The Adjuster is the divine universe reality which factualizes the truth that God is man's Father. The Adjuster is man's infallible cosmic compass, always and unerringly pointing the soul Godward.

107:0.7 On the evolutionary worlds, will creatures traverse three general developmental stages of being: From the arrival of the Adjuster to comparative full growth, about twenty years of age on Urantia, the Monitors are sometimes designated Thought Changers. From this time to the attainment of the age of discretion, about forty years, the Mystery Monitors are called Thought Adjusters. From the attainment of discretion to deliverance from the flesh, they are often referred to as Thought Controllers. These three phases of mortal life have no connection with the three stages of Adjuster progress in mind duplication and soul evolution.


The Spirit within - in its development within the mind of man - changes, adjusts, and controls according to the general physical age of the individual mortal. But as stated in the last sentence, "These three phases of mortal life have no connection with the three stages of Adjuster progress in mind duplication and soul evolution."

I found this three-stage explanation of soul evolution, which also may be helpful as regards Adjuster progress in soul evolution:

Quote:
1:2.3 The actuality of the existence of God is demonstrated in human experience by the indwelling of the divine presence, the spirit Monitor sent from Paradise to live in the mortal mind of man and there to assist in evolving the immortal soul of eternal survival. The presence of this divine Adjuster in the human mind is disclosed by three experiential phenomena:

1. The intellectual capacity for knowing God—God-consciousness.
2. The spiritual urge to find God—God-seeking.
3. The personality craving to be like God—the wholehearted desire to do the Father's will.


https://truthbook.com/urantia-book/paper-1-the-universal-father#U1_2_3

I found this as regards "mind duplication," here called a "counterpart.":

Quote:
13:1.22 The secrets of Ascendington include the mystery of the gradual and certain building up in the material and mortal mind of a spiritual and potentially immortal counterpart of character and identity. This phenomenon constitutes one of the most perplexing mysteries of the universes—the evolution of an immortal soul within the mind of a mortal and material creature.

https://truthbook.com/urantia-book/paper-13-the-sacred-spheres-of-paradise#U13_1_22

So - bottom line for me at least, is that these general phases of a mortal's earthly existence in 107:0.7 don't designate what the Adjuster does, but generally speaking, how most mortals interact with the Adjuster throughout a life.

The search for mind AND counterpart produces some additional food for thought about this idea, too.
https://truthbook.com/search/UBParagraphs_VSearchResult.cfm?StartRow=1&criteria=mind+AND+counterpart&newSearch=Search


Top
 Profile Send private message  
Reply with quote  
PostPosted:  
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Sun Jan 22, 2012 11:16 pm +0000
Posts: 989
Location: Nanticoke NY
fanofVan wrote:
Quote:
110:2.3 (1205.1) The Adjuster is not trying to control your thinking...



Quote:
(your) thoughts?
:

The MM NEVER controls thoughts. Always do we have absolute free will. Not relative or partial or limited or subject-to will...but uncontrolled free will. We choose motive, intentions, priorities, directions, and make all decisions.

Never do the God Fragments control thoughts or free will. If given our knowing consent, blessing, and request, they spiritualize our thinking "process" or spiritize the mind. They honor our thoughts and will as we mature enough to discern their presence and cooperatively respond to their guidance.


But the perception of the human individual is at play. What possibilities are indrawn to the mind of that human individual, what values seem most important at play, in his "decision making process". There is actually only one will: the Will of the Universal Father, and it is incumbant upon the human indvidual to see his universe service in terms of "how may I do that Will", "what is my role in this universe capacity as a mortal creature?", and "what is the proper sincere effort to make This Day"?; "how can I "go outside" and find the right Mitzvahs in my personal relationships with other human individuals"?

Again, this perspective of "two wills", as Bradley has presented, is VERY confusing. If you are the father of a family, but you observe psychopathology within your household, from other members of your own family: whoa that is your issue, too. You would not want to file a tort against your own son, but "take the plight on as your own", your thoughts are controlled by the mystery of the emerging souls of the children God gave to your custody. Incredibly wow, you must concern yourself "how is the Mystery Monitor guiding the life in the soul of that one, that human individual?" Because in all things, the human individual confronted with God's will at the crossroads when his soul longing to work things out, to go outside and devote one's work in the greatest capacity to help the community one finds home in. That is not "how can I apply 'my own will' to the situation?" but "how shall the Universal Father (the great Hero of mankind), solve this situation with maximum deference and equanamity?"

_________________
to the Underlaying Unity of All Life so that the Voice of Intuition may guide Us closer to Our Common Keeper


Top
 Profile Send private message  
Reply with quote  
PostPosted:  
Offline

Joined: Sun Mar 25, 2012 5:29 am +0000
Posts: 3738
SEla_Kelly wrote:
fanofVan wrote:
Quote:
110:2.3 (1205.1) The Adjuster is not trying to control your thinking...



Quote:
(your) thoughts?
:

The MM NEVER controls thoughts. Always do we have absolute free will. Not relative or partial or limited or subject-to will...but uncontrolled free will. We choose motive, intentions, priorities, directions, and make all decisions.

Never do the God Fragments control thoughts or free will. If given our knowing consent, blessing, and request, they spiritualize our thinking "process" or spiritize the mind. They honor our thoughts and will as we mature enough to discern their presence and cooperatively respond to their guidance.


But the perception of the human individual is at play. What possibilities are indrawn to the mind of that human individual, what values seem most important at play, in his "decision making process". There is actually only one will: the Will of the Universal Father, and it is incumbant upon the human indvidual to see his universe service in terms of "how may I do that Will", "what is my role in this universe capacity as a mortal creature?", and "what is the proper sincere effort to make This Day"?; "how can I "go outside" and find the right Mitzvahs in my personal relationships with other human individuals"?

Again, this perspective of "two wills", as Bradley has presented, is VERY confusing. If you are the father of a family, but you observe psychopathology within your household, from other members of your own family: whoa that is your issue, too. You would not want to file a tort against your own son, but "take the plight on as your own", your thoughts are controlled by the mystery of the emerging souls of the children God gave to your custody. Incredibly wow, you must concern yourself "how is the Mystery Monitor guiding the life in the soul of that one, that human individual?" Because in all things, the human individual confronted with God's will at the crossroads when his soul longing to work things out, to go outside and devote one's work in the greatest capacity to help the community one finds home in. That is not "how can I apply 'my own will' to the situation?" but "how shall the Universal Father (the great Hero of mankind), solve this situation with maximum deference and equanamity?"



Wrong, wrong, wrong...still and again. Believe what you will but you directly contradict the Revelation. There is not one will, or two...there are as many free wills as their are personalities.

Sorry you don't get it or believe it....your problem.


Last edited by fanofVan on Sun Jun 30, 2019 9:03 am +0000, edited 1 time in total.

Top
 Profile Send private message  
Reply with quote  
PostPosted:  
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Sun Jan 22, 2012 11:16 pm +0000
Posts: 989
Location: Nanticoke NY
Okay so now you are saying there are infinite wills. Maybe there are in fact infinite personalities of final perfected Beings and Creators. However what you are saying, to me, is like thinking "oh I do not need to fill my snazzy Ford Van at the Station like everyone else." "I have a will of my own". "I do not need to draw from Paradise, in order to experience God's Love." hahaha okay but we have both stated our view so I will leave this to the consideration of others.

_________________
to the Underlaying Unity of All Life so that the Voice of Intuition may guide Us closer to Our Common Keeper


Top
 Profile Send private message  
Reply with quote  
PostPosted:  
Offline

Joined: Sun Mar 25, 2012 5:29 am +0000
Posts: 3738
SEla_Kelly wrote:
Okay so now you are saying there are infinite wills. Maybe there are in fact infinite personalities of final perfected Beings and Creators. However what you are saying, to me, is like thinking "oh I do not need to fill my snazzy Ford Van at the Station like everyone else." "I have a will of my own". "I do not need to draw from Paradise, in order to experience God's Love." hahaha okay but we have both stated our view so I will leave this to the consideration of others.


Nope. Every personality has free will...not just perfect or perfected but also all perfecting and imperfect as well.

This is not difficult....but it is elementary. :roll:


Top
 Profile Send private message  
Reply with quote  
PostPosted:  
Offline

Joined: Wed Feb 20, 2019 12:11 pm +0000
Posts: 772
It is my understanding that as we age and mature, a Thought Controller can more easily administer to the thinking processes of an individual. The more routine engagement of wisdom by a "normal" mind allows for better thought processing mechanics reaching up from the lower mind. And also, having greater experience within the individual mind, the Thought Adjuster develops better processing techniques for reaching down from the higher mind.

The Thought Controller does not control individual thoughts, but has greater leverage over thought mechanisms in terms of discovery, recognition and interpretation – spiritual insight. It's not only what one thinks, but also how one thinks that matters. The Thought Controller is better adept at "improving, modifying, adjusting and coordinating" thought processes.

(1205.1) 110:2.3 The Adjuster is not trying to control your thinking, as such, but rather to spiritualize it, to eternalize it. Neither angels nor Adjusters are devoted directly to influencing human thought; that is your exclusive personality prerogative. The Adjusters are dedicated to improving, modifying, adjusting, and co-ordinating your thinking processes; but more especially and specifically they are devoted to the work of building up spiritual counterparts of your careers, morontia transcripts of your true advancing selves, for survival purposes.


Top
 Profile Send private message  
Reply with quote  
PostPosted:  
Offline

Joined: Wed Sep 12, 2012 2:07 am +0000
Posts: 931
Another possibility at what is being explained, of which we unfortunately have no further information by the revelators, is that general character of the operation of the Mystery Monitor changes in our experience as we age. Even from the beginning the adjuster drops its morontial and spiritual seeds into the super-consciousness of its host. But the host is so very unfamiliar with those seeds that its mind makes so very little correspondence and connection of those seeds to its own thoughts.

But with increasing familiarity, even in the super-consciousness, there becomes more and more association between those adjuster seeds and the thoughts, concepts, notions, visions, values, etc., of normal consciousness. The host doesn't necessarily choose the thoughts, concepts, etc., that are better associated with the adjuster's messages, but the potential association is much stronger at more advanced ages.


Top
 Profile Send private message  
Reply with quote  
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 10 posts ] 

All times are UTC - 7 hours


Who is online

Registered users: Google [Bot]


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You can post attachments in this forum

Search for:
Jump to:  
Powered by phpBB® Forum Software © phpBB Group