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:?: How can a presentiment happen? Or maybe why do presentiments happen? Is there significance in the event.? Is this a part of the Devine/human eyeopener-a prelude of things to happen?

How can a time ahead be shown to the human who is in time dimension #1.? Or who would do this? Is this an angelic requirement as part of the human/angelic experiences? Could we have some UB references to back up the answers if possible?

Hugs, and thanks,
C
PS I define an advanced knowledge as a presentiment-knowing ahead of actual clock time.


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The only prescience I am familiar with, Carl, is the kind that if I don't pay my electric bill, they will shut off my electric power supply. If I don't get gas in my car, I'm going to get stranded alongside the road somewhere. I know these are not very glamorous examples of prescience, but they are the only ones I know to use as an example of cause and effect for that is what I think prescience is, as I understand it. If you cut your finger, it bleeds. If you break universe laws, you suffer the consequences. And anybody with an ounce of sense ought to be able to see it coming.

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Gerdean,

How am I breaking Universe Laws when the presence within is of the timeless/spaceless invirons? Does not the guardian assigned and the presence within desire to show this quality of our Creator.?

How can this desire to show background of the experienced presence within which arouses curiosity and interests be against Universal Laws when it comes from the Creator via loyal and trusted friends?

Or have you forgotten the task is not to just learn about Our Father but to go the next step and begin to understand Our Father Via the Lords early prayer words, '...Thy Kingdom Come.."

Or is your concept of the Kingdom always locked in time and space?

Interesting, how can we spiritually progress unless we are shown qualities of our Creator-two of which are time and space and the opposite yet knowledge there of of timeless and spacelessness

Hugs, c


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Ya got me, Carl.

As I said, I only know one kind: cause and effect. If there are others, I'm all ears. What did you have in mind? Maybe if I knew more about what you are trying to elicit, I would be able to come up with a better response.

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Haha... I tend to agree with Gerdean... it happens all the time and quite natural. Of course the strange ones stand out more... like deja vu. In the past few years I have had quite a few of those experiences... so strange.

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Arie,

Ah ha, the presentiments happen all the time- I wounder why??? Describe the unusal ones please-this could be very enlightening. Hmmmm

Hugs for your thoughts,
c


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I do not really remember any of the content... just the feeling that I experienced it before. One theory I came up with before is that perhaps I had the experience dreaming... or maybe through my 'psychic mind' which the UB talks about. Your right though... there are extraordinary psychic experiences such as the 'true prophetic visions' which is talked about in the ub now that I think about it.

I think perhaps though sometimes deja vu experiences are caused by experiencing something... like watching a commercial unconsciously or semiconsciously and then reexperiencing it consciously and 'feeling' like you experienced it before. Just sometimes... I don't think all the time. One weird thing that I remember is watching minority report and having a deja vu during that movie. You know how its about precognition and what not... now that was very strange. Haha! What do you guys think of deja vu?

In regards to the psychic mind... my thought is that perhaps when we make decisions in the present... our future is laid out before us... meaning in our psychic mind it is experienced already and maybe sometimes hues of that future which was actualized in our psychic mind by our decisions in the present 'leaks' into our present consciousness here and there. But of course that future to our present consciousness is only potential.. but in our future mind or on some dimension it is already actualized. haha Give me some perspective!

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It may be possible to see the future. God the Father knows all and knows the destiny of all. Do we not have the Thought Adjuster, a fragment of God? If it is within our necessity to know, I believe the Adjuster may communicate vital knowledge with us. Even that of the future. A theory states that if you knew everything in all the cosmos, the location of every atom and particle, then you can know the effect of every cause.


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Howdy, ya'll.

Clearly Carl in not talking about normal cause and effect. Carl asks how does a presentiment happen. First, we must establish that presentiments do happen. I'm not sure they do. I've had lots of feelings that seemed like presentiments after the fact. From that point, it's easy to pretend you knew it before the fact. Yes, there are tons of people claiming prescience, but so far, no one can prove it.

Then we have the problem of free will. If humans and other beings are indeed free will actors, then it is impossible to predict how they will act in every case. The whole chain lof cause and effect is subject to the whim of immature free-will creatures. That's what makes it so fun, and that's why the whole idea of predicting the future is rather pointless. Chris writes:
Quote:
A theory states that if you knew everything in all the cosmos, the location of every atom and particle, then you can know the effect of every cause.
This theory might have a chance of being true if the universe were a machine. But it's not. It's a Creation, full of half-baked free-will creatures like me.

For me, the key is not knowing what is going to happen in the future, but to fully engage the present with a mental attitude and spiritual posture that is rugged and flexible enough to deal with whatever each moment brings. The only reality we can touch is the present. It is now. Be here.

Peace,
Arc


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arcfiker

An interesting post, but I will reframe from alining with your perspectives.

One area, about feelings- that in my opion would be an area to explore --is the feelings you get at certain times. From my UB training and view, feelings are very close to TA contact-especially if they are devoid of emotions which tend to alter the intent of the feeling(s) manefestations.

There is much in UB about time and space and often timlessness and spacelessness, Universal mind, the TA expereinces available to share with the human subject and the happenings as one climbs the mansion worlds and beyond.

Much of the TA visual contacts (pictures, music, voice, etc--ie: manefestations) are often done without the human cognicant of time yet appreciative of timelessness. Manefestations are often referred in UB though not as a separate chapter but as an every day inclusion in the spiritual path info as one is brought to greater spiritual accomplishments.

Feelings are part of spiritual experiences. Women are often enlightned by their closeness to spirits reflective intuitions.. UB says the red haired race women had high amounts of spirited intuition ability. Intuition is often a manefestation of the actual.


Hugs, c


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Just to have a better idea of what we're talking about, I went to the dictionary and looked up presentiment which is "a feeling that something, especially of an unfortunate or evil nature, is about to take place; foreboding." I have only felt it once. In retrospect I believe it was my Adjuster forewarning me that we were going to walk through an experiential that I was not going to enjoy... and I didn't. It was like undergoing psychic surgery without anesthesia.

The presentiment occurred in whispy glimpses, coincidently, during the period of time I was reading "A Prayer For Owen Meany" by John Irving so I wondered, in retrospect, if there was something in that novel that triggered my sense of impending doom, but it really doesn't matter since what did come to pass was a profoundly empowering experience for me.

Perhaps these presentiments are similar to Jesus knowing he would be put to death, but going into Jerusalem anyway, since he knew what his destiny would be once his bestowal mission was finished.

In contrast, but along the same lines, here is an example of things going on in the Master's human consciousness that we could perhaps relate to, not with foreboding or deja vu but with sublime anticipation.

Quote:
On this Mediterranean journey Jesus made great advances in his human task of mastering the material and mortal mind, and his indwelling Adjuster made great progress in the ascension and spiritual conquest of this same human intellect. By the end of this tour Jesus virtually knew--with all human certainty--that he was a Son of God, a Creator Son of the Universal Father. The Adjuster more and more was able to bring up in the mind of the Son of Man shadowy memories of his Paradise experience in association with his divine Father ere he ever came to organize and administer this local universe of Nebadon. Thus did the Adjuster, little by little, bring to Jesus' human consciousness those necessary memories of his former and divine existence in the various epochs of the well-nigh eternal past. The last episode of his prehuman experience to be brought forth by the Adjuster was his farewell conference with Immanuel of Salvington just before his surrender of conscious personality to embark upon the Urantia incarnation. And this final memory picture of prehuman existence was made clear in Jesus' consciousness on the very day of his baptism by John in the Jordan. (P.1424 - §4)

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Gerdean

Beautiful UB stuff.

How many mothers of soldiers knew and yes, today know beforehand.??

Having lived in the times of four wars, been exposed to the calamities they cause and the heartbrakes of familes as loved ones die I have such a feeling for the truth of presentiments.

Peace within the mind.

Hugsa, c


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Hi, Carl.

Don't get me wrong, Carl. I do believe we are saturated in a sea of information that we access to varying degrees and varying clarity. And some of this information can add up to a pretty good picture of what might happen next. My ideas of time are actually quite flexible. My spiritual practice, unrelated to UB, deals a fair bit with accessing the totality of this sea of information, which includes other ways of looking at time. What I have found, however, is that day in, day out, I am most effective when I am focused on here and now.

I will share an experience dealing with one of those"funny" feelings. Back in the eighties, I backpacked from Utah to Texas (and beyond) to visit my family. Why backpacking? The devil made me do it. Or maybe my TA. Anyway, the whole trek was one amazing dash through reality. On my way back to Utah, I found myself ten miles north of Lubbock, Texas, walking into the teeth of a Blue Norther, a storm typical of this part of Texas this time of year. The wind howls from the north as frigid air dives into Texas from Canada. There's nothing between the Texas Panhandle and the North Pole except one barbed wire fence, and it doesn't stop much wind. Anyway, it was dusk, and low dark clouds scudded like angry buffalo right on top of my head. There was occasional thunder and lightning. To my right, through the gloom and wind, I could also hear jet planes taking off and landing in the murk. The Lubbock airport was over there somewhere. I could see the landing lights of the jets bursting from the clouds from time to time. And inside me, the feeling of death arose. As night drew down around me, and the clouds grew darker, the planes continued to come and go in the fierce storm. And my feeling of death grew to the point where I was certain that one of the jets would soon fall from that angry sky right in front of my eyes. I could almost see the flames. I walked on through the storm, expecting death in the air. But by and by I left the airport behind, and heard the jets no more. And had seen none crash. False alarm.

About midnight, after a refeshing 17 mile walk in the storm, I arrived the only light for miles around. A convenience store in a one horse town, where I puchased two glazed doughnuts and asked about catching a bus north. The lady said it comes right there in about five minutes. She pointed out the window to the courthouse across the street. I finished my doughnuts and walked across the street. The bus pulled up like magic. I jumped on, bought a ticket, and settled into a large comfy seat. As we pulled away cold rain began to pour.

I arrived in Pampa, Texas about seven am. My grandpa picked me up at the bus station. As I got in the car, the first words out of his mouth were "I guess you heard about Carl." I didn't have a clue what he was talking about. "Carl who?" I asked. "Carl Weathers" he said. Carl Weathers was a friend of the family. He was a drilling engineer, and had a light plane which he flew from job to job. He gave me my first airplane ride. "What about him?" I asked. Grandpa shook his head. "He crashed here last night trying to land in the storm. He's dead."

Is this a spiritual experience? I don't think so. Is this an example of a presentiment? I don't know. For me, this intense feeling of foreboding, while after the fact seemed to be so clear and astonishing, at the time it happened gave me no useful information about what was going to happen. In fact, my feeling my have been after the plane crash happened, not before. In any case, on a personal level, this is clear evidence of a "connectedness" which is much deeper and wider than we as a culture admit. My feelings and my friends death in a plane crash are hardly a coincidence. But I'm not sure what it all means.

Carl, is this the type of thing you are referring to?

Peace,
Arc


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Arc,

WOW, some real happenings! I would consider answering yes or no but I've had so many of those 'alone' experiences working the water front in Ny-fog, failing equipment, etc. that the after effect you relate(right?) is real, very real for me. Is it the pre situation-I would probably say... probably no..

What's interesting is I've never considered an after intuitive or presentiment expereince-atleast non I can remember- Now you have me looking into this effect....

Thanks for the enlightment.
:smile:

Hugs, carl


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Speaking of "pre-situations" here's one I just cannot resist.

In my novel (which I completed in 1991), in Chapter One there is a massive black-out, a power failure, that covers the entire state of New York; it extends south along the eastern seaboard, goes up into the New England states, and as far west as Cleveland. It occurs, significantly and specifically, on August 14th.

Not long ago -- maybe 2003 -- in "real life" there was a massive power failure that covered that same essential area of the northeast corner of the United States ... on August 14th.

I consider it prophetic, but what do I know? I'm just the author.

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