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Makalu wrote:
uh huh...that's a stretch to say the least. the danger here is clear...ya might just want to take a peek at some of the evangelical political groups and their ideas about separation of church and state not being constitutional. or file your answer under #2


Are the evangelicals proposing a theocracy? What about Sharia Law?

And if climate change is the new religion, how is this constitutional? Concern for the planet seems to exclude its human inhabitants. Human caused climate change alleges that humans are a malevolent infestation. Being good stewards of the Earth does not mean that human progress is to be sacrificed. Human caused climate change requires belief and faith that the proper actions of penance will redeem man and save the planet. Sacrifice, belief, faith, self loathing; sound like a good old time religion.


103:7.7 What both developing science and religion need is more searching and fearless self-criticism, a greater awareness of incompleteness in evolutionary status. The teachers of both science and religion are often altogether too self-confident and dogmatic. Science and religion can only be self-critical of their facts. The moment departure is made from the stage of facts, reason abdicates or else rapidly degenerates into a consort of false logic.


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yes, the dominionists and christian reconstructivists propose types of theocracies.

climate change isn't the new religion and separation of church and state has nothing to do with climate change no matter how much you try to make it fit your predictable agenda

i planted a wandering jew next to your creeping sharia


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Climate change is a change in the usual weather found in a place. TUB says that religion is a faith-trust in the goodness of God.

toto wrote:
And if climate change is the new religion


Wait, what? You need to sit back and examine your assumptions because this makes no sense whatsoever.


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Sure it does. If you believe in the dogma of "climate change" you are believing in it no different than you believe in a religion.

Except, it's "science".

What's with all the scare mongering and worry? The climate changes. It's been doing it since the beginning. No science can prove man influences it. Because it is changing as we speak. It's like the moon following you while you're driving your car. Chicken and egg.


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first he says climate change is a dogmatic belief...then he says it's a natural phenomenon. a while back he said the science is phony but he can't prove it because he's not a scientist...now he says the science is incapable of knowing (him knowing so much about science)

the only consistent thing is the agenda...doesnt matter if you lose all credibility twisting reality to fit the agenda. must think we're stupid to not see this plain as day....


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nodAmanaV wrote:
Sure it does. If you believe in the dogma of "climate change" you are believing in it no different than you believe in a religion.



I believe in the dogma that the sun rises every morning. Does that make me a sun worshipper?


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toto (Louis, Manny, loucol, JohnnyBones...the one eyed posse!) says: "...if climate change is the new religion...." as though this were a self evident fact rather than a fantasy of his own creation. If? If to whom? And the sidekick responds, in support, that any belief in any fact, fiction, or supposition is "religious" as his "contribution" to fallacy. toto has said that reading a book or believing one to be factual is idolatry. So this is quite a brain trust indeed!! Certainly a clear, concise, and well balanced perception of reality....not!

Does climate change drive others to such distraction or just those who profit from pollution...and Heckle and Jeckle of course? And how is it related to constitutionality? The pup from Kansas seems to be excusing acid rain, polluted ground water, Bejing air, strip mining, nuclear bomb testing, chemical dumping, et al as somehow demonstrating the human's rights of plunder and of being "good stewards" rather than foolish, shortsighted, and greed based human activities. So "green" technologies that deliver renewable energies at a lower cost and more universal access is unconstitutional religion? Forget all the practical results. By the way, the UB considers carbon dioxide a greenhouse gas if you're interested and warns about its dangers to humans as well: http://www.urantia.org/search/book_search/dioxide

Isn't renewable and clean energy progressive? Isn't coal and oil and carbon burning NOT progressive? It's had a good run and been of immeasurable assistance in PRIOR progress and will still have many useful applications to come but it is obvious who is obsessed with "carbon" here. So the charts of a century of carbon dioxide in the air rising precisely in conjunction with the tonnage of CO2 released by coal and oil burning and auto emissions is a fantasy or lie/conspiracy foisted upon us for a century by those geeks who measure this in ice and trees and air? And they are a conspiracy, a religious one evidently, determined to .....what? Find a new form of tax? What government needs any scientist to provide an excuse for or means of a form of new tax?

Crazy town is in full swing...yahoo...and yet another rabbit hole where up is down and the yak yak yak has nothing, still, to do with the topic. Perhaps if 50.1% of the population in a democracy says the climate is changing then it would be "constitutional"? Perhaps constitutionally religious? Perplexing. Nonsensical. Weird.
:roll:


Last edited by fanofVan on Wed Dec 21, 2016 3:07 pm +0000, edited 2 times in total.

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Agon D. Onter wrote:
nodAmanaV wrote:
Sure it does. If you believe in the dogma of "climate change" you are believing in it no different than you believe in a religion.



I believe in the dogma that the sun rises every morning. Does that make me a sun worshipper?


Yes...very primitive one too....the sun does not rise you know....hahahahha! :shock: 8)


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Not to worry. We have real leaders now who will straighten it out. Pendulum is swinging back to center. Good.


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fanofVan wrote:
toto (Louis, Manny, loucol, JohnnyBones...the one eyed posse!) says: "...if climate change is the new religion...." as though this were a self evident fact rather than a fantasy of his own creation. If? If to whom? And the sidekick responds, in support, that any belief in any fact, fiction, or supposition is "religious" as his "contribution" to fallacy. toto has said that reading a book or believing one to be factual is idolatry. So this is quite a brain trust indeed!! Certainly a clear, concise, and well balanced perception of reality....not!


I see that you ran out of nice things to say. You may genuflect to to any science you wish, it won't bother me.


fanofVan wrote:
Does climate change drive others to such distraction or just those who profit from pollution...and Heckle and Jeckle of course?


No, just those of the Chicken Little variety.

fanofVan wrote:
By the way, the UB considers carbon dioxide a greenhouse gas if you're interested and warns about its dangers to humans as well:


Is it dangerous to the super breathers? I tried to find "greenhouse" in TUB and could not. Did you have an equal and opposite reaction to the scientist's warning of a new ice age in the early 1970s, or did you have faith that they could fix it given enough money? Idolatry is a slippery slope for those who are prone to engaging in it.


fanofVan wrote:
Isn't renewable and clean energy progressive? Isn't coal and oil and carbon burning NOT progressive?


I suppose that clean energy can get you to jump and psychic circle or two, if you believe hard enough.


fanofVan wrote:
So the charts of a century of carbon dioxide in the air rising precisely in conjunction with the tonnage of CO2 released by coal and oil burning and auto emissions is a fantasy or lie/conspiracy foisted upon us for a century by those geeks who measure this in ice and trees and air?


I love charts. You can fool anyone with a good chart. Did you not study the carbon cycle in biology class? You can find anything if you look for it. I depends on where, when and how you measure. You can make a case for any eventuality, even those pesky paradoxes.


fanofVan wrote:
Crazy town is in full swing...yahoo...and yet another rabbit hole where up is down and the yak yak yak has nothing, still, to do with the topic. Perhaps if 50.1% of the population in a democracy says the climate is changing then it would be "constitutional"? Perhaps constitutionally religious? Perplexing. Nonsensical. Weird.


Worse. This is getting tiresome and old. But if you have anything nice to say, I'd be glad to hear from you. Remember that it is a friendly Universe. It would be even friendlier if you gave it a try.


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Has someone said the sky is falling? Missed it. I thought the carbon tax was the sky falling alert? Hmmm....

I am not the one alarmed by or impatient with evolutionary progress through the mortal epochs or obsessed by politics of the very local and recent variety. Of conspiracies and idolatries, you are the vocal expert.

Some of those lying and misleading charts and all those who must be in collusion...those crooked scientists!!

https://www.bing.com/images/search?q=ca ... &FORM=IGRE

The one about CO2 emissions falling recently as coal fired electric plants got replaced by nuclear and natural gas fired plants is a compelling, if conspiratorial demonstration of how humans are not the latest and greatest source of air pollution for two centuries. Of course not. Stupid science!

Pollution deniers, defenders, and advocates....truly amazing. I'm no tree hugger but I do like clean air and water regardless of pollution's effect on climate (there actually is an effect on air and water purity, right?)! I suppose taking lead out of gasoline and paint was based on this same crazy and crooked form of science? Those incompetent rascals!

It's not really friendly to molly coddle crazy....sort of like false sympathy....those who suffer by their own hand and perceptions and myopia are free to do so....just don't come to a UB study group and deny reality....please. And also take over every single topic begun for month after month with the same old nonsense....which seldom if ever has anything to do with the actual topic under discussion....rude and self important.

:roll:


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I am confused by the idea that there need to be political parties (caucus) invovled with democracy or any government? The principle is incorrect.

What is inherently your reason for being upset about democracy? I think it is because of the inability to form consensus.

Agon D. Onter's point about Representatives and Democracy is important; we have some deferential towards those with wisdom and experience.

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to the Underlaying Unity of All Life so that the Voice of Intuition may guide Us closer to Our Common Keeper


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fanofVan wrote:
Has someone said the sky is falling? Missed it.


A metaphor for the crisis yellers.

fanofVan wrote:
I thought the carbon tax was the sky falling alert? Hmmm....


No not really. This one they head faked and called it like it is.


fanofVan wrote:
I am not the one alarmed by or impatient with evolutionary progress through the mortal epochs or obsessed by politics of the very local and recent variety.


Well, that is a good thing. Then why are you so upset? If I am so wrong, then you can be all the more right.


fanofVan wrote:
Of conspiracies and idolatries, you are the vocal expert.


You bet yah. But you left out hypocrisies and vagaries. I sniff them out a mile away.


fanofVan wrote:
Some of those lying and misleading charts and all those who must be in collusion...those crooked scientists!!


On that we agree. At least we can see our tax dollars at work. Nice graphics!


fanofVan wrote:
The one about CO2 emissions falling recently as coal fired electric plants got replaced by nuclear and natural gas fired plants is a compelling, if conspiratorial demonstration of how humans are not the latest and greatest source of air pollution for two centuries. Of course not. Stupid science!


It was due to a reduction in cow flatulence. The great Vegan movement of the twentieth century partnered with PETA. The red scare; communism, red meat, and the crimson tide.

fanofVan wrote:
Pollution deniers, defenders, and advocates....truly amazing. I'm no tree hugger but I do like clean air and water regardless of pollution's effect on climate (there actually is an effect on air and water purity, right?)!


And then there are those who do not like clean water or clean air. These pollution advocates conspire to create a toxic environment. These are despicable people.


fanofVan wrote:
I suppose taking lead out of gasoline and paint was based on this same crazy and crooked form of science? Those incompetent rascals!


It's the least they can do since they put the lead in there in the first place. Maybe they conspired to experiment on the affects of lead on people.

fanofVan wrote:
It's not really friendly to molly coddle crazy....sort of like false sympathy....those who suffer by their own hand and perceptions and myopia are free to do so....


Have you no compassion for the crazy? Do you suffer by the hands off others and other's perceptions and myopia? You seem quite angry at me, it seems, and yet you say that I am free to be me.

fanofVan wrote:
just don't come to a UB study group and deny reality....please.


Very angry and controlling, but you are free to be that if you like. Can anyone disagree with you and survive your wrath?

fanofVan wrote:
And also take over every single topic begun for month after month with the same old nonsense....which seldom if ever has anything to do with the actual topic under discussion....rude and self important.


It seems that I cannot express an opinion without being called rude and self-important. Anyone who is not on the same page as you is spewing nonsense. Are you one of those angry white men they keep talking about?

I suggest that you PM the administration to petition to remove me. I am trying to be better but you just won't have it. But don't speak on this forum of a friendly universe because it will sound hypocritical coming from you.


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Bradly,

(130:7.2) When Ganid inquired what one could do to make friends, having noticed that the majority of persons whom they chanced to meet were attracted to Jesus, his teacher said: "Become interested in your fellows; learn how to love them and watch for the opportunity to do something for them which you are sure they want done," and then he quoted the olden Jewish proverb—"A man who would have friends must show himself friendly."


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Agon D. Onter wrote:
Riktare, the title of this thread is "democracy misunderstood". Which meaning of 'democracy' do you think is misunderstood? Or are you referring to the typical confusion surrounding the multiple meanings of that word?


Well, a large part of the news I get is from Swedish journalists. As you may or may not know, Sweden has grown a particular socialistic, political viewpoint or paradigm for at least several decades. One item from that viewpoint is more or less that all people should be the same. No one person or group should stick out as receiving higher or lower pay, better or worse benefits, getting higher or lower grades in school, etc., The EU has done likewise, though not to the intensity of the movement in Sweden. We are clearly currently seeing a collision between proponents of that paradigm and people who want more practical, realistic ways of acknowledging and dealing with problems. The situation seems similar in both the U.S. and in Europe where the wisdom and practicality of many hyper liberal policies are called into question.

Apparently the leaders and proponents of this decades old political paradigm feel that the implementation of such policies is what represents "democracy". A possible rationale for that is that both in Sweden and in the EU they have often formed blocks where they become the controlling majority. Possibly another rationale is the interpretation of the First Amendment of the Constitution of the U.S. which states "all men are created equal". Across the world, the Constitution of the U.S. may be the object that most exemplifies "democracy".

Until recently, nearly all Swedish journalists were effectively card carrying members of various groups that base their reason to live on such a socialistic, political viewpoint. The fanaticism involved does approach the fervor of a quasi-religious organization. So it has been rather typical for them to cite politicians or others who proclaim that "democracy" demands such and such an action when of course is it rather that their particular political orientation that demands such and such an action.


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