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In the bible there is a prophetic message about the supposed messiah, it is found in the book of Isaiah chapter 53. It's states that the "messiah" will be rejected by his own people (the Jews), as he will be killed in the place of a sinner yet he would be a innocent man, and this sinless man will be the sacrifice for the remission of sins. Please read the whole chapter of Isaiah 53 to understand where I'm coming from.

My question is for anyone willing to help me come to peace with these claims made in the bible and then in the urantia book. The bible says “But even if we, or an angel from heaven, should preach to you a gospel contrary to what we have preached to you, he is to be accursed!” ‭‭-Galatians‬ ‭1:8‬ ‭NASB‬‬- So this is a serious matter of faith to me.

The book of Isaiah in the bible is found in the Old Testament and proven to be authentic because of the discovery of the "Dead Sea Scrolls", it was dated to come from the year 200 b.c. So it was written before Christ.

My question addresses this dilemma... Isaiah so perfectly described the death of Jesus (the one and only sinless man who was willing to be lead to his own death by his own people) this prophecy seems to come from God, except the urantia book teaches that there is no atoniment.

How can I harmonize the "prophecies" in Isaiah 53 to the "revelations" of the urantia book since both seem to be from God, why would God give Isaiah this prophecy if it was only "half-true" concerning the atoniment?

Also if Jesus Christ knew the Old Testament so well, then why did he do certain things to make it almost seem like he was fulfilling the prophecies even though he wasn't the messiah knowing that there was no atoniment? For example.. The urantia book states that he came in to the city with a donkey, and the Old Testament makes this a prophecy of the coming messiah, so much so the people started quoting the Old Testament yelling "Hosanna to the Son of David!" "Blessed is he who comes in the name of the Lord!" .

How can the prophecies of the "coming messiah" or "Christ Michael" in the bible be so accurate yet so inaccurate according to the urantia book?


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Greetings to our newest member - CorleoneLeone....Welcome!!

The Messiah story of the olden prophets took multiple forms in the OT, with the most common being the expected Deliverer who would slay the enemies of the Jews and restore the power of the Nation and rule as King of the Jews and King of the World. Which means the OT is not particularly consistant in its descriptions nor the expectations of the Jews over time. I would suggest it is this inconsistancy in the bible which should first be considered, prior to differences between the bible and the UB.

Regarding the true nature of Jesus mission as Son of Man and Son of God, and atonement - this would lead us to the very nature of God and his relationship with all of his creation...a lengthy topic and a fundamental issue to consider. Is God angry? Vengeful? Would he kill his child to "redeem" other children? How did the murder of Jesus at mortal hands redeem those who killed him or any before them or any after? Does innocent blood "redeem" anyone? All excellent questions to consider.

Perhaps it was the good news Jesus delivered and his unwavering faith in a loving Father as God and the assurance of his resurrection that was the true mission of Jesus time among us? This is believed to be so by many Christians of multiple denominations. Atonement is an interesting word for your research....it meant at-one-ment for many centuries among early Christians...the doctrine is Jesus came to build a bridge to draw humanity and God closer together or to deliver at-one-ment....not blood sacrifice redemption at all. So you see, there is no consistant doctrine in the OT for the Messiah concept and neither is there any consistant Christian doctrine of blood redemption.....either one.

Especially so given the words and teachings of the Master himself who said that God is love and we are his precious children and we are thusly of one family of brothers and sisters. Have you got a "red letter" edition of the NT? For in those words you will find that which contradicts much in the OT and the Paulinian Doctrines with what the Jesusonian Gospel says about God and our relationship to and with God.

You will find many here who have significant biblical scholarship and a love for this inspired book that illustrates the growth of the concepts of God over thousands of years. The God of Abraham and Moses and Isaiah and Jesus and Paul have significant and distinct differences....as readily shown in the bible itself. A reading of Papers 93-97 provides much illumination on this very important evolution of concept and belief. The entirety of human history is a wonderful story of this conceptual evolution of God and our relationship to the Creator of All.

No one here may say what is true or what another should believe....we can only present and discuss what the UB says and compare that to any other text. I cannot offer resolution to your dilemma but certainly wish you the best as a fellow believer, truth seeker, and Paradise pilgrim.

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(2:7.10) The religious challenge of this age is to those farseeing and forward-looking men and women of spiritual insight who will dare to construct a new and appealing philosophy of living out of the enlarged and exquisitely integrated modern concepts of cosmic truth, universe beauty, and divine goodness. Such a new and righteous vision of morality will attract all that is good in the mind of man and challenge that which is best in the human soul. Truth, beauty, and goodness are divine realities, and as man ascends the scale of spiritual living, these supreme qualities of the Eternal become increasingly co-ordinated and unified in God, who is love.


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Just wanted to let you know I have read Isaiah 52-54 (actually re-read of course). I also wanted to post this link showing the results of a keyword search of "Isaiah" in the UB at the Foundation search engine: http://www.urantia.org/search/book_search/isaiah

Obviously, one of The Master's favorite sources as he quoted this prophet with some frequency.

I look forward to discussing any questions or issues so related.

Here's a link to the search results for "Messiah" for study: http://www.urantia.org/search/book_search/messiah

Some words about the second Isaiah:

97:7.8 (1069.3) Listen again to the gospel of this new revelation of the God of Salem: “He shall feed his flock like a shepherd; he shall gather the lambs in his arms and carry them in his bosom. He gives power to the faint, and to those who have no might he increases strength. Those who wait upon the Lord shall renew their strength; they shall mount up with wings as eagles; they shall run and not be weary; they shall walk and not faint.”

97:7.9 (1069.4) This Isaiah conducted a far-flung propaganda of the gospel of the enlarging concept of a supreme Yahweh. He vied with Moses in the eloquence with which he portrayed the Lord God of Israel as the Universal Creator. He was poetic in his portrayal of the infinite attributes of the Universal Father. No more beautiful pronouncements about the heavenly Father have ever been made. Like the Psalms, the writings of Isaiah are among the most sublime and true presentations of the spiritual concept of God ever to greet the ears of mortal man prior to the arrival of Michael on Urantia. Listen to his portrayal of Deity: “I am the high and lofty one who inhabits eternity.” “I am the first and the last, and beside me there is no other God.” “And the Lord’s hand is not shortened that it cannot save, neither his ear heavy that it cannot hear.” And it was a new doctrine in Jewry when this benign but commanding prophet persisted in the preachment of divine constancy, God’s faithfulness. He declared that “God would not forget, would not forsake.”

97:7.10 (1069.5) This daring teacher proclaimed that man was very closely related to God, saying: “Every one who is called by my name I have created for my glory, and they shall show forth my praise. I, even I, am he who blots out their transgressions for my own sake, and I will not remember their sins.”

97:7.11 (1069.6) Hear this great Hebrew demolish the concept of a national God while in glory he proclaims the divinity of the Universal Father, of whom he says, “The heavens are my throne, and the earth is my footstool.” And Isaiah’s God was none the less holy, majestic, just, and unsearchable. The concept of the angry, vengeful, and jealous Yahweh of the desert Bedouins has almost vanished. A new concept of the supreme and universal Yahweh has appeared in the mind of mortal man, never to be lost to human view. The realization of divine justice has begun the destruction of primitive magic and biologic fear. At last, man is introduced to a universe of law and order and to a universal God of dependable and final attributes.

97:7.12 (1070.1) And this preacher of a supernal God never ceased to proclaim this God of love. “I dwell in the high and holy place, also with him who is of a contrite and humble spirit.” And still further words of comfort did this great teacher speak to his contemporaries: “And the Lord will guide you continually and satisfy your soul. You shall be like a watered garden and like a spring whose waters fail not. And if the enemy shall come in like a flood, the spirit of the Lord will lift up a defense against him.” And once again did the fear-destroying gospel of Melchizedek and the trust-breeding religion of Salem shine forth for the blessing of mankind.

97:7.13 (1070.2) The farseeing and courageous Isaiah effectively eclipsed the nationalistic Yahweh by his sublime portraiture of the majesty and universal omnipotence of the supreme Yahweh, God of love, ruler of the universe, and affectionate Father of all mankind. Ever since those eventful days the highest God concept in the Occident has embraced universal justice, divine mercy, and eternal righteousness. In superb language and with matchless grace this great teacher portrayed the all-powerful Creator as the all-loving Father.

97:7.14 (1070.3) This prophet of the captivity preached to his people and to those of many nations as they listened by the river in Babylon. And this second Isaiah did much to counteract the many wrong and racially egoistic concepts of the mission of the promised Messiah. But in this effort he was not wholly successful. Had the priests not dedicated themselves to the work of building up a misconceived nationalism, the teachings of the two Isaiahs would have prepared the way for the recognition and reception of the promised Messiah.

10. The Hebrew Religion

97:10.1 (1075.6) Their leaders had taught the Israelites that they were a chosen people, not for special indulgence and monopoly of divine favor, but for the special service of carrying the truth of the one God over all to every nation. And they had promised the Jews that, if they would fulfill this destiny, they would become the spiritual leaders of all peoples, and that the coming Messiah would reign over them and all the world as the Prince of Peace.

97:10.2 (1075.7) When the Jews had been freed by the Persians, they returned to Palestine only to fall into bondage to their own priest-ridden code of laws, sacrifices, and rituals. And as the Hebrew clans rejected the wonderful story of God presented in the farewell oration of Moses for the rituals of sacrifice and penance, so did these remnants of the Hebrew nation reject the magnificent concept of the second Isaiah for the rules, regulations, and rituals of their growing priesthood.

97:10.3 (1075.8) National egotism, false faith in a misconceived promised Messiah, and the increasing bondage and tyranny of the priesthood forever silenced the voices of the spiritual leaders (excepting Daniel, Ezekiel, Haggai, and Malachi); and from that day to the time of John the Baptist all Israel experienced an increasing spiritual retrogression. But the Jews never lost the concept of the Universal Father; even to the twentieth century after Christ they have continued to follow this Deity conception.

97:10.4 (1076.1) From Moses to John the Baptist there extended an unbroken line of faithful teachers who passed the monotheistic torch of light from one generation to another while they unceasingly rebuked unscrupulous rulers, denounced commercializing priests, and ever exhorted the people to adhere to the worship of the supreme Yahweh, the Lord God of Israel.


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Are you familiar with the bible quote on Melchizedek - the Sage/High Priest of Salem? A fascinating history for students of the bible:

93:9.5 (1023.2) It was hard for the next generation to comprehend the story of Melchizedek; within five hundred years many regarded the whole narrative as a myth. Isaac held fairly well to the teachings of his father and nourished the gospel of the Salem colony, but it was harder for Jacob to grasp the significance of these traditions. Joseph was a firm believer in Melchizedek and was, largely because of this, regarded by his brothers as a dreamer. Joseph’s honor in Egypt was chiefly due to the memory of his great-grandfather Abraham. Joseph was offered military command of the Egyptian armies, but being such a firm believer in the traditions of Melchizedek and the later teachings of Abraham and Isaac, he elected to serve as a civil administrator, believing that he could thus better labor for the advancement of the kingdom of heaven.

93:9.6 (1023.3) The teaching of Melchizedek was full and replete, but the records of these days seemed impossible and fantastic to the later Hebrew priests, although many had some understanding of these transactions, at least up to the times of the en masse editing of the Old Testament records in Babylon.

93:9.7 (1023.4) What the Old Testament records describe as conversations between Abraham and God were in reality conferences between Abraham and Melchizedek. Later scribes regarded the term Melchizedek as synonymous with God. The record of so many contacts of Abraham and Sarah with “the angel of the Lord” refers to their numerous visits with Melchizedek.

93:9.8 (1023.5) The Hebrew narratives of Isaac, Jacob, and Joseph are far more reliable than those about Abraham, although they also contain many diversions from the facts, alterations made intentionally and unintentionally at the time of the compilation of these records by the Hebrew priests during the Babylonian captivity. Keturah was not a wife of Abraham; like Hagar, she was merely a concubine. All of Abraham’s property went to Isaac, the son of Sarah, the status wife. Abraham was not so old as the records indicate, and his wife was much younger. These ages were deliberately altered in order to provide for the subsequent alleged miraculous birth of Isaac.

93:9.9 (1023.6) The national ego of the Jews was tremendously depressed by the Babylonian captivity. In their reaction against national inferiority they swung to the other extreme of national and racial egotism, in which they distorted and perverted their traditions with the view of exalting themselves above all races as the chosen people of God; and hence they carefully edited all their records for the purpose of raising Abraham and their other national leaders high up above all other persons, not excepting Melchizedek himself. The Hebrew scribes therefore destroyed every record of these momentous times which they could find, preserving only the narrative of the meeting of Abraham and Melchizedek after the battle of Siddim, which they deemed reflected great honor upon Abraham.

93:9.10 (1024.1) And thus, in losing sight of Melchizedek, they also lost sight of the teaching of this emergency Son regarding the spiritual mission of the promised bestowal Son; lost sight of the nature of this mission so fully and completely that very few of their progeny were able or willing to recognize and receive Michael when he appeared on earth and in the flesh as Machiventa had foretold.

93:9.11 (1024.2) But one of the writers of the Book of Hebrews understood the mission of Melchizedek, for it is written: “This Melchizedek, priest of the Most High, was also king of peace; without father, without mother, without pedigree, having neither beginning of days nor end of life but made like a Son of God, he abides a priest continually.” This writer designated Melchizedek as a type of the later bestowal of Michael, affirming that Jesus was “a minister forever on the order of Melchizedek.” While this comparison was not altogether fortunate, it was literally true that Christ did receive provisional title to Urantia “upon the orders of the twelve Melchizedek receivers” on duty at the time of his world bestowal.

8) From a Jewish encyclopedia: http://www.jewishencyclopedia.com/artic ... elchizedek


MELCHIZEDEK (="king of righteousness"):

By: Isidore Singer, Kaufmann Kohler
Table of Contents
Type of Ancient Monotheism.
The Melchizedekites.
King of Salem and priest of the Most High in the time of Abraham. He brought out bread and wine, blessed Abram, and received tithes from him (Gen. xiv. 18-20). Reference is made to him in Ps. cx. 4, where the victorious ruler is declared to be "priest forever after the order of Melchizedek." The story is neither an invention nor the product of a copyist's error, as Cheyne ("Encyc. Bibl.") thinks, but rests upon ancient Jerusalemic tradition (as Josephus, "B. J." vi. 10, affirms; comp. Gunkel, "Genesis," 1901, p. 261), "Zedek" being an ancient name of Jerusalem (probably connected with the Phenician Συδνκ = "Zedek" = "Jupiter"; comp. Shab. 156a, b; Gen. R. xliii.; Pesiḳ. R. 20; see Baudissin, "Studien zur Semitischen Religionsgesch." 1876, i. 14-15). Hence "'ir ha-ẓedeḳ" (Isa. i. 21, 26), "neweh ẓedeḳ" (Jer. xxxi. 23, l. 7), "sha'are ẓedeḳ" (Ps. cxviii. 19). The city's first king, accordingly, was known either as "Adoni Zedek" (Josh. x. 1 et seq. ; comp. Judges i. 5-7, where "Adonizedek" is the correct reading) or as "Malkizedek." The fact that he united the royal with the priestly dignity, like all ancient (heathen) kings, made him a welcome type to the composer of the triumphal song (Ps. cx.).

Type of Ancient Monotheism.
But to the Jewish propagandists of Alexandria, who were eager to win proselytes for Judaism without submitting them to the rite of circumcision, Melchizedek appealed with especial force as a type of the monotheist of the pre-Abrahamic time or of non-Jewish race, like Enoch. Like Enoch, too, he was apotheosized. He was placed in the same category with Elijah, the Messiah ben Joseph, and the Messiah ben David (Suk. 52b, where "Kohenẓedek" should be corrected to "Malkiẓedeḳ"). The singular feature of supernatural origin is ascribed to all four, in that they are described as being "without father and without mother, without descent, having neither beginning of days nor end of life, but made like unto the son of God abiding forever" (Heb. vii 2-3; comp. Ruth. R. v. 3, where the original text [see "Pugio Fidei," p. 125] referred also to Ps. cx. 4, Isa. liii. 2, and Zech. vi. 12, comp. Yalḳ., Reubeni Bereshit, 9d; Epiphanius, "Hæresis," lv. 3). According to Midr. Teh. to Ps. xxxvii., Abraham learned the practise of charity from Melchizedek. Philo speaks of him as "the logos, the priest whose inheritance is the true God" ("De Allegoriis Legum," iii. 26).


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I note that Isaiah 53:1 even begins by asking "Who will believe our story?"


The Urantia Book Part IV the Life of Jesus of Nazareth tells us that Jesus was known by many titles and roles throughout his travels. Although he grew up in Moses' northern tribe of Joseph, he deported himself to gain knowledge and understanding of every race & culture as had existed in those times.

If you want to know what advantage you will have in the Urantia Papers, it is in the psychological portrait of Jesus and his family, as it was in those times. Even his personal relationship with his mother Mary speaks volumes. The texts tells of Mary's numerous hopes, expectations, & disappointments in Jesus. She surely had a great expectation in mind that he would grow up to be some kind of messianic figure, even a Davidic king. Such hopes were strong in the post-Maccabean Jewish state.

The midwayer creatures, who lived as witnesses of those times, interpret the gospel of Matthew as the account of one Levite who had closely monitored the accounting-transactions of how a man came to fulfill the recorded & outstanding promises that his clan had remembered. Historically, this Levite clan is particularly special with regards to authority of divine interpretations for the Hebrew peoples. Would you regard all prophecies, then consider that such traditions were earlier fused with Moabite or Babylonian traditions after the Hebrews came out of egypt, if you see that Ruth is Moabite the mother of David's mother. Would you regard all theories of every Jew you have too much to sort through, but mainly those who adhered to the established history and did conform to such theories.



But I would not regard Jesus' fulfillment of prophecy as strictly in the Jewish culture, as there were many aspiring religious groups in the world at that time. "Jesus missing years", the time he travelled throughout all Roma, and was known by so many titles & roles. John 20:30 " Jesus performed many other signs in the presence of his disciples, which are not recorded in this book." He embodies the archetypes of many other mythological figures "Mithra" and "Zeus" for instance.

Do not constern yourself so much in prepondering how you may best conform to the dictates of the Jewish state, as the spiritual message of Jesus is ammenable to your culture and can conform to and adapt the best qualities of your own mores & values.

Jesus confirms his identity to Caiaphas: "Are you the deliverer?" "I AM; SOON I GO TO THE FATHER". The Urantia Book states that these were some of his only words from the trial. There are numerous other signs: that his transfiguration occurs in Mt. Hermon "in the land of the Gentiles" (not mount hebron). The olden testatment is a long saga of how Moses inherited the world as God's ruler. Jerusalem was even then not part of Joshua or Moses' territory, existing within the tribe of Judah's lands but with a fortified wall that stood unlike Jericho. You see that although the decision to arrest Jesus was made in Jerusalem Sanhedrin headquarters, the first trial of Jesus occurred in Annas' estate - outside the walls. Pay attention to see that the message for the Jews was for every people "who will believeR".

Therefore, you can see when there are restatements of Jewish history, and even Jesus life, there are many changes that are biased towards an image of God which is more like a conquering despot and less of a father, subtle though they may be. Such biases have to allocated all of the Jewish kingdom in West of the Jordan River and along the Dead Sea. If you pay attention, you can see that your own cultural standing is valid regardless of birth-origin.

Currently, the Urantia Book corrects some of these subtle errors and prideful interjections found in Bibles. It is the least biased account thoroughly in the world today. You will see that it adheres to established tradition while making some necessary corrections. Urantia Book upholds that during 6th Century B.C. Isaiah was one of a few spiritual teachers who helped prepare the world peoples for the coming of Christ Michael.

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to the Underlaying Unity of All Life so that the Voice of Intuition may guide Us closer to Our Common Keeper


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Greetings CorleoneLeone,

You asked:

CorleoneLeone wrote:
Also if Jesus Christ knew the Old Testament so well, then why did he do certain things to make it almost seem like he was fulfilling the prophecies . . .?


Jesus was the revelation of a new religion, but revelatory religions are ineffective unless they utilize teachings which are already accepted by the current religions of the age. First century thinkers could best comprehend new teachings when presented within the scope of their working imagery. You can't expect people to climb a ladder by leaping over a dozen rungs.

Revelation is evolutionary but always progressive. Down through the ages of a world's history, the revelations of religion are ever-expanding and successively more enlightening. It is the mission of revelation to sort and censor the successive religions of evolution. But if revelation is to exalt and upstep the religions of evolution, then must such divine visitations portray teachings which are not too far removed from the thought and reactions of the age in which they are presented. Thus must and does revelation always keep in touch with evolution. Always must the religion of revelation be limited by man's capacity of receptivity. 92:4:1

In Friendship,
Rexford


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The atonement doctrine would have us believe that the heavenly Father, the Father of love and mercy that Jesus taught as opposed to the Father of judgment and retribution taught in the Hebrew scriptures, could only welcome His sinful children (Jews) into His kingdom, like the father welcomed the prodigal son, if He sent His sinless son to be sacrificed in their stead. The Father did not send Jesus; Jesus chose to live here. The Father did not require that Jesus be sacrificed; Jesus chose this on his own.

This really is a sinful world -- the planetary prince defaulted, Adam and Eve defaulted, Lucifer, Satan, and Caligastia held control over this world and its inhabitants. And we really are sinful children... simply because we live here. Partly because of that sin Jesus chose to live his material life here for our benefit. Because of his love for the Father and for his earth children Jesus chose to be sacrificed and by doing so he profoundly made real his teachings that the Father loves his children and that life does not end at death, that we continue on. He had taught and displayed this during his preaching career, bringing several people back from the verge of death, and indisputably he demonstrated this by resurrecting Lazarus and then himself.

None of this was decreed by the Father... Jesus gave it to us of his own free and loving will.


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(2:6.5) The erroneous supposition that the righteousness of God was irreconcilable with the selfless love of the heavenly Father, presupposed absence of unity in the nature of Deity and led directly to the elaboration of the atonement doctrine, which is a philosophic assault upon both the unity and the free-willness of God.


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lwatkins wrote:
Jesus chose to be sacrificed


Are you sure that you wanted to say "sacrificed"? This is a very Pauline notion.


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Greetings All,

I cannot accept the statement that this world is sinful. I don't think such an idea is at all consistent with the Papers which states that all the worlds of time and space have the potential for evil, and that evil is not sin until consciously, knowingly, and freely chosen. Jesus clearly explained that this world is incomplete and therefore has the potential for evil, that we are all subject to inherent evil tendencies of the animal nature. But none of us are sinful simply because we are born on this incomplete world of time and space. In fact, we need the potential for evil in order to exercise free will. It is the moral choice to complete an unselfish decision when faced with the opportunity to act selfishly which elevates the animal nature to the spiritual nature.

By nature, before the rebirth of the spirit, mortal man is subject to inherent evil tendencies, but such natural imperfections of behavior are neither sin nor iniquity. Mortal man is just beginning his long ascent to the perfection of the Father in Paradise. To be imperfect or partial in natural endowment is not sinful. Man is indeed subject to evil, but he is in no sense the child of the evil one unless he has knowingly and deliberately chosen the paths of sin and the life of iniquity. Evil is inherent in the natural order of this world, but sin is an attitude of conscious rebellion which was brought to this world by those who fell from spiritual light into gross darkness. 148:4:6

Men are, indeed, by nature evil, but not necessarily sinful. The new birth — the baptism of the spirit — is essential to deliverance from evil and necessary for entrance into the kingdom of heaven, but none of this detracts from the fact that man is the son of God. Neither does this inherent presence of potential evil mean that man is in some mysterious way estranged from the Father in heaven so that, as an alien, foreigner, or stepchild, he must in some manner seek for legal adoption by the Father. All such notions are born, first, of your misunderstanding of the Father and, second, of your ignorance of the origin, nature, and destiny of man.148:4:8


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Is this a sinful world?

sin is an attitude of conscious rebellion which was brought to this world by those who fell from spiritual light into gross darkness. 148:4.5
Sin is potential in all realms where imperfect beings are endowed with the ability to choose between good and evil. 54:0.2
Sin is the measure of unwillingness to be divinely led and spiritually directed. 148:4.4
Sin is the attitude of a personality who is knowingly resisting cosmic reality. 67:1.4
Jesus taught that sin is not the child of a defective nature but rather the offspring of a knowing mind dominated by an unsubmissive will. 170:2.23

Is humanity sinful?
Do we treat others as we would be treated?
Do we treat our bodies as the temples of God?
Do we treat our minds with respect?
Do we indulge in drugs, alcohol, and mind-altering substances?
Are we selfish?

So yes, in my opinion this is both a sinful world and we are sinful beings and Jesus came to lead us past these obstacles. True, "Men are, indeed by nature evil, but not necessarily sinful." It's not necessary for humanity to be sinful, it's a choice made daily and individually.

Larry


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(145:3.4) Neither could his hearers forget his blessed words, declaring, "Man is the son of God, not a child of the devil."

lwatkins wrote:
It's not necessary for humanity to be sinful, it's a choice made daily and individually.

Yes, even moment to moment. And this is why (by our consistent choosing) we can live according to the Father's will. Perfectly. Just need to do it. It's really not that hard. And it becomes habit. We know what we are doing. And all this put together makes the idea that God requires an innocent man to shed blood and die as a sacrifice for the sin of others totally unacceptable. Unworthy of belief.

If we are the sons of God the Father, then we WILL become like him. Living without sin by our choices and actions. NOW!

At least we can stop choosing sin.


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Greetings,

In Paper 111 it is revealed that sin is not self-existent in the finite world. This means that sin does not, nor can it, exist on its own. Therefore, the world we live on is not sinful. Also, the state of being finite, as we humans are, is neither evil or sinful. Only when individuals abuse God's creation, which is inherently good, does the perversion of evil or sin appear. The earth itself is not sinful, nor are the people who inhabit it sinful unless they choose what is unreal. The finite world is real.

The problem of sin is not self-existent in the finite world. The fact of finiteness is not evil or sinful. The finite world was made by an infinite Creator — it is the handiwork of his divine Sons — and therefore it must be good. It is the misuse, distortion, and perversion of the finite that gives origin to evil and sin. 111:6:3

In Friendship,
Rexford


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(34:7.7) Those God-knowing men and women who have been born of the Spirit experience no more conflict with their mortal natures than do the inhabitants of the most normal of worlds, planets which have never been tainted with sin nor touched by rebellion. Faith sons work on intellectual levels and live on spiritual planes far above the conflicts produced by unrestrained or unnatural physical desires. The normal urges of animal beings and the natural appetites and impulses of the physical nature are not in conflict with even the highest spiritual attainment


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