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 Post subject: The Spirit Speaks
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I have friends who have told me that the Holy Spirit has spoken to them. Direct from the mouth of God. I donít know, some of these communications just didnít sound right. One friend told me that Godís Spirit instructed him and his family to leave a church and go to another church because the preacher wasnít preaching the Bible. Why would the Holy Spirit care what church someone worshipped in? Another friend told me that the Holy Spirit laid it on her heart to have her car repaired, even though she couldnít afford it, and God would provide the money. Why would God become involved in a decision concerning auto repair? This same woman told me that the Holy Spirit told her to leave her husband because he was abusive to her. Now that I could understand! Because of these encounters I have wondered how God communicates to us through Godís Spirit. And more pointedly, does the Spirit of God speak to us verbally? Or, does the Spirit speak to us in a different way?

We know that Godís Spirit speaks to us in some wonderful way (96.7). The question is ñ how? The book says that the Spirit of Truth from the Creator Son and the Holy Spirit from the Creative Mother Spirit hover over us to teach truth, enlighten the spirit, inspire our souls and lead us to heaven (379.5). These two spiritual ministers manifest themselves in such a way that we cannot tell the difference between them (380.4). How they teach and inspire appears to be in a different form than how we would normally expect. Both spiritual ministers ìdo not contact or indwell the thinking centers of the individual mindî (379.7). This last passage suggests that they do not ëspeakí to us in the normal way we perceive the spoken word. The words ëteachí, ëenlightení, ëinspireí, and ëleadí are all action words that lead me to think that if the Spirit is not in contact with the thinking center of my mind then the Spirit is communicating is a way that causes me to want to take action.

The Infinite Spiritís influence upon us is described in action words as well. The Spirit empowers us to overcome selfishness (381.3). The Spirit leads us forward, but never forces us to do the Fathers will (381.5). The Spirit leads people to bear spiritual fruit (381.7). Once again these passages do not talk about verbal communication. Instead, they tell us that the Spirit prompts us to do spiritual things. We see the Spiritís influence in people through their actions. The Infinite Spirit is called the God of action in the Urantia Book and so it is action not words that is the focus of the Spiritís inspiration.

In the fourth part of the book the Spirit of Truth is called the ìconviction of truthî (1949.3). This passage seems to point to a knowledge that is experiential ñ a knowing through doing. The book says that divine truth from the Spirit is the ability to know the truth ñ to live the truth (1949.4). Once again the emphasis is on action and not upon the written or spoken word. Other quotes in the Urantia Book reinforce this. The Spirit of Truth draws truth seekers towards the Creator Son (377.7). The Spirit becomes more effective as people act upon the divine leading (379.6). So the Spiritís presence inspires us to take action, to live through the Spiritís direction. This is a different emphasis than the idea of the Spirit whispering in our ears.

Alas for my friend, God is speaking to her but maybe not the way she has always thought. I think that as we attempt to understand more about God the subject becomes more complicated. The authors of the book try to use our language to explain things but it falls short. Understanding that the Holy Spirit and the Spirit of Truth speak verbally is too simplistic. God communicates to us and moves us to action in ways that are beyond Urantiaís language capabilities. What to keep focused upon is that communication happens however it happens. God is speaking to everyone of us. God is urging us to take part in the thrilling adventure that awaits all who dare to move forward into the timeless universe.


God Bless You,
Bill
www.simplemansub.info


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Dear friends,

I ran across this essay while finally going through all of my forum, i thought it interesting, and possible to talk about.

If others feel it's not in the right forum,. just let me know. But it was a \"new\" perspective and hadn't been viewed in essays.

Let me know what you think
Angel


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Hi Angel and William,

I think this is exactly the right forum to discuss this type of thing.

What William has said has been my experience for a long time. I feel led, but seldom if ever verbally.

With the rise and popularity of Pentecostalism I also have had people openly tell me that Spirit told them to do thus and such. I don't judge this experience, I just know that it's not my experience. I often feel guided and often I have noticed that the answer to my prayers comes from some other God knowing and God loving human. For instance, I might confess to God that I feel overwhelmed or frustrated and some dear friend will call me, for no special reason but just because I was on their mind. They then say something in the course of our conversation that helps me to put my issues into perspective. This happens to me on a regular basis.

I don't need to understand all of the mechanisms by which my Heavenly Father and his loyal associates minister to me, I just know that he does and that they do also. Knowing how respectful of free will our unseen friends and allies are (\"...the Supreme Rulers of the universe stand back in merciful respect for these prerogatives of will and potentials of personality!.\"), and knowing that \"the spirit never drives, only leads,\" I find that spirit guidance is a very subtle phenomenon. However, I have also come to believe that our celestial care takers can and often do take drastic measures at times if they need to save some human of destiny.
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P.1207 - ß6 For many thousands of years, so the records of Jerusem show, in each generation there have lived fewer and fewer beings who could function safely with self-acting Adjusters. This is an alarming picture, and the supervising personalities of Satania look with favor upon the proposals of some of your more immediate planetary supervisors who advocate the inauguration of measures designed to foster and conserve the higher spiritual types of the Urantia races.

For this reason I don't judge the extraordinary experiences of my fellows.
I've heard some pretty amazing stories too, one about a man who shot and killed another man, but then a sort of time rewind occurred and allowed this person to make another choice. Or one about a beautiful blonde man who came from out of nowhere and pulled a lone sail-boater who couldn't swim out of a turbulent lake in a sudden storm, set her back on her boat and saw her safely to the shore and then disappeared into nothing again.

When I hear these things I usually surmise, \"Another angel had to take extraordinary measures to foster a spiritual type of human.\" Not that all people who have experiences like this are people of destiny, but it's very possible that one of their children or grand children could be, or perhaps they are destined to touch the life of another human who will do some great thing for humanity.

The point is, I'm after trying to figure out what our unseen friends have to do to get us on course down here. I just have total faith that they will do whatever it takes. That thought gives me great comfort. I don't believe that they will ever do our job for us but I'm certain that they act as our safety net to ensure that we will indeed reach our planetary destiny.

Love.....Paula


Last edited by Paula on Fri May 13, 2005 10:40 am +0000, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: The Spirit Speaks
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William Whitehead wrote:
The authors of the book try to use our language to explain things but it falls short. Understanding that the Holy Spirit and the Spirit of Truth speak verbally is too simplistic. God communicates to us and moves us to action in ways that are beyond Urantiaís language capabilities.

Hi William:

At one point (according to the tale in the UB), the mighty Romans did not have a word for "unselfishness". Guess when enough people "get-it", it's easy enough to make up a new word. :smile:

Page 708 (the adventures of Andon and Fonta) - "Very early they learned to engage in verbal communication; by the age of ten they had worked out an improved sign and word language of almost half a hundred ideas and had greatly improved and expanded the crude communication technique of their ancestors. But try as they might, they were able to teach only a few of their new signs and symbols to their parents."

Are you sure the authors of the UB fell short in their use of the English language?

Ana


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Yes Ana: That has been my interputation, that we just don't have a large enough vocabulary or evolved far enough to understand all they wanted to say.


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Language, by necessity always lags experience. Until we are able to experience something, we have no need for a word with which to describe it. So, until that experience is broad enough, there is little chance of defining a term on which we can agree.

That's why the authors of the UB had to \"stretch\" some of our words to convey meanings they needed to share with us. We at least get a \"sense\" of that which we still really do not know.

Bro Dave

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Aloha...I have found through experience that if I consecrate my will with the leading of the Holy Spirit and back it with faith that things work out for the best and in retrospect I have the \"vision\" of why things turn out the way they do. Learning to relax and trust is ongoing for me...being a Agondonter and all... :wink: One of my favorite to rely upon is found on pg. 383...
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Having started out on the way of life everlasting, having accepted the assignment and received your orders to advance, do not fear the dangers of human forgetfulness and mortal inconstancy, do not be troubled with doubts of failure or by perplexing confusion, do not falter and question your status and standing, for in every dark hour, at every crossraod in the forward struggle, the Spirit of Truth will always speak, saying, \"This is the way.\"
Amen I say to that as I await to hear if I got the job I interviewed for on Friday...In light of this, yes, God and I are in constant communications...

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There is a universal language of the heavens it is called the Universal Language of Light. It is in a rather complete form used during the concecrated will to God during the seeking within.

Bits and pieces of it are very well known though the centuries and by many who have followed Jesus' direction regarding the kingdom within search.

Like mentioned in an above entry, language comes after the fact. You probably have unconcsiously already experienced pieces-it is a rather easy happenings.

William,

Consider some of these Moses and the big 10, Marys secrete, Jesus at Baptism,..Gods angels,God within, Heavenly administrators, all have a voice in things. They are also manefestations confirmations of accomplishments, directions, etc.

The\" voice\" is real- someday, somehow, somewhere you will experience this glorious happenings. It is excellent you question now - it opens the door for a super experience-probably when you least expect it too.

hugs, cm


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Speaking of speaks...Imagine when Peter, James and John...pg 1753
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When the three had been fast asleep for about half an hour, they were suddenly awakened by a near-by crackling sound, and much to their amazement and consternation, on looking about them, they beheld Jesus in intimate converse with two brilliant beings clothed in the habiliments of the light of the celestial world. And Jesus' face and form shone with the luminosity of a heavenly light. These three conversed in a strange language, but from certain things said, Peter erroneously conjectured that the beings with Jesus were Moses and Elijah; in reality, they were Gabriel and the Father Melchizedek. The physical controllers had arranged for the apostles to witness this scene because of Jesus' request.
I had the experience back in the 70's having been given the \"gifts of tongues\". I am skeptical of this generally speaking but do use it sometimes especially driving in the car when all I see speaks to the glory of God and words fall short to express my gratitude. Perhaps this would be an interesting new thread but does fall within \"Spiritual Experiences\" Was this what you were referring to in your post Carl?

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ms tootsie,

Loved that quote-somehow completely missed it. Can you imagine being there to witness that site! WOW!

about your question:
I would have to say no for me(only). I have not had the \"speaking in tongues\" experience.

When I pledged to do Gods will I was at great stressed lengths to understand the UB by living it and was asked(probably by guardian) \"How do you want to do this?\" I emediately said, \" pictures\"-since they convey many word concepts in one flick for me compared to words.

Each quiet time with pictures became coupled with a light manefestation that was very carefully organized to represent certain personalitites and their doings. I must also state the LoL was witnessed just about every quiet time.--well, like any useful language-it was used.

The Language of Light couples many olden recorded experiences with things like the pryimide on the back of the dollar(No, its not Black Masons-relax folks) and the all seeing Eye of Spirit- very common in mid-eastern thoughts.

I will look in my library to see if the Lof L booklet I compiled some years ago is still around. I gave a talk up state about LoL and was quite rewarded --there were persons who were also experiencing and recording the light language.

The LofL is a language in motion-the trinity reps, the heavenly hosts, angleics, even the choirs of musicians, dancers, etc are included. High personalities of great energies can also be witnessed-though not as a clothes entity/rather as a highlighted energy form.-like a landadeck son might have. There's more.. and because the LoL is in mortion simple sketches are really not true reps of the intended meaning(s). Fortunate when it is experienced it is in motion and evolving with related mind thought adjustments.

tootsie,

That quote, re the request by Jesus. NOTE the sound of crackling was the manefestation used to awaken the men- its the sound of a camp fire really burning-a definite awakening sound for them... WOW!, I still can't get over that quote. Its the LoL, its manefestations, its heavenly hosts working to do Gods(Jesus) bidding. And its the confirmation of Heavenly hosts-real personalities Jesus had taught about-seeing is believing...WOW!

Hugs, cm


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Carl...I know, it's a real mind blower as so many of the totally thrilling lines in the book. Oh to have been there and to think that in time we too will experience the same and more. I have to stay grounded and \"Be Here Now\" :razz: I am a real space-cadet :wink:

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Hello Peoples,

Yes.! Our Wonderful GOD does have those who truelly speak to one personally in actual words of voice BUT, is one of the voices actually that of the Holy Spirit? If so, which one?

The audible voice which has spoken to me in words whilst in dreams, I have always believed to be that of my Jesus from my Heavenly Father. It is truelly galvanising, kindly, gentle and yet very firm all at the same time. My belief in this stems from the words " My sheep know my voice." Who else can it be?

There is also the voice of the one who calls me by name when I have been going through sad/hurt/confused telling in prayer or meditation. Sometimes to me, this voice is that of my Jesus also as I am drawn to it in the same way as to the one in the dreams and yet at other times, I am not wholly sure if it is He. I just don't know yet how to hold on to the link when it is given to me or even if I am even meant to. :cry:

The voice of The One who spoke at my Baptism has had me often wondering if this could be the voice of my Heavenly Father as this One has been the most powerful voice of all so far. Even the deafening rushing of the winds could not disguise this voice from above and in it and through it I knew that I had been given in to the protection of my Jesus.

In the Urantia Book and others there are quite a few Spirits who are supposed to contact with a person in some way or other. It was so much more simple with just the Bible. :roll:

Love is everything
Georgie


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 Post subject: Re: The Spirit Speaks
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[quote="William Whitehead"]I have friends who have told me that the Holy Spirit has spoken to them. Direct from the mouth of God. I donít know, some of these communications just didnít sound right. One friend told me that Godís Spirit instructed him and his family to leave a church and go to another church because the preacher wasnít preaching the Bible. Why would the Holy Spirit care what church someone worshipped in? Another friend told me that the Holy Spirit laid it on her heart to have her car repaired, even though she couldnít afford it, and God would provide the money. Why would God become involved in a decision concerning auto repair? This same woman told me that the Holy Spirit told her to leave her husband because he was abusive to her. Now that I could understand! Because of these encounters I have wondered how God communicates to us through Godís Spirit. And more pointedly, does the Spirit of God speak to us verbally? Or, does the Spirit speak to us in a different way?

We know that Godís Spirit speaks to us in some wonderful way (96.7). The question is ñ how? God Bless You,
Bill
www.simplemansub.info

I began having very accurate intuition years ago. Sometimes about things such as having a car repaired. Then at some point I became able to actually access what I guess has to be my TA. I now have both and both very much influence my life in all aspects.
I think the communication with my TA is possible because I understand what it is for. Asking stupid questions that have no need of an answer are met with an amused silence on the rare occasion I ask them. But when I ask a question that is meaningful and will help my spiritual growth without it being a shortcut I recieve an answer.
Having had both experiences I think that the people who are constantly asking for help will not get true answers until they understand that having open communication with your TA (or the Holy Spirit as some prefer that term) is NOT about being helped. It's about getting answers that make life harder, it's about getting corrected when you have done something that you know is incorrect.
The people who get the "feeling" that God wants them to do this or that could be anything from guessing to flipping forward a bit into the future. But in my true experience the TA do not deal with the mundane side of life. They will answer questions about the experiences of mundane life but not about the basic chores of living, like money, cars, churches etc. All possibilities come from God so whatever they are experiencing unless it is simply fabricated is a gift of some sort, from where? The possibilities are many.
We cannot judge and decide what is happening with another person. Each person is so very unique and experiences the world and the experience of being here on Urantia differently. That is why we must respect each person's experiences as if they were our own.
There is no right or wrong. if they are truly reaching for diety they are on the right path. No one can know what is in their heart but God.
It is hard to hear people say that "Blank" told them this or that. It is hard because the person saying it is usually doing a little "one upping". There is the unspoken question of "What has "blank" told YOU lately, he has told ME this". Many people have not learned that they are "enough" just being who they are, thus the reason for this type of behavior. What we must do is to recognize that and help those people to understand that they are enough just being who they are and they are loved.

Dana


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Dana

Your "advice" concerning helping each other is interesting. Jesus had the gang in twos to allow an intercommunication with each other to farret out what was personally happening.

The use of the internet such as this site is in many ways a joining of each other to farret out each others internal happenings.

We must continue to compliment each other who are carefully unraveling the internal voice communications. In no way should we prevent such God and heavens communications in any email person(s) of sound mind.

This topic about the Voice brings up another area of Urantia recordings regarding what I call the 'Sadler' influence. This influence has many UB'ers super cautious regarding the voice. Yet the UB is riddled with the communications regarding not just voice, but light, song, feelings, forms, etc etc. Perhaps another site topic designated to bring forth the various manefestions UB 'hints' at would be interesting for viewers?

Hugs as we go,

cm


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 Post subject: Re: The Spirit Speaks
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Hello Dana,

" I think that the people who are constantly asking for help will not get true answers until they understand that having open communication with your TA (or the Holy Spirit as some prefer that term) is NOT about being helped."

It is my firm belief that when you need help or answers in anything within your life, turning to our Heavenly Father is the only sure place to go. What Truelly Loving Parent would not answer or would ignore a confused, or hurt, or questioning child.?

" It's about getting answers that make life harder,"

Ouch! You must certainly be so much older and stronger in Spirit than I am. I still have a very long way to go as yet.

" it's about getting corrected when you have done something that you know is incorrect."

Oh Yes, correction is something I do know about as I too have thought and said some bloomers that should not have been. Thankfully my Abba-Amma is very quick in loving forgiveness.

We may be two different types of peas Dana, but, we are still within the same pod big sister..

May our Father's Peace and Joy enter in too ease your struggles.
Georgie


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