Urantia Book Forum

Urantia Book Discussion Board : Study Group
It is currently Sat Aug 24, 2019 11:53 am +0000

All times are UTC - 7 hours




Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 25 posts ]  Go to page 1, 2  Next
Author Message
PostPosted:  
Offline

Joined: Sun Jan 27, 2008 3:03 am +0000
Posts: 2134
It's not to scale, of course, and intended to be more a chart than a map. Please feel free to critique it, share it, make a better one.

It's based on these UB quotes:

...The first task was the building of the brick wall across the neck of the peninsula. This once completed, the real work of landscape beautification and home building could proceed unhindered.

A zoological garden was created by building a smaller wall just outside the main wall; the intervening space, occupied by all manner of wild beasts, served as an additional defense against hostile attacks. This menagerie was organized in twelve grand divisions, and walled paths led between these groups to the twelve gates of the Garden, the river and its adjacent pastures occupying the central area.

At the center of the Edenic peninsula was the exquisite stone temple of the Universal Father, the sacred shrine of the Garden. To the north the administrative headquarters was established; to the south were built the homes for the workers and their families; to the west was provided the allotment of ground for the proposed schools of the educational system of the expected Son, while in the “east of Eden” were built the domiciles intended for the promised Son and his immediate offspring. The architectural plans for Eden provided homes and abundant land for one million human beings.

At the time of Adam’s arrival, though the Garden was only one-fourth finished, it had thousands of miles of irrigation ditches and more than twelve thousand miles of paved paths and roads. There were a trifle over five thousand brick buildings in the various sectors, and the trees and plants were almost beyond number. Seven was the largest number of houses composing any one cluster in the park. And though the structures of the Garden were simple, they were most artistic. The roads and paths were well built, and the landscaping was exquisite.

About five per cent of the Garden was under high artificial cultivation, fifteen per cent partially cultivated, the remainder being left in a more or less natural state pending the arrival of Adam, it being thought best to finish the park in accordance with his ideas.

In the center of the Garden temple Van planted the long-guarded tree of life, whose leaves were for the “healing of the nations,” and whose fruit had so long sustained him on earth. Van well knew that Adam and Eve would also be dependent on this gift of Edentia for their life maintenance after they once appeared on Urantia in material form.

Quote source/much more: https://www.urantia.org/urantia-book-st ... arden-eden


Attachments:
EDEN MAP FOR TB.png
EDEN MAP FOR TB.png [ 184.97 KiB | Viewed 2653 times ]
Top
 Profile Send private message  
Reply with quote  
PostPosted:  
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Sun Jan 22, 2012 11:16 pm +0000
Posts: 931
Location: Nanticoke NY
73:3.1 "a long narrow peninsula—almost an island—projecting westward from the eastern shores of the Mediterranean Sea."
73:3.3 (823.3) This Mediterranean peninsula had a salubrious climate and an equable temperature; this stabilized weather was due to the encircling mountains and to the fact that this area was virtually an island in an inland sea. While it rained copiously on the surrounding highlands, it seldom rained in Eden proper. But each night, from the extensive network of artificial irrigation channels, a “mist would go up” to refresh the vegetation of the Garden.
I believe you have shown this accurately.

74:6.1 The Adamic family grounds embraced a little over five square miles. Immediately surrounding this homesite, provision had been made for the care of more than three hundred thousand of the pure-line offspring. But only the first unit of the projected buildings was ever constructed.

73:3.4 (823.4) The coast line of this land mass was considerably elevated, and the neck connecting with the mainland was only twenty-seven miles wide at the narrowest point. The great river that watered the Garden came down from the higher lands of the peninsula and flowed east through the peninsular neck to the mainland and thence across the lowlands of Mesopotamia to the sea beyond. It was fed by four tributaries which took origin in the coastal hills of the Edenic peninsula, and these are the “four heads” of the river which “went out of Eden,” and which later became confused with the branches of the rivers surrounding the second garden.
The question is about whether the hills of Eden peninsula of Urantia extended along the westward coastal area. I believe that if it is true that there were hills along this region, then the structure of the tributaries would appear differently, except in the eastern section of your diagram. Especially I think that two of the tributaries would originate from a more central northerly and southerly locality.

73:3.5-6The dominant idea was to be the glorification of horticulture and the exaltation of agriculture.
The site chosen for the Garden was probably the most beautiful spot of its kind in all the world, and the climate was then ideal. Nowhere else was there a location which could have lent itself so perfectly to becoming such a paradise of botanic expression. In this rendezvous the cream of the civilization of Urantia was forgathering. Without and beyond, the world lay in darkness, ignorance, and savagery. Eden was the one bright spot on Urantia; it was naturally a dream of loveliness, and it soon became a poem of exquisite and perfected landscape glory.

73:4.3 A zoological garden was created by building a smaller wall just outside the main wall; the intervening space, occupied by all manner of wild beasts, served as an additional defense against hostile attacks. This menagerie was organized in twelve grand divisions, and walled paths led between these groups to the twelve gates of the Garden, the river and its adjacent pastures occupying the central area.
In your diagram you show that these 12 divisions are stacked in long East-West sections, whereas I had imagined them as being stacked in long North-South sections. I do not see evidence to agree with your perspective here., so I am offering a second perspective.

73:5.5 By the time of Adam’s arrival most of the plants of that section of the world were growing in Eden. Already had many of the fruits, cereals, and nuts been greatly improved. Many modern vegetables and cereals were first cultivated here, but scores of varieties of food plants were subsequently lost to the world.
Would it be possible that some of these seeds or clonable plant material, exists preserved in the ruins of Eden?

73:5.2 At the time of Adam’s arrival, though the Garden was only one-fourth finished, it had thousands of miles of irrigation ditches and more than twelve thousand miles of paved paths and roads. There were a trifle over five thousand brick buildings in the various sectors, and the trees and plants were almost beyond number. Seven was the largest number of houses composing any one cluster in the park. And though the structures of the Garden were simple, they were most artistic. The roads and paths were well built, and the landscaping was exquisite.
It would be difficult to imagine the concourse of these infrastructures. I accept that you have ommitted these detail from your diagram. However let us imagine that these paths were suited from the resources of the land, perhaps of fine simple cobblery.

_________________
to the Underlaying Unity of All Life so that the Voice of Intuition may guide Us closer to Our Common Keeper


Top
 Profile Send private message  
Reply with quote  
PostPosted:  
Offline

Joined: Wed Oct 17, 2018 4:14 pm +0000
Posts: 210
Location: Left Coast
curious if anyone knows when the straights gave way and the Mediterranean basin flooded???


Top
 Profile Send private message  
Reply with quote  
PostPosted:  
Online

Joined: Sun Mar 25, 2012 5:29 am +0000
Posts: 3564
no sophist wrote:
curious if anyone knows when the straights gave way and the Mediterranean basin flooded???


See 73:7.1

8)


Top
 Profile Send private message  
Reply with quote  
PostPosted:  
Offline

Joined: Wed Oct 17, 2018 4:14 pm +0000
Posts: 210
Location: Left Coast
fanofVan wrote:
no sophist wrote:
curious if anyone knows when the straights gave way and the Mediterranean basin flooded???


See 73:7.1

8)


Thx.
Platos Atlantis possibly.
Loved the book - discovery of Atlantis Robert Sarmast.


Top
 Profile Send private message  
Reply with quote  
PostPosted:  
Online
Moderator

Joined: Sat Dec 30, 2006 9:13 am +0000
Posts: 984
Location: Denver CO
Rick, thank you...very nice graphic. It's good to be able to visualize this place, which must have been magnificent.

MaryJo


Top
 Profile Send private message  
Reply with quote  
PostPosted:  
Offline

Joined: Sun Jan 27, 2008 3:03 am +0000
Posts: 2134
Thanks Sela,

For the comprehensive critique. My impression is that Eden proper was surrounded by mountains, all around.

Another reader pointed out the probable convergence of the 'four heads' much closer to the west end, as you have. I agree, and plan a re-do. And will keep all your goodly points in mind.

PS. After looking at geological maps and comparing the text, I have to think (speculate) Cyprus is part of Eden re-arisen. It's west end is a great mountainous area. Two crustal plates squeeze and relax that region, the second most seismically active.

PSS. Please elaborate on your last paragraph, the one using 'concourse' and 'cobblery'.


SEla_Kelly wrote:
73:3.1 "a long narrow peninsula—almost an island—projecting westward from the eastern shores of the Mediterranean Sea."
73:3.3 (823.3) This Mediterranean peninsula had a salubrious climate and an equable temperature; this stabilized weather was due to the encircling mountains and to the fact that this area was virtually an island in an inland sea. While it rained copiously on the surrounding highlands, it seldom rained in Eden proper. But each night, from the extensive network of artificial irrigation channels, a “mist would go up” to refresh the vegetation of the Garden.
I believe you have shown this accurately.

74:6.1 The Adamic family grounds embraced a little over five square miles. Immediately surrounding this homesite, provision had been made for the care of more than three hundred thousand of the pure-line offspring. But only the first unit of the projected buildings was ever constructed.

73:3.4 (823.4) The coast line of this land mass was considerably elevated, and the neck connecting with the mainland was only twenty-seven miles wide at the narrowest point. The great river that watered the Garden came down from the higher lands of the peninsula and flowed east through the peninsular neck to the mainland and thence across the lowlands of Mesopotamia to the sea beyond. It was fed by four tributaries which took origin in the coastal hills of the Edenic peninsula, and these are the “four heads” of the river which “went out of Eden,” and which later became confused with the branches of the rivers surrounding the second garden.
The question is about whether the hills of Eden peninsula of Urantia extended along the westward coastal area. I believe that if it is true that there were hills along this region, then the structure of the tributaries would appear differently, except in the eastern section of your diagram. Especially I think that two of the tributaries would originate from a more central northerly and southerly locality.

73:3.5-6The dominant idea was to be the glorification of horticulture and the exaltation of agriculture.
The site chosen for the Garden was probably the most beautiful spot of its kind in all the world, and the climate was then ideal. Nowhere else was there a location which could have lent itself so perfectly to becoming such a paradise of botanic expression. In this rendezvous the cream of the civilization of Urantia was forgathering. Without and beyond, the world lay in darkness, ignorance, and savagery. Eden was the one bright spot on Urantia; it was naturally a dream of loveliness, and it soon became a poem of exquisite and perfected landscape glory.

73:4.3 A zoological garden was created by building a smaller wall just outside the main wall; the intervening space, occupied by all manner of wild beasts, served as an additional defense against hostile attacks. This menagerie was organized in twelve grand divisions, and walled paths led between these groups to the twelve gates of the Garden, the river and its adjacent pastures occupying the central area.
In your diagram you show that these 12 divisions are stacked in long East-West sections, whereas I had imagined them as being stacked in long North-South sections. I do not see evidence to agree with your perspective here., so I am offering a second perspective.

73:5.5 By the time of Adam’s arrival most of the plants of that section of the world were growing in Eden. Already had many of the fruits, cereals, and nuts been greatly improved. Many modern vegetables and cereals were first cultivated here, but scores of varieties of food plants were subsequently lost to the world.
Would it be possible that some of these seeds or clonable plant material, exists preserved in the ruins of Eden?

73:5.2 At the time of Adam’s arrival, though the Garden was only one-fourth finished, it had thousands of miles of irrigation ditches and more than twelve thousand miles of paved paths and roads. There were a trifle over five thousand brick buildings in the various sectors, and the trees and plants were almost beyond number. Seven was the largest number of houses composing any one cluster in the park. And though the structures of the Garden were simple, they were most artistic. The roads and paths were well built, and the landscaping was exquisite.
It would be difficult to imagine the concourse of these infrastructures. I accept that you have ommitted these detail from your diagram. However let us imagine that these paths were suited from the resources of the land, perhaps of fine simple cobblery.


Top
 Profile Send private message  
Reply with quote  
PostPosted:  
Offline

Joined: Sun Jan 27, 2008 3:03 am +0000
Posts: 2134
maryjo606 wrote:
Rick, thank you...very nice graphic. It's good to be able to visualize this place, which must have been magnificent.

MaryJo


Thanks MaryJo. Yes, visuals help me too, makes it more real and fleshes out unthought-of details. Too bad it only lasted 120 years. :(


Top
 Profile Send private message  
Reply with quote  
PostPosted:  
Online
Moderator

Joined: Sat Dec 30, 2006 9:13 am +0000
Posts: 984
Location: Denver CO
One feature of that original Garden that I always liked was its use of the zoological area that restricted the wild beasts and used them as a defense against invaders...a very wise thing to do! And what a difference from how we conserve these beasts today - the few that are left, that is.

Here in Colorado, there is a nature preserve out on the eastern plains in Keenesburg: "A 9793 acre refuge for more than 500 Lions, Tigers, Bears, Wolves and other rescued large carnivores..." On this preserve, the humans are allowed to visit via a raised walkway that allows the animals to be observed - but the animals are not caged. Rather, the visitor walkway IS caged. Other zoos are, to me, very sad examples of the wrong way to conserve this kind of wildlife...I like how, in the Garden, they still could be free - relatively.

Just a little tidbit of info inspired by your map...I wonder how many acres comprised the Garden's "zoo?"

Thanks again, Rick...


Top
 Profile Send private message  
Reply with quote  
PostPosted:  
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Sun Jan 22, 2012 11:16 pm +0000
Posts: 931
Location: Nanticoke NY
There is not much to elaborate. The circumstances seem to imply the type of resources available to the Amadonite colony. Stones & Trees, and various types of Mud or Mortar. These were the resources they used to build, combined with a degree of precision and ingenuity. The cultivation implies growth of plants which would later fuse into some of the structures, or be used as renewable construction material. What would it require, for the irrigation system to live up to the hype of the sanitary regulations of this city? It would have to be separated channels for fresh water and perhaps the waste would run into the river. The Roman Civilization exemplifies the type of cobblery and stone-laying necessary to maintain such infrastructure as irrigations. I have no real imagination of the place you are trying to depict. When I try to imagine it, I think of glowing crystals inside the earth, that enhance the chemistry of the soils, and a real connection between the life of the land and humanity. 12,000 miles must have been condensed into an intricate network, with a few stone-arched bridges. Then there is the overgrowth of the fruitful things that were not mentioned as growing in the garden of Eden in the Bible. The truth is that 15% cultivation is a promising figure for any city-state with the intention of self-sufficiency. Many of the additional paths would be part of the garden design itself: demarcating the sections where one species of nuts grows, from sunny meadows. There were spaces perhaps where the growth intentionally promoted the gathering of birds. And also the fandors existed during those times. You can imagine that the best scientists of botany would have analysed the interaction between plant-propagation, and bird migratory and dietary behaviour. This promotes the theory that in such salubrius climate, what the Urantia Book considers full cultivation would rate as the highest yield potential by the modern standards. Much of the land would be dense forest, and much of the fruit may have had to have fallen down before it was gathered. I think that full cultivation implies that all of the available dirt has been connected to the roots of plants, and that those plants were intentionally planted or left to stand.

The coastal mountains would be like one long ridge, with a steep slope on the outside and a gradual slope on the inside, perhaps of a crescent moon shaped, with 50kmx40km elliptoidindal shaping.

_________________
to the Underlaying Unity of All Life so that the Voice of Intuition may guide Us closer to Our Common Keeper


Top
 Profile Send private message  
Reply with quote  
PostPosted:  
Offline

Joined: Sun Jan 27, 2008 3:03 am +0000
Posts: 2134
maryjo606 wrote:
One feature of that original Garden that I always liked was its use of the zoological area that restricted the wild beasts and used them as a defense against invaders...a very wise thing to do! And what a difference from how we conserve these beasts today - the few that are left, that is.

Here in Colorado, there is a nature preserve out on the eastern plains in Keenesburg: "A 9793 acre refuge for more than 500 Lions, Tigers, Bears, Wolves and other rescued large carnivores..." On this preserve, the humans are allowed to visit via a raised walkway that allows the animals to be observed - but the animals are not caged. Rather, the visitor walkway IS caged. Other zoos are, to me, very sad examples of the wrong way to conserve this kind of wildlife...I like how, in the Garden, they still could be free - relatively.

Just a little tidbit of info inspired by your map...I wonder how many acres comprised the Garden's "zoo?"

Thanks again, Rick...


Thanks MaryJo. Like the idea of having caged promenades for zoo visitors!

We know the neck was 27 miles wide, but this "just outside" wording makes the zoo-barrier sound rather narrow, eh?

...A zoological garden was created by building a smaller wall just outside the main wall; the intervening space, occupied by all manner of wild beasts, served as an additional defense against hostile attacks. 73:4.3 (824.2)


Top
 Profile Send private message  
Reply with quote  
PostPosted:  
Offline

Joined: Sun Jan 27, 2008 3:03 am +0000
Posts: 2134
SEla_Kelly wrote:
There is not much to elaborate. The circumstances seem to imply the type of resources available to the Amadonite colony. Stones & Trees, and various types of Mud or Mortar. These were the resources they used to build, combined with a degree of precision and ingenuity. The cultivation implies growth of plants which would later fuse into some of the structures, or be used as renewable construction material. What would it require, for the irrigation system to live up to the hype of the sanitary regulations of this city? It would have to be separated channels for fresh water and perhaps the waste would run into the river. The Roman Civilization exemplifies the type of cobblery and stone-laying necessary to maintain such infrastructure as irrigations. I have no real imagination of the place you are trying to depict. When I try to imagine it, I think of glowing crystals inside the earth, that enhance the chemistry of the soils, and a real connection between the life of the land and humanity. 12,000 miles must have been condensed into an intricate network, with a few stone-arched bridges. Then there is the overgrowth of the fruitful things that were not mentioned as growing in the garden of Eden in the Bible. The truth is that 15% cultivation is a promising figure for any city-state with the intention of self-sufficiency. Many of the additional paths would be part of the garden design itself: demarcating the sections where one species of nuts grows, from sunny meadows. There were spaces perhaps where the growth intentionally promoted the gathering of birds. And also the fandors existed during those times. You can imagine that the best scientists of botany would have analysed the interaction between plant-propagation, and bird migratory and dietary behaviour. This promotes the theory that in such salubrius climate, what the Urantia Book considers full cultivation would rate as the highest yield potential by the modern standards. Much of the land would be dense forest, and much of the fruit may have had to have fallen down before it was gathered. I think that full cultivation implies that all of the available dirt has been connected to the roots of plants, and that those plants were intentionally planted or left to stand.

The coastal mountains would be like one long ridge, with a steep slope on the outside and a gradual slope on the inside, perhaps of a crescent moon shaped, with 50kmx40km elliptoidindal shaping.


Enjoyed and appreciate your speculations. And agree about a ridge of encircling mountains. Seems Eden proper was a long, low, bowl in shape.


Top
 Profile Send private message  
Reply with quote  
PostPosted:  
Offline

Joined: Wed Sep 12, 2012 2:07 am +0000
Posts: 921
SEla_Kelly wrote:
73:4.3 A zoological garden was created by building a smaller wall just outside the main wall; the intervening space, occupied by all manner of wild beasts, served as an additional defense against hostile attacks. This menagerie was organized in twelve grand divisions, and walled paths led between these groups to the twelve gates of the Garden, the river and its adjacent pastures occupying the central area.
In your diagram you show that these 12 divisions are stacked in long East-West sections, whereas I had imagined them as being stacked in long North-South sections. I do not see evidence to agree with your perspective here., so I am offering a second perspective.



I imagine that the 12 grand divisions were not laid out in block fashion but conform to some extent to the random, irregular effect of the mentioned menagerie.


Top
 Profile Send private message  
Reply with quote  
PostPosted:  
Offline

Joined: Sun Jan 27, 2008 3:03 am +0000
Posts: 2134
Riktare wrote:
I imagine that the 12 grand divisions were not laid out in block fashion but conform to some extent to the random, irregular effect of the mentioned menagerie.


Thanks, Riktare, interesting imagining it...The reasoning behind laying the 12 divisions in parallel, was the 12 gates on the inner wall, and the fact that each division could be two miles wide or more (27 miles total). It's noteworthy Solonia uses the words 'just outside', when referring to the outer wall. That means the east-west length of the zoos maybe only a few hundred meters, with walkways in between each, leading to gates.

Quote:
73:4.3 (824.2) A zoological garden was created by building a smaller wall just outside the main wall; the intervening space, occupied by all manner of wild beasts, served as an additional defense against hostile attacks. This menagerie was organized in twelve grand divisions, and walled paths led between these groups to the twelve gates of the Garden, the river and its adjacent pastures occupying the central area.


Top
 Profile Send private message  
Reply with quote  
PostPosted:  
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Sun Jan 22, 2012 11:16 pm +0000
Posts: 931
Location: Nanticoke NY
As that these sections are portrusions from the main wall, I wouldn't say "random" formation, but you're right in the sense that they are perhaps more "oblong" and "naturally formed" at least to the extent: course of chosen placement. If the wall was used for defencive purpose, then wouldn't it be North-South sectionals, that the more ferocious creatures would "greet" the eastern barrier, and increasingly docile creatures would be dispersed nearer to the western, and that the Greater Wall would be the eastern wall.

I would like to see a diagram with an entire peninsular neck connecting to Mesopotamia. Have you studied the geology of the underfloor of the Mediterranean & the Western Region of the Mesopotamian? Since the Jordan River flows South, the Sea of Galilee , in the land of Joseph, is a geological clue to the probable proximal origin of the Urantian Garden of Eden. This is why Cyprus seems to superimpose upon the the probable location of Eden. However, what if Cyprus was, then, the coastland of the Mediterranean. We do know that techtonic plates can collide to form landstraits, and can spread apart to sink the floor of the sea. Cyprus may have dislodged from the Mesopotamian mainland when the same event came to sink Eden. We know that this Mediterranean Sea was actually landlocked for the greater portion of Urantian History.



The idea that Eden "sunk" does not imply that it "sunk into ubiquitoy". God is Omnipotent, that He could "wipe" a city from the face of the earth, but the Urantia Papers' authors repeatedly insist that both Dalamatia & Eden sank according to natural events. There must be a real pattern under the floor, which indicates Eden of Urantia, specifically the shattered dispersion pattern below the mud. Although God is unsearchable, Eden is searchable to geologists and archaeologists.

_________________
to the Underlaying Unity of All Life so that the Voice of Intuition may guide Us closer to Our Common Keeper


Top
 Profile Send private message  
Reply with quote  
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 25 posts ]  Go to page 1, 2  Next

All times are UTC - 7 hours


Who is online

Registered users: Agon D. Onter, fanofVan, maryjo606


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You can post attachments in this forum

Search for:
Jump to:  
Powered by phpBB® Forum Software © phpBB Group