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Dear Friends,

I know that most posts here are on the philosophic side of the teachings of Urantia Book, more on the intellectual field than on the practical one. However, I think that you may also deal with personal conflicts in our daily lives, which has to do, directly or indirectly, with the U.B. teachings, especially with the Life and Teachings of Jesus.

Therefore, I am going to dare to share a personal situation rather than an understanding of a principle as I have done other times. I would appreciate your input on this.

Being a U.B. student has challenged me much more than being a Christian had challenged for most part of my life. It seems that in Christianity, because you see the scriptural teachings being often distorted by the dogma, economics and politics, you may not feel so guilty when you bend the living principles of Jesus. Not the same when you are dealing with the revealed religion, in which the pattern is perfection, not only taught, but also exhibited.

In past times I would deal with these situations selfishly, altogether with an excuse for my conscience. But since I have committed to the Fatherhood of God and the Brotherhood of Men, it’s has been hard to act like that. Here is the situation:

I am having really a hard time to love a family member that has hurt me badly. I don’t want to go to him to talk about forgiveness, because I am even judging him and not believing what he would say to me, since I already consider him, according to evidences from his behavior, a liar, manipulator, arrogant, inconsiderate, selfish, cheap, controlling, rude, self-centered, obscurantist (despise education), presumptuous, etc.

I also am aware of his qualities: smart, articulate, good speaker, etc (sorry if I can’t list the same amount than his defects).

My problem is that I want to love him (I possibly love him), but I don’t like him at all. In other words, I can’t stand him. I don’t want to talk to him, I don’t want to be in the same room with him – even his voice annoys me.

I am not perfect, I sure did some wrong things to bring our relationship to this state, but while I know that, he shows no sign of recognize his part on the problem. I feel terribly disappointed on him and because he hurt me so badly (sorry, but I will not share how), I have being fighting vengeance thoughts lately. I have been always able to fustigate these thoughts away, by reminding me that revenge is not one of my life-strategy anymore (although perhaps I am secretly doing this right now by exposing this situation, because our hearts are very deceiving many times); at least I have not taking any action to damage him directly or knowingly. I don’t have offended him with my words, certainly I have done things that fell short of his approval, but I didn’t purposely hurt him. By other hand, he is deep down in my esteem.

I am afraid of not being loving him and if it is true, that goes against one of my prime-life-directive –- to love anyone without any kind of discrimination. I am not sure if I really love him. I should and I want to, but I dislike him so intensely, that I am afraid I will never like him in this life.

This is hard. You see, I have a daughter, my oldest, that in general terms, is “hard-to-take”. I know that, her mother knows that and everybody in the family knows that, but we all love her because we understand that she doesn’t know better yet. But with this other person, he should know better. I know is wrong to nurture such expectations from others, but I do, and for that, I don’t know if I really love him.

I tried to seek help in the examples in Jesus’ life. Many people hurt Jesus, even his own family, sometimes by not believing in him, other times by not showing the expected affection towards him, as it happened when he was dispersing a season camping and nobody was sent from his family to fraternize with him in the last commemorative day. Other people really hated Jesus and I don’t see him going after them offering pardon and asking to amend relationships. I don’t have the slightest doubt that Jesus loved them; although, personally, he despised their actions and attitudes towards life and religion.

My question is: would I be capable of making such a distinction, and love this person but dislike his personality? Things complicate even more, when I consider that this person is inhabited by a fragment of the Universal Father as much as I am, that our Father loves him as much as he loves me. His adjuster evaluated his possibilities and lovingly decided to come and inhabit him because he saw a possibility of making of him a marvelous finaliter, as I heartily want him to be, as much I want to be myself.

So, when I think like that, I think I do love him… But, when I think the way he is, and when I feel the repulse that it causes in me, then, I am not so sure.

Perhaps, because I am living the situation right now, I can’t get a good perspective. That is why I am sharing this, so maybe somebody will help me to get a better perspective.

However, friends, while I was writing the last paragraph, occurred to me: “ Why, instead of expecting his changing or focusing on his defects, you don’t simply focus on your defects and on changing yourself?”

It seems it is a good thought, the above one, because one thing is clear: I can’t change others, only they can, but I really can change myself, respecting me, and respecting others. Perhaps, if can make myself more beautiful, I will see others more beautifully too.

Well, it seems that I already have my answer, after all; but your comments are still welcomed.

Jovalso

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I will see Christ Michael Jesus and I will receive my accreditation from Nebadon from his holy hands.


Last edited by jovalso on Fri Jul 09, 2010 9:49 am +0000, edited 2 times in total.

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Dear jovalso,

Yes, you pretty much found your answer by laying it all out. Sometimes that is the best thing to do. Even if we have feelings and emotions that we wish we didn't have, just speaking them helps us to get rid of them, and gives us room to grow. I am glad that you chose to do that here, among your UB friends.

I think it is entirely possible to love someone but not like them. Inside, we are all loveable as children of God - God loves all of us - even the difficult ones, and we should try to do the same...but that does not automatically mean that we have to spend time with people who have proven themselves untrustworthy, or who have hurt us without being sorry about it. In fact, to try and force yourself to accept this person with open arms might not be the best thing for you. It is okay to distance yourself from people who you consider toxic.

Loving someone can be expressed through prayer and forgiveness. It doesn't mean you have to accept them back in your life. In fact, if they have done wrong by you and have expressed no remorse, it would not really be very wise to invite them back. Then you run the risk of being hurt even more.

I would say that it is important to keep exploring forgiveness in your heart for this person...not so much for him, but for your own sense of well-being. Forgiveness helps us to rise above the hurt, and even can help us get to a place where we pray for this person and their life. That is the best result...God, and time, will likely take care of them better than you can.

It is hard not to judge others who have done wrong by us. I have done the same thing. Sometimes it takes years to really get to a place of forgiveness, but it is the best way to go, and is what we are taught to do by Jesus. He loved all - even his enemies - and he forgave all. Forgiveness lightens our hearts...

You are right that you can't change another...you really only have power over yourself, so that is the best way to start, as you concluded. Maybe pray for the ability to forgive, the ability to rise above this problem.

I am sure that others will have even better advice. I just want you to know that I care, and I will pray for you today that you can see some clarity about this situation soon.

MaryJo


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Dear Maryjo606,

Thank you for your caring words, it helped a lot. Thank you for your prayers and I will explore a way to forgive.

Jovalso

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Dear Jovalso,

What you are going through is common. It is one thing to say that we should love one another. It is quite another thing to love someone that displays the kinds of traits that you outlined. I too have been deeply hurt by various persons in my life. I too have had difficulty forgiving them. What they have done was so callous and so cold that it seems impossible to forgive them, let alone love them.

Just recently I have asked the Father to help me be more forgiving. Forgiveness is the hardest thing that we will ever do. But without forgiveness there can be no healing. Without forgiveness there can be no age of light and life. I think that we sometimes overlook the fact that forgiveness is an aspect of love. When we forgive someone we are agreeing to take our anger and release it. We no longer seek retribution. It is like we have taken our anger, filled it in a balloon, and released it into deep space, never to be found again.

But what do you do when there is a person that consistently displays the traits that you told us about? You certainly have a free will. You can choose to distance yourself from that person. There is no reason that you should have to be subjected to disrespect and abuse. But there is something that you can do. You may not like the person, at the present time, but you can offer prayer to the Father in their behalf. The person that you are angry with has a Thought Adjuster. Why not pray that your antagonist's Thought Adjuster awaken him to his spiritual heritage? Isn't it true that your antagonist's Thought Adjuster loves that person unconditionally? Isn't that person's Thought Adjuster working hard to awaken him to his spiritual origins?

Another thing you can do is look at the person without the burden of time. How do you not know that this person will not turn around on the mansion worlds? Perhaps you can take a long term view. The Father takes a long term view when He looks at us. He is not handicapped by the strictures of time and space. He knows that, despite our immaturity, that we will one day stand before Him in perfection. Can you see this person as one day standing before the Father in perfection? It is quite possible that this person will not change while here on Urantia. But then again it is possible that the focus of your anger will finally discover the Father within and begin to grow spiritually while on the mansion worlds. Can your love allow for that possibility?

I know that it is not easy, my friend. I struggle with these issues every day. But if we are to become one with the Father it is important to forgive and even to love those that we don't like. Look at that person from the lens of love. It seems that that person is carrying around a lot of toxicity. Perhaps we should feel sorry for persons that are so caustic, so angry, so manipulative, that they spend their whole lives in this state. That is sad. To those of us that have discovered the Father within we can certainly pray for these people. If they discover their Father fragment these negative traits will eventually slough off. And if you release your anger and find it in your heart to forgive you will discover and be touched by the Father fragment that is dwelling in your own mind.

Love,
Paul


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Kick him to the curb girlfriend! :D

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I get stuck on the word "love". I know what the feeling of loving feels like, but I don't believe that is the true definition. Even saying "I love God" rings hollow (and I don't say those words) because, even though I have had personal proof that God is present, alive, real...and I can never fully repay what all has been and is being done for me...there are no mushy feelings surrounding that. To say that I need to love people sounds kind of flowery with no substance. To love someone don't you actually have to come to know them on a deeper level? I know of God more, have a closer contact now, it can be extremely sweet at times when those feelings of an intimate connection do come...but those are feelings.

Don't get me wrong here...there are no people that I hate, a few I keep my distance from either b/c they are way too crazy (crazier than me) or they are mean, manipulative and/or just takers and users. But love everyone? I like and enjoy people much more than ever before in my life. I respect the messiness and craziness in the quirks of others, even in myself now. But love? Maybe I'm looking for something more concrete where there is none.

But to get back to the topic of forgiveness....if I try to forgive someone than I'm bringing that scenario back up in my mind automatically, and all those feelings get mixed up in the process. The most I can do now is give it up, honestly give it up to God to sort out inside of me and not dwell on it (and I may have to repeat this process until I'm so disgusted with myself that I simply can't stand the thoughts anymore). There is a part of me, when I'm feeling hurt or disrespected by someone, that gets some perverted delight in vengeful little thoughts without even trying. When I become aware of what my mind is doing I have to physically change my actions, if nothing more than standing up. My brain will go where it wants to go with or without my permission and physical movement seems to help in changing my focus...sometimes.

There's still some residual hurt from many years ago but it's lost most of it's sting, most of it's power has dissipated. But...place me in the presence of one of those people again and it could, probably would, flare back into a flame.

So I'm stuck more on the "love" definition and I'm wondering what the UB is actually referring to. Actually I've wondered about this for quite some time.
Sorry...didn't mean to get off track and doubt if I've contributed anything of substance to this thread...it's this blasted mind of mine :?


Peace
Jo

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No longer can man presume to monopolize the ministry of religious service. ...among the followers of Jesus woman has been forever set free from all religious discriminations based on gender. TUB pg 2065 (194:3.14)


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Jak wrote:

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There is a part of me, when I'm feeling hurt or disrespected by someone, that gets some perverted delight in vengeful little thoughts without even trying. When I become aware of what my mind is doing I have to physically change my actions, if nothing more than standing up. My brain will go where it wants to go with or without my permission and physical movement seems to help in changing my focus...sometimes.


Hi Jak,

Thank you for your reply. Yes, it was kind of a different one, to admit that we don't know really what love is; I mean, that we don't know how to express what really love is, because we have, indeed, experienced it in our lives what love is, because we have experienced the love of God.

In my original post, I confessed that I had vegeance thoughts about this family member. Yes, it seems that we have secret pleasure on thinking to do harm to whom have hurt us. I have experienced that too. But I know that this is something that comes from the animal nature altogether with the capacity of reason that we have. It doesn't come from the Adjuster, or from any other spiritual influences are around us (since all bad midways are imprisioned and Caligastia is probably too busy to care about my thoughts). And yes, it is hard to fight it. You have physically to move, I have to align my thoughts with the spiritual truths, as I told in my original post, to think that this "antagonist" is my brother, he is a potential finaliter and I must do whatever I can to love him. I also don't want to be hypocrite, I won't go pretend that everything is ok, when is not.

But all is a process, I have wondered in what maturity circle I am in now. I know I have passed the third, but between the third and the seven, I am lost. I know that in my age, the Adjuster works more as a controller of thoughts, surely not manipulating my thoughts, but probably dealing with them to make them spiritual. I know that the Adjuster wants I make all the circles, but I, sometimes, wonder if I will be able to cooperate with him that much, before death intervenes.

In all that, to think of our Universal Father's love, sustain me.

Thank you Jo, for your posting; and, for the record, it did contribute.

Love (I know, you are stuck with this word),

Jose.

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I love you honesty jovalso...let me think :-s What have I experienced? What have I done? hmmmmm

I too have been hurt by others and have hurt others too...that's life. I try to keep my side of the street clean and will apologize for any wrongs I done. Does that mean I have to put myself in the situation where things could happen again...no =;

but...if they are within the family...that is more difficult. by cleaning my side of the street, it brings me peace. and I hope this is what you are seeking and not revenge. That's another breed of cat.

I find I also will chew on it till there is no juice left then spit it out...turn it over to God and leave it there.

Yes, Jesus was Love but he also got upset about the actions of others. I think of cleansing the temple grounds.

I pray for your peace...Aloha

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Thanks for you kind words, Jose. And tootsie is on target regarding your honesty...very refreshing and engaging.
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I have wondered in what maturity circle I am in now. I know I have passed the third, but between the third and the seven, I am lost.

I cannot even go there in my mind. Figure we're each where we are and if I try to figure it out then I use up energy from the daily living and experiencing in getting to wherever it is that I'm going.
(Now that was one convoluted sentence :roll: ).

Just trust that we're always being guided.

Peace
Jo

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Someone said:
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I have wondered in what maturity circle I am in now. I know I have passed the third, but between the third and the seven, I am lost.
We all start out on the seventh psychic circle. By the time we work our way to the third, there are only the second and first to go. Chances are, if you know you have acquired your own guardian seraphim, and you do not yet hear the Voice of God speaking to you, you are likely on the second psychic circle. In any case, it's just a guess. We don't know and we're not supposed to worry about where we are in our development.
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34.7.8 Having started out on the way of life everlasting, having accepted the assignment and received your orders to advance, do not fear the dangers of human forgetfulness and mortal inconstancy, do not be troubled with doubts of failure or by perplexing confusion, do not falter and question your status and standing, for in every dark hour, at every crossroad in the forward struggle, the Spirit of Truth will always speak, saying, “This is the way.”

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Thanks Gerdean, I was thinking on reverse. You are right we all start on the seventh not in the first, so, since I have passed the third, I should be, like you said, between the third and the seventh. And yes, we shouldn't give much tought to that ... yes, when you get in the first you do hear the voice of the Adjuster in a clearer and often way. Nah, probably not there yet, but struggling in the second, as you said... Thanks, it helped.

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Gerdean...that is my favorite quote from the book and have read it many times...thank you for your post...

34.7.8 Having started out on the way of life everlasting, having accepted the assignment and received your orders to advance, do not fear the dangers of human forgetfulness and mortal inconstancy, do not be troubled with doubts of failure or by perplexing confusion, do not falter and question your status and standing, for in every dark hour, at every crossroad in the forward struggle, the Spirit of Truth will always speak, saying, “This is the way.”

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