Urantia Book Forum

Urantia Book Discussion Board : Study Group
It is currently Mon Mar 30, 2020 10:11 am +0000

All times are UTC - 7 hours




Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 159 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7 ... 11  Next
Author Message
 Post subject: Re: Authority over woman
PostPosted:  
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Mon Nov 15, 2004 12:37 pm +0000
Posts: 1471
Location: Hawaii
Very cool...Congrats and I am happy to hear that...
As for me...Jesus has set a pretty high standard for me and I just can't seem to meet the right guy...oh well :? :wink:

_________________
A fellow Agondonter...


Top
 Profile Send private message  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject: Re: Authority over woman
PostPosted:  
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Mon Dec 27, 2004 12:42 pm +0000
Posts: 2411
Location: Central New Mexico, USA
In the '60's we had a song that went: "If you can't be with the one you love, honey, love the one you're with!" So ... enjoy what you've got til it's gone and then enjoy what comes next. And no matter how you look at it, marriage is temporary but God is with us always, and so is Jesus, the Great Friend, -- not to mention all those heavenly helpers, seraphim, midwayers and beings who work incessantly with us to bring us up and into superconscious awareness of our place in the universe and the eternal associations we will enjoy -- thus we are never alone. But I admit it is wonderful to have somebody bring home the bacon and take out the trash.

_________________
Gerdean O'Dell
Author: "Secrets of Promise"


Top
 Profile Send private message  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject: Re: Authority over woman
PostPosted:  
Offline

Joined: Sat Aug 14, 2010 1:29 am +0000
Posts: 7
Gerdean wrote:
Today's Quote featured:
Quote:
"My brother, always remember that man
has no rightful authority over woman unless
the woman has willingly and voluntarily
given him such authority."
Jesus, The Urantia Book, (133:2.2)

I'm wondering what you think this means ... if you think it means that when a woman marries a man she has willingly and voluntarily given him authority over her until death do them part, or if you think this means on a moment-by-moment or issue-by-issue basis.


I percieve it to mean this:
(Most women will agree with me, I think)

When we little girls grow up, we look upon the male gender (at first) thru the eyes of a daughter. We basically entrust our whole emotions and faith into that male. That is sort of a volunteer "do what you want with me because I trust you with every inch of my body and mind, that you wont do me any harm whatsoever" in itself, type of thing.

So to me paper 133:2.2 in the Urantia Book means that we are specifically being told: not to force the female gender to anything, as such trust, bond between a male and female is precious. I dont think it is specifically ONLY speaking in terms of marriage, dating or simply friendship. It`s going deeper into the emotional state of being which should not be distroyed.


Top
 Profile Send private message  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject: Re: Authority over woman
PostPosted:  
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Mon Dec 27, 2004 12:42 pm +0000
Posts: 2411
Location: Central New Mexico, USA
Oh, wow, Eve. I can't remember anyone ever responding to this question in such a way as to bring such complete and total comprehension depth to the issue. It was the thing about how we, as daughters, are taught by our fathers. And we carry that attitude through to all men. Of course we learn, sooner or later, that men are only human, and they disappoint, whereas God the Father is divine and His love is ... I don't want to say "unconditional," but I will say "non-authoritative." And invariably men presume some kind of authority over women -- if only because women look to them for that precise quality! Women say, "Tell me you love me. Tell me it is going to be alright. What shall we do?" And men accommodate. If women don't want to grow up, if they want to remain helpless and men in a position of being the adult, ["Oh, Rick, you're going to have to do my thinking for me!" -- from Casablanca] what else can they expect? Women must grow up and look to the divine Father for the assurance they need. Actually, men do, too. Obviously that is why the lesson was phrased as it was. A woman CAN put her faith in a man who puts his faith in Our Father!

Thank you, Eve. And welcome to Truthbook.

_________________
Gerdean O'Dell
Author: "Secrets of Promise"


Top
 Profile Send private message  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject: Re: Authority over woman
PostPosted:  
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Sun Jun 20, 2004 12:40 pm +0000
Posts: 2565
YES AMEN

ITs ALL about TRUST

IMO ~ I Think ...


Top
 Profile Send private message  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject: Re: Authority over woman
PostPosted:  
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Mon Nov 15, 2004 12:37 pm +0000
Posts: 1471
Location: Hawaii
Aloha...Papers 82,83 & 84 has such insight of man and woman and the how's and why's we relate the way we do...this has been one of my favorite quotes and have thought of it often in my relationships...

[quote84:6.3 Male and female are, practically regarded, two distinct varieties of the same species living in close and intimate association. Their viewpoints and entire life reactions are essentially different; they are wholly incapable of full and real comprehension of each other. Complete understanding between the sexes is not attainable.][/quote]
:smile: da... :wink:

As for me...I grew up an only child and always hung with my Dad and I always wanted to please him and make him smile...I carried this into my relationships...that's a hard dance to follow. I have been single for many moons and do the work/repairs around the house and yard...if I had a man in my life and he was out cutting the grass I know what I'd be doing...making lunch...and loving it :wink:

Those papers also speaks of the woman (in the cave with child) and the reason the man came home is cause he was hungry...lol

_________________
A fellow Agondonter...


Top
 Profile Send private message  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject: Re: Authority over woman
PostPosted:  
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Wed Aug 11, 2010 2:19 pm +0000
Posts: 291
Location: Rome - Italy
For Gerdean
L'uomo non ha alcun diritto di decidere, di agire e di dettare norme sugli altri uomini nel senso che l'anima non si basa su di una presunta differenza di sesso. E di conseguenza anche la donna è un individuo tale e quale come l'uomo. Il fatto poi che la donna deleghi all'uomo il decidere su tali questioni o su certe azioni può essere qualcosa che non è prettamente tipico della donna, infatti anche l'uomo delega spesso certe azioni o compiti alla sua donna o moglie.
_________
Translaction
_________
For Gerdean
The man has no right to decide, to act and to issue rules on other men in the sense that the soul is not based on an alleged difference of sex. And thus the woman is an individual as such as humans. The fact that the man the woman delegates decide on these issues or on certain actions may be something that is not strictly typical of women, because even the man often delegate certain actions or tasks to his woman or wife.

_________________
The desire that rests in God the Father is the source of all grace.


Top
 Profile Send private message  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject: Re: Authority over woman
PostPosted:  
Offline

Joined: Wed Nov 08, 2006 8:29 pm +0000
Posts: 2441
I think its alway's important for me to remember that in reality our personality's are not male or female and eventually we become non-sex beings, even the term god the "father" jesus does not infer that God is a Male. with that in mind it can kind of change the way I think about quotes like that.

If you think from a purely animalistic point of a view, you can get pretty strong emotional reaction's to any quote about male and female because right now in our world we sooo much think of each other as "male" or "female", when we are truley all "sons". I know there is a quote in urantia somewhere where jesus states in heaven there is neither male nor female nor rich nor poor. If you consider that first then it sorta change's perspective.

Material Sons and Daughter's of the mansion world's though are much more "male" and "female" then we are though so that quote would probably have more meaning to them.

_________________
StrongcharactersRnotderivedfromnotdoingwrongbutratherfrom
actuallydoingrightUnselfishnesisthebadgeofhumangreatnes
Thehighestlevelsofselfrealizationareatainedbyworshipandservice
Thehapyandefectivepersonismotivatednotbyfearofwrongdoingbutby
loveofrightdoing


Top
 Profile Send private message  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject: Re: Authority over woman
PostPosted:  
Offline

Joined: Thu Jul 27, 2006 11:47 am +0000
Posts: 171
boomshuka wrote:
I think its alway's important for me to remember that in reality our personality's are not male or female and eventually we become non-sex beings


That's not exactly true, boomshuka. Though after this life in the flesh we are no longer sexual beings in the physical reproductive sense, we always retain some level of "maleness" and "femaleness".

Quote:
84:6.6 Men and women need each other in their morontial and spiritual as well as in their mortal careers. The differences in viewpoint between male and female persist even beyond the first life and throughout the local and superuniverse ascensions. And even in Havona, the pilgrims who were once men and women will still be aiding each other in the Paradise ascent. Never, even in the Corps of the Finality, will the creature metamorphose so far as to obliterate the personality trends that humans call male and female; always will these two basic variations of humankind continue to intrigue, stimulate, encourage, and assist each other; always will they be mutually dependent on co-operation in the solution of perplexing universe problems and in the overcoming of manifold cosmic difficulties.

_________________
"If a man places a gulf between himself and God, this gulf will bring fear. But if a man finds the support of the Invisible and Ineffable, he is free from fear." --from the Taittiriya Upanishad


Top
 Profile Send private message  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject: Re: Authority over woman
PostPosted:  
Offline

Joined: Tue Mar 30, 2010 1:24 am +0000
Posts: 416
Male: Fatherlike, indwelling, love...; Female: Sonlike, enshrouding, mercy... The Father and the Son are One.

Somehow, we have to elevate our intellect, which is a gift of the local Universe Spirit, above sex, which is also a gift of the local Universe Spirit. Notice our heads are above, and our groins are below as bipeds.

The revelation tells there are Love dominated Creator Sons and Mercy dominated Creator Sons. Jesus Christ Michael according to the revelation is a Mercy dominated Creator Son, or Nebadon is more Sonlike in set-up.


Top
 Profile Send private message  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject: Re: Authority over woman
PostPosted:  
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Sun Jan 29, 2006 4:19 pm +0000
Posts: 959
Female: Sonlike? Is it so difficult to find a descriptive word for "female"?
We are animalistic in nature and words do carry weight, so to consistently apply only male terminology to describe both genders limits our view/understanding in this time.

Today's quote addressed this...sort of, well...kind of:

(1769.9) 159:5.7 "Jesus made the care of God for man like the solicitude of a loving father ...and then made this teaching the cornerstone of his religion. And thus did the doctrine of the fatherhood of God make imperative the practice of the brotherhood of man."

We have turned this simple example into concrete and haven't been able to elevate it much at all. And then...we receive an amazing revelation but the words are still embedded with the same terminology.

Sorry, just one of my bones to pick. I can understand the reasons why the revelators used this old language to a certain extent, but only to a certain extent. I, and would imagine that I'm not alone, cannot identify with being a "son".

Peace

_________________
No longer can man presume to monopolize the ministry of religious service. ...among the followers of Jesus woman has been forever set free from all religious discriminations based on gender. TUB pg 2065 (194:3.14)


Top
 Profile Send private message  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject: Re: Authority over woman
PostPosted:  
Offline

Joined: Tue Mar 30, 2010 1:24 am +0000
Posts: 416
A human being consists of a composite of experiences. A word simple such as "Son" invokes different experiences while a person' attention rests upon it. Whatever experience dominating at the moment becomes the identifying feeling of the moment. If one is impartial of one's sex, one may identify "Son" more with the relationship of Parent Child. In all these symbols, the spirit essence is the same:

Son in highest means a personal being enshrouding/revealing the Father. Word symbols depicting personal identity should first be related to the Original Personality Giver, then all the conflicts within can be resolved. Differences within sons are secondary due to the relationship to the Original Son and so on. We identify with our parents long before we know we are little girls and boys.

Please notice a seraphim is not called a son, nor classified with sons of God.

In a convoluted way, "Son" is more functionally, meaningfully, and relationally correct in corresponding to the language used by the revelators.

In addition, when the revelation is given in English, there are spiritual (super-material) counter-parts made for the words and symbols revealed so that a reader may experience higher realities while engaging in intensive studying of the revelation.

Impartiality is important.

Quote:
P.1773 - §5 The wise and effective solution of any problem demands that the mind shall be free from bias, passion, and all other purely personal prejudices which might interfere with the disinterested survey of the actual factors that go to make up the problem presenting itself for solution. The solution of life problems requires courage and sincerity. Only honest and brave individuals are able to follow valiantly through the perplexing and confusing maze of living to where the logic of a fearless mind may lead. And this emancipation of the mind and soul can never be effected without the driving power of an intelligent enthusiasm which borders on religious zeal. It requires the lure of a great ideal to drive man on in
P.1774 - §0 the pursuit of a goal which is beset with difficult material problems and manifold intellectual hazards.


The trick is to look above/within for the highest value and greatest meaning instead of dwelling upon what is below and around (without); otherwise, our energy will be wasted upon more mechanically associated external realities.


Top
 Profile Send private message  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject: Re: Authority over woman
PostPosted:  
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Sun Jan 29, 2006 4:19 pm +0000
Posts: 959
Quote:
In a convoluted way, "Son" is more functionally, meaningfully, and relationally correct in corresponding to the language used by the revelators.



I can agree only with the "in a convoluted way".

Peace

_________________
No longer can man presume to monopolize the ministry of religious service. ...among the followers of Jesus woman has been forever set free from all religious discriminations based on gender. TUB pg 2065 (194:3.14)


Top
 Profile Send private message  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject: Re: Authority over woman
PostPosted:  
Offline

Joined: Tue Mar 30, 2010 1:24 am +0000
Posts: 416
Man: Fatherlike mortal son: Woman: Sonlike mortal son. Fatherlike and Sonlike are more or less the inherited characters from the Original Persons of Deity.

The Father and The Son are equal, but not the same. However, when we talk about Brotherhood of man, man means the class of mortal sons. English does not have a symbol for the class of mortal creature. It seems to be a natural pick to use the Fatherlike symbol to represent the class which contains Fatherlike and Sonlike differences, knowing the primalness of the Father.


Top
 Profile Send private message  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject: Re: Authority over woman
PostPosted:  
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Mon Dec 27, 2004 12:42 pm +0000
Posts: 2411
Location: Central New Mexico, USA
Tony, these points are clearly understood!

The issue is a language problem, not a comprehension problem. Since they had to make up a word, or a phrase -- Thought Adjuster or Mystery Monitor or God Fragment -- to describe the still small voice within, and they made up other words where ours were inadequate, it would have been nice to have found terminology that didn't perpetuate the sense of second-rate citizenship that women were given by Paul when he undertook to override Jesus emancipation of women 2,000 years ago!

It sounds natural to you because you are a son, a male. It is not natural to women to be sons, men. We are women! Men and women don't even think alike. We have different responses to life's circumstances. But by lumping us into the category of "humanity," we have to move over and make room for the male perspective, since it is dominant - precisely because of this language glitch. You don't have to interpret the pronouns every time they are used. How would you like it if the tables were turned and you were constantly referred to as a daughter or as a "her" or as "she"? You would begin to feel as if you didn't have a viable identity!

_________________
Gerdean O'Dell
Author: "Secrets of Promise"


Top
 Profile Send private message  
Reply with quote  
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 159 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7 ... 11  Next

All times are UTC - 7 hours


Who is online

Registered users: fanofVan, Google Feedfetcher, Majestic-12 [Bot]


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You can post attachments in this forum

Search for:
Jump to:  
Powered by phpBB® Forum Software © phpBB Group