Urantia Book Forum

Urantia Book Discussion Board : Study Group
It is currently Sat Dec 07, 2019 1:25 pm +0000

All times are UTC - 7 hours




Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 62 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1, 2, 3, 4, 5  Next
Author Message
PostPosted:  
Offline

Joined: Wed Feb 20, 2019 12:11 pm +0000
Posts: 932
I like the idea of the potential of a pairing being greater than the potential of each individual combined. It makes me think of the midwayers and how they were brought about. It also seems that the potentials of all three levels of reality are affected by harmonious pairing, physical, mental and spiritual.

Rodan of Alexandria said:

(1775.5) 160:2.4 Symbolic communication between human beings predetermines the bringing into existence of social groups. The most effective of all social groups is the family, more particularly the two parents. Personal affection is the spiritual bond which holds together these material associations. Such an effective relationship is also possible between two persons of the same sex, as is so abundantly illustrated in the devotions of genuine friendships.

Personal affection is a spiritual bond that facilitates spiritual living and Rodan goes on to describe four beneficial factors that result from it:

Mutual self-expression and self-understanding
Union of souls-the mobilization of wisdom
Enthusiasm for living
Enhanced defense against all evil

The union of souls intrigues me. The pooling of spiritual possessions prevents the devastating effects of failing human wisdom.

no sophist wrote:
Think about after his babtism, he could have left then and had his universe to command.


If Michael decided to complete his incarnation after his baptism, wouldn't he have also had to go through the entire mansion world experience as part of his bestowal?


Top
 Profile Send private message  
Reply with quote  
PostPosted:  
Offline

Joined: Wed Apr 13, 2011 5:21 am +0000
Posts: 966
Quote:
But it did say he completed his “service” of universe experience. Does service cover “all” aspects of human experience?

Think about after his babtism, he could have left then and had his universe to command.



i think acquiring the viewpoint and understandings of all human experience was the goal rather than experiencing all experience per se if you get my drift. to be "tried and tested on all points" is common to all the bestowals though. to the degree that His pre-baptismal experience was a "revelation of man to God" and post-baptism was a "revelation of God to man" i reckon we could say that the experience of revealing God to man is an aspect of human experience that wasn't required. but the papers do say that the supreme spiritual purpose of the bestowal was to enhance the revelation of God, so i see it as he had completed the administrative purposes of acquiring the insights and wisdoms of a perfect Ruler to all creatures, but not the spiritual purpose.


Top
 Profile Send private message  
Reply with quote  
PostPosted:  
Offline

Joined: Sun Mar 25, 2012 5:29 am +0000
Posts: 3955
SEla_Kelly wrote:
I thought that the logical extenuation of the Eternal Son into the identity of the Creator Son would have been self-evident. That the Creator Son is also the Creator Mother of Nebadon, just as the Eternal Son is also the Eternal Mother of the grand universe, whereas such Michael is referred to as "He" in either case.


First of all Stephen...Creator Sons are NOT identity extenuations so that is certainly NOT self evident. Next the Creator Son is NOT the Creator Mother of any local universe.

Quoting the text would help you so much to reduce such falsehoods and fictions. But you refuse to read or quote the actual book. Pity.

Consider reading the text: Papers 6-9 for the actual names, functions, and relationships of these two members of the Trinity.

Have you not read throughout the Papers that Michael IS the Father or representative OF the Father to all creatures in time and space and of his co-creation with the local Mother Spirit???


As to the Son:

6:0.1 (73.1) THE Eternal Son is the perfect and final expression of the “first” personal and absolute concept of the Universal Father. Accordingly, whenever and however the Father personally and absolutely expresses himself, he does so through his Eternal Son, who ever has been, now is, and ever will be, the living and divine Word. And this Eternal Son is residential at the center of all things, in association with, and immediately enshrouding the personal presence of, the Eternal and Universal Father.

6:0.3 (73.3) The Eternal Son is the spiritual personalization of the Paradise Father’s universal and infinite concept of divine reality, unqualified spirit, and absolute personality. And thereby does the Son constitute the divine revelation of the creator identity of the Universal Father. The perfect personality of the Son discloses that the Father is actually the eternal and universal source of all the meanings and values of the spiritual, the volitional, the purposeful, and the personal.

7:0.1 (81.1) THE Original Son is ever concerned with the execution of the spiritual aspects of the Father’s eternal purpose as it progressively unfolds in the phenomena of the evolving universes with their manifold groups of living beings. We do not fully comprehend this eternal plan, but the Paradise Son undoubtedly does.

7:0.2 (81.2) The Son is like the Father in that he seeks to bestow everything possible of himself upon his co-ordinate Sons and upon their subordinate Sons. And the Son shares the Father’s self-distributive nature in the unstinted bestowal of himself upon the Infinite Spirit, their conjoint executive.

And the actual Mother Spirit:

8:2.2 (92.3) The Third Source and Center is known by numerous titles: the Universal Spirit, the Supreme Guide, the Conjoint Creator, the Divine Executive, the Infinite Mind, the Spirit of Spirits, the Paradise Mother Spirit, the Conjoint Actor, the Final Co-ordinator, the Omnipresent Spirit, the Absolute Intelligence, the Divine Action; and on Urantia he is sometimes confused with the cosmic mind.

8:3.3 (93.5) The Eternal Son and the Conjoint Creator have, as partners and through their co-ordinate personalities, planned and fashioned every post-Havona universe which has been brought into existence. The Spirit sustains the same personal relation to the Son in all subsequent creation that the Son sustains to the Father in the first and central creation.

8:3.4 (93.6) A Creator Son of the Eternal Son and a Creative Spirit of the Infinite Spirit created you and your universe; and while the Father in faithfulness upholds that which they have organized, it devolves upon this Universe Son and this Universe Spirit to foster and sustain their work as well as to minister to the creatures of their own making.

8:4.2 (94.4) God is love, the Son is mercy, the Spirit is ministry—the ministry of divine love and endless mercy to all intelligent creation. The Spirit is the personification of the Father’s love and the Son’s mercy; in him are they eternally united for universal service. The Spirit is love applied to the creature creation, the combined love of the Father and the Son.

8)


Last edited by fanofVan on Tue Apr 09, 2019 1:50 pm +0000, edited 1 time in total.

Top
 Profile Send private message  
Reply with quote  
PostPosted:  
Offline

Joined: Sun Mar 25, 2012 5:29 am +0000
Posts: 3955
katroofjebus wrote:
I like the idea of the potential of a pairing being greater than the potential of each individual combined. It makes me think of the midwayers and how they were brought about. It also seems that the potentials of all three levels of reality are affected by harmonious pairing, physical, mental and spiritual.

Rodan of Alexandria said:

(1775.5) 160:2.4 Symbolic communication between human beings predetermines the bringing into existence of social groups. The most effective of all social groups is the family, more particularly the two parents. Personal affection is the spiritual bond which holds together these material associations. Such an effective relationship is also possible between two persons of the same sex, as is so abundantly illustrated in the devotions of genuine friendships.

Personal affection is a spiritual bond that facilitates spiritual living and Rodan goes on to describe four beneficial factors that result from it:

Mutual self-expression and self-understanding
Union of souls-the mobilization of wisdom
Enthusiasm for living
Enhanced defense against all evil

The union of souls intrigues me. The pooling of spiritual possessions prevents the devastating effects of failing human wisdom.

no sophist wrote:
Think about after his babtism, he could have left then and had his universe to command.


If Michael decided to complete his incarnation after his baptism, wouldn't he have also had to go through the entire mansion world experience as part of his bestowal?


Perhaps the Mansion World experience is not necessary? Remember that Michael's 5th bestowal was as a spirit-mortal ascender and the 6th was as a morontia-mortal ascender. His 7th was as a mortal ascender born on an evolutionary world as a babe of the material realm.

Great points and discussion by all....well...almost all! Hahaha.

:wink: :biggrin:


Top
 Profile Send private message  
Reply with quote  
PostPosted:  
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Sun Jan 22, 2012 11:16 pm +0000
Posts: 1122
Location: Nanticoke NY
The fact that Michael is the Creator of Adam and Eve (51:0.2, 51:1.2) "these sons are the material gift of the creator son to the inhabited worlds", and not the Divine Minister of Nebadon, shows the capacity of Creator. Who is a creator, in this sense the Creator Son Michael is the Conjoint Parent: both a Mother and a Father of each Adam & Eve. "Conjoint Parent", n: one who as Creator is both the mother and the father unto the life of a being.

171:4.7 Then turning to his apostles, Jesus said: “From olden times the prophets have perished in Jerusalem, and it is only befitting that the Son of Man should go up to the city of the Father's house to be offered up as the price of human bigotry and as the result of religious prejudice and spiritual blindness. O Jerusalem, Jerusalem, which kills the prophets and stones the teachers of truth! How often would I have gathered your children together even as a hen gathers her own brood under her wings, but you would not let me do it! Behold, your house is about to be left to you desolate! You will many times desire to see me, but you shall not. You will then seek but not find me.” And when he had spoken, he turned to those around him and said: “Nevertheless, let us go up to Jerusalem to attend the Passover and do that which becomes us in fulfilling the will of the Father in heaven.”
Jesus describes the pattern of his longing for the people of Jerusalem as in a "Hen": i.e. a female or mother chicken. This shows how Jesus had a unified personality both mother and father to all human inhabitants of Nebadon. This is in coincidence with a human individual who has consecrated his own actions to doing the universal father's will.

My interpretation: the language used to describe the Eternal Son implies that the Eternal Son can also be considered as the Eternal Mother or the Eternal Mother-Son in every instance where the identification of Eternal Son is made.

_________________
to the Underlaying Unity of All Life so that the Voice of Intuition may guide Us closer to Our Common Keeper


Last edited by SEla_Kelly on Tue Apr 09, 2019 11:32 am +0000, edited 1 time in total.

Top
 Profile Send private message  
Reply with quote  
PostPosted:  
Offline

Joined: Wed Feb 20, 2019 12:11 pm +0000
Posts: 932
fanofVan wrote:
Perhaps the Mansion World experience is not necessary?


Perhaps not. Perhaps Michael's sex-deficiency was immaterial to his overall experience. Humans apparently need "average sex relations on their native spheres" for its "social, intellectual, emotional, and spiritual aspects". Michael must have compensated in other ways.

We do know that one of the most important experiences for Michael on his final bestowal was to:

(1325.5) 120:1.3 " - know in very truth the full meaning and the rich significance of that faith-trust which you so unvaryingly require all your creatures to master as a part of their intimate relationship with you as their local universe Creator and Father."

Aren't "average sex relations" meant ideally to contribute to the development of faith-trust, particularly trust? Wouldn't that be the most valuable lesson one can learn from an intimate relationship, either human or divine? It is possible that Michael experienced the significance of trust and all its social, intellectual, emotional and spiritual aspects from his intimate personal relationships with humans and with his Father in heaven, without the need to include sex as part of the formula.


Top
 Profile Send private message  
Reply with quote  
PostPosted:  
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Sun Jan 22, 2012 11:16 pm +0000
Posts: 1122
Location: Nanticoke NY
katroof 33:2.1 discloses how the identity of expression in the personalities of the >700,000 Creator Sons of the Grand Universe have combinence, of up to the equal expression of both Universal Father and Eternal Mother-Son, usually moreso the characteristics of the Eternal Mother-Son in the Creator Sons' own personality attributes. But I w'ill point to the fact of the very Nature(Origin) of Creator Sons [21:1.1 "there flashes into full-fledged being a new and original Creator Son, the only-begotten Son of the perfect ideal and the powerful idea whose union produces this new creator personality of power and perfection."] The Creator Son is nevertheless as in the creation of the Infinite Spirit, the third member of Deity, whose birth is described in similar magnitude [8:1.4 "flash" used colloquially in Urantia Papers to suggest an immediate and eternal manifestation, a Creator-Prerogative of the Infinite Spirit]. "the first Paradise order of sonship, the Creator Sons" have "The divine natures of these Creator Sons are, in principle, derived equally from the attributes of both Paradise parents," even though created by the Infinite Spirit.

21:2.5 (236.3) 2. Creature designs and types are controlled by the Eternal Son. Before a Creator Son may engage in the creation of any new type of being, any new design of creature, he must secure the consent of the Eternal and Original Mother Son. Why do you protest something: the idea that the Creator Son Michael is the Original Mother Son of Nebadon, whereas personality is an attribute of only the Universal Father.

Maybe it is because you are fail to recognise that the Universal Father is also the Original Mother, the Mother-Father of the Eternal Mother-Son.

_________________
to the Underlaying Unity of All Life so that the Voice of Intuition may guide Us closer to Our Common Keeper


Last edited by SEla_Kelly on Wed Apr 10, 2019 7:23 am +0000, edited 1 time in total.

Top
 Profile Send private message  
Reply with quote  
PostPosted:  
Offline

Joined: Wed Feb 20, 2019 12:11 pm +0000
Posts: 932
SEla_Kelly wrote:
Jesus describes the pattern of his longing for the people of Jerusalem as in a "Hen": i.e. a female or mother chicken


There are many species of birds where both the male and female incubate their eggs.


Top
 Profile Send private message  
Reply with quote  
PostPosted:  
Offline

Joined: Sun Mar 25, 2012 5:29 am +0000
Posts: 3955
SEla_Kelly wrote:
katroof 33:2.1 discloses how the identity of expression in the personalities of the >700,000 Creator Sons of the Grand Universe have combinence, of up to the equal expression of both Universal Father and Eternal Mother-Son, usually moreso the characteristics of the Eternal Mother-Son in the Creator Sons' own personality attributes. But I w'ill point to the fact of the very Nature(Origin) of Creator Sons [21:1.1 "there flashes into full-fledged being a new and original Creator Son, the only-begotten Son of the perfect ideal and the powerful idea whose union produces this new creator personality of power and perfection."] The Creator Son is nevertheless as in the creation of the Infinite Spirit, the third member of Deity, whose birth is described in similar magnitude [8:1.4 "flash" used colloquially in Urantia Papers to suggest an immediate and eternal manifestation, a Creator-Prerogative of the Infinite Spirit]. "the first Paradise order of sonship, the Creator Sons" have "The divine natures of these Creator Sons are, in principle, derived equally from the attributes of both Paradise parents," even though created by the Infinite Spirit.

21:2.5 (236.3) 2. Creature designs and types are controlled by the Eternal Son. Before a Creator Son may engage in the creation of any new type of being, any new design of creature, he must secure the consent of the Eternal and Original Mother Son. Why do you protest something: the idea that the Creator Son Michael is the Original Mother Son of Nebadon, whereas personality is an attribute of only the Universal Father.

Maybe it is because you are fail to recognise that the Universal Father is also the Original Mother, the Mother-Father of the Eternal Mother-Son.


Combinence????????????????

The Creator Son is not the third member of the Trinity or Deity (and of course, Deity has more than 3 members).

The "flash" in 8:1 has to do with the creation of Havona by the Infinite Spirit (Mother).

The "flash" in 21:1 is the creation of the Creator Sons by liaison between the First and the Second Source and Center or members of the Trinity.

But I did find quotes referring to the Eternal Son as the Original Mother Son and the Eternal Mother Son. I wish you had simply posted those Stephen. But my own research delivers new knowledge to me nonetheless so I am thankful for your assistance in pointing out these descriptions of the Eternal Son's relationship to other Sons.

These are off topic perhaps but I wanted to post them and acknowledge my own lack of memory regarding this issue. Not many quotes about the issue (5) but enough to warrant my appreciation:

7:5.9 (87.3) Whatever else this original Michael revealed, he made the transcendent bestowal of the Original Mother Son real to the creatures of Havona. So real, that forevermore each pilgrim of time who labors in the adventure of making the Havona circuits is cheered and strengthened by the certain knowledge that the Eternal Son of God seven times abdicated the power and glory of Paradise to participate in the experiences of the time-space pilgrims on the seven circuits of progressive Havona attainment.

7:6.7 (88.5) Between the Original Mother Son and these hosts of Paradise Sons scattered throughout all creation, there is a direct and exclusive channel of communication, a channel whose function is inherent in the quality of spiritual kinship which unites them in bonds of near-absolute spiritual association. This intersonship circuit is entirely different from the universal circuit of spirit gravity, which also centers in the person of the Second Source and Center. All Sons of God who take origin in the persons of the Paradise Deities are in direct and constant communication with the Eternal Mother Son. And such communication is instantaneous; it is independent of time though sometimes conditioned by space.

21:1.3 (235.2) The divine natures of these Creator Sons are, in principle, derived equally from the attributes of both Paradise parents. All partake of the fullness of the divine nature of the Universal Father and of the creative prerogatives of the Eternal Son, but as we observe the practical outworking of the Michael functions in the universes, we discern apparent differences. Some Creator Sons appear to be more like God the Father; others more like God the Son. For example: The trend of administration in the universe of Nebadon suggests that its Creator and ruling Son is one whose nature and character more resemble that of the Eternal Mother Son. It should be further stated that some universes are presided over by Paradise Michaels who appear equally to resemble God the Father and God the Son. And these observations are in no sense implied criticisms; they are simply a recording of fact.

21:2.5 (236.3) 2. Creature designs and types are controlled by the Eternal Son. Before a Creator Son may engage in the creation of any new type of being, any new design of creature, he must secure the consent of the Eternal and Original Mother Son.

21:5.10 (241.4) The Master Sons seem to be in perfect communication with their bestowal worlds, not only the worlds of their personal sojourn but all worlds whereon a Magisterial Son has bestowed himself. This contact is maintained by their own spiritual presence, the Spirit of Truth, which they are able to “pour out upon all flesh.” These Master Sons also maintain an unbroken connection with the Eternal Mother Son at the center of all things. They possess a sympathetic reach which extends from the Universal Father on high to the lowly races of planetary life in the realms of time.


Top
 Profile Send private message  
Reply with quote  
PostPosted:  
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Sun Jan 22, 2012 11:16 pm +0000
Posts: 1122
Location: Nanticoke NY
Right- so both male and female creature designs controlled by the Eternal Mother-Son, so would the male and female: Adam and Eve, be interdependent on each other in order to obtain the full expression of potential for Adamic life in Satania? Surely we have no major concerns in this respect for the original Adam & Eve, as expression archetypes Adam & Eve are not themselves Adjuster indwellt: they will etch the identity or characteristics of the Eternal Mother Son into the local universe simply by "being fruitful and multiplying", by living out the orders that the Creator Son Michael had deigned approval from the Second Member of Trinity.

I suppose in a sense, when I introduced this topic: I had it wrong. I said do the original Material Son & Daughter rely on each other for the full expression of their personalities? However personality is a prerogative of the Universal Father, and it is not for me to decide how personality : whoa are Adam and Eve true personalities?

Maybe if Eve and Adam are come from these combinences, and patterns, and creature archetype plans existing primarily within the circuit of the Eternal Mother Son, can their attributes constitute actual personality? Perhaps not, if they are only eternal sunshine people without the curse of accident and circumstance, and temporal # of living breaths within a mortal tabernacle, that without the gift of the indwelling father fragment, how is it that you could truly say that the original Adam and Eve have personality? Their own personalities, therefore are completely submerged in the identity of the Creator Son Michael, and the Eternal Mother-Son.

But for we human individuals, who may interpret the reasons why Adam & Eve codependent creatures, it is true you could always go back to that moment Rick Warren, "Adam could have remained as sole-ruler of Urantia" - but a difficult prospect if you can identify that in his very nature Adam mayen't have actually been able to consider/countenance that plan. I would love to hear someone explain how in only one lifetime, Adam the one sent to Urantia could have chosen to remain alone without his partner.

_________________
to the Underlaying Unity of All Life so that the Voice of Intuition may guide Us closer to Our Common Keeper


Top
 Profile Send private message  
Reply with quote  
PostPosted:  
Offline

Joined: Sun Mar 25, 2012 5:29 am +0000
Posts: 3955
SEla_Kelly wrote:
Right- so both male and female creature designs controlled by the Eternal Mother-Son, so would the male and female: Adam and Eve, be interdependent on each other in order to obtain the full expression of potential for Adamic life in Satania? Surely we have no major concerns in this respect for the original Adam & Eve, as expression archetypes Adam & Eve are not themselves Adjuster indwellt: they will etch the identity or characteristics of the Eternal Mother Son into the local universe simply by "being fruitful and multiplying", by living out the orders that the Creator Son Michael had deigned approval from the Second Member of Trinity.

I suppose in a sense, when I introduced this topic: I had it wrong. I said do the original Material Son & Daughter rely on each other for the full expression of their personalities? However personality is a prerogative of the Universal Father, and it is not for me to decide how personality : whoa are Adam and Eve true personalities?

Maybe if Eve and Adam are come from these combinences, and patterns, and creature archetype plans existing primarily within the circuit of the Eternal Mother Son, can their attributes constitute actual personality? Perhaps not, if they are only eternal sunshine people without the curse of accident and circumstance, and temporal # of living breaths within a mortal tabernacle, that without the gift of the indwelling father fragment, how is it that you could truly say that the original Adam and Eve have personality? Their own personalities, therefore are completely submerged in the identity of the Creator Son Michael, and the Eternal Mother-Son.

But for we human individuals, who may interpret the reasons why Adam & Eve codependent creatures, it is true you could always go back to that moment Rick Warren, "Adam could have remained as sole-ruler of Urantia" - but a difficult prospect if you can identify that in his very nature Adam mayen't have actually been able to consider/countenance that plan. I would love to hear someone explain how in only one lifetime, Adam the one sent to Urantia could have chosen to remain alone without his partner.


Combinences??????????????? Again with the made up words without definition or meaning....or value. Just creating confusion...still.

Oh Dear...………….more false declarations, presumptions, and falsehoods. Here we go......still SO much you have wrong Stephen!

Yes, the Material Sons and Daughters, ALL, have personality as bestowed by God, the First Source and Center. Thought Adjusters are not required for personality. All celestials and all beings, spirit/morontia/mortal are bestowed free will and personality. Relationship is not possible without it.

No personality is "submerged" into anyone else's "identity". A false claim. Personalities are not even subservient to Deity except by free will choice, let alone submerged. And no being is simply an archetype either - every single being is unique and personal and all those created in time are subject to the same experiential-wisdom quest of learning and growing...even the Michaels are experiential as is the Supreme.

Material Sons and Daughters have "no major concerns"?????????????? Please tell me you're kidding!

Still waiting for some definition or quote about your so called "original Adam and Eve". Who are they? Where are they? How many are they? I believe you will need to pluralize that claim for any accuracy at all as there is no such thing as any singular or original Adam and Eve....the text has already been posted.

Did you know that all Adams and Eves and their children born on material/evolutionary worlds DO receive TA's?? Guardian Angels, midwayers, and the Materials all receive TA's at a certain point in their careers and go to the Corps of Finality to serve with mortal finaliters. The process is called humanization. Very interesting. Learned about it a year or so ago...pretty new concept to me.

As far as Adam's choice....since the authors presented the choice as a choice, perhaps it is wise to believe it was a choice!?

75:5.2 (843.4) It was in the despair of the realization of failure that Adam, the day after Eve’s misstep, sought out Laotta, the brilliant Nodite woman who was head of the western schools of the Garden, and with premeditation committed the folly of Eve. But do not misunderstand; Adam was not beguiled; he knew exactly what he was about; he deliberately chose to share the fate of Eve. He loved his mate with a supermortal affection, and the thought of the possibility of a lonely vigil on Urantia without her was more than he could endure.

I will speculate that if Adam had chosen otherwise, then he would have retained access to and benefited by the Tree of Life while Eve would meet her same fate of mortal death within a few centuries and they would not be reunited until Adam had led the world to Light and Life...tens or hundreds of thousands of years after Eve's death. He would have enjoyed the company of their progeny to come but would never have mated with mortals himself and neither would Adam and Eve's children. Far more Adamic blood would have been delivered to our world and the Garden would still thrive. Adam's choice is very interesting. On one hand he chose loyalty to Eve but only by the betrayal of trust and duty to Urantia!

Whatever, the pair remain united and in service to our world and were forgiven for their immaturity and impatience and failures. I believe they will ascend to Paradise to serve in the Corps of Finality alongside the mortal ascenders from Urantia.

76:5.2 (852.1) Adam and Eve did not, as citizens of Jerusem, have Thought Adjusters, nor were they Adjuster indwelt when they functioned on Urantia in the first garden. But shortly after their reduction to mortal status they became conscious of a new presence within them and awakened to the realization that human status coupled with sincere repentance had made it possible for Adjusters to indwell them. It was this knowledge of being Adjuster indwelt that greatly heartened Adam and Eve throughout the remainder of their lives; they knew that they had failed as Material Sons of Satania, but they also knew that the Paradise career was still open to them as ascending sons of the universe.

76:6.3 (853.4) Adam and Eve quickly passed through the worlds of progressive ascension until they attained citizenship on Jerusem, once again to be residents of the planet of their origin but this time as members of a different order of universe personalities. They left Jerusem as permanent citizens—Sons of God; they returned as ascendant citizens—sons of man. They were immediately attached to the Urantia service on the system capital, later being assigned membership among the four and twenty counselors who constitute the present advisory-control body of Urantia.

31:5.1 (349.1) There is provision in the universes of time and space whereby the Adamic citizens of the local systems, when long delayed in receiving planetary assignment, may initiate a petition for release from permanent-citizenship status. And if granted, they join the ascending pilgrims on the universe capitals and thence proceed onward to Paradise and the Corps of the Finality.

31:5.2 (349.2) When an advanced evolutionary world attains the later eras of the age of light and life, the Material Sons, the Planetary Adam and Eve, may elect to humanize, receive Adjusters, and embark upon the evolutionary course of universe ascent leading to the Corps of Mortal Finaliters. Certain of these Material Sons have partially failed or technically defaulted in their mission as biologic accelerators, as Adam did on Urantia; and then are they compelled to take the natural course of the peoples of the realm, receive Adjusters, pass through death, and progress by faith through the ascendant regime, subsequently attaining Paradise and the Corps of the Finality.

55:4.9 (627.7) The System Sovereign has authority to release midway creatures any time after the first settled stage so that they may humanize in the morontia by the aid of the Life Carriers and the physical controllers and, after receiving Thought Adjusters, start out on their Paradise ascension.

55:4.30 (629.8) Throughout all of these epochs the imported assisting Material Sons and Daughters exert a tremendous influence on the progressing social and economic orders. They are potentially immortal, at least until such time as they elect to humanize, receive Adjusters, and start for Paradise.

55:4.31 (629.9) On the evolutionary worlds a being must humanize to receive a Thought Adjuster. All ascendant members of the Mortal Corps of Finaliters have been Adjuster indwelt and fused except seraphim, and they are Father indwelt by another type of spirit at the time of being mustered into this corps.

8)


Last edited by fanofVan on Wed Apr 10, 2019 10:13 am +0000, edited 3 times in total.

Top
 Profile Send private message  
Reply with quote  
PostPosted:  
Offline

Joined: Wed Feb 20, 2019 12:11 pm +0000
Posts: 932
SEla_Kelly wrote:
whoa are Adam and Eve true personalities?


Yes, it is written that they are indeed personalities, superhuman personalities, who are personalized by the Creator Son. They are considered to be both descending and ascending sons of God. Sonship is not possible without personality since sonship includes the experience of the recognition of personality ancestry. References:

(578.6) 50:7.1 On first thought it might appear that Urantia and its associated associated isolated worlds are most unfortunate in being deprived of the beneficent presence and influence of such superhuman personalities as a Planetary Prince and a Material Son and Daughter.

(415.1) 37:9.9 The Material Sons of God. When a creative liaison between the Creator Son and the universe representative of the Infinite Spirit, the Universe Mother Spirit, has completed its cycle, when no more offspring of the combined nature are forthcoming, then does the Creator Son personalize in dual form his last concept of being, thus finally confirming his own and original dual origin. In and of himself he then creates the beautiful and superb Sons and Daughters of the material order of universe sonship.

(415.2) 37:9.10 On a planetary mission the Material Son and Daughter are commissioned to found the Adamic race of that world, a race designed eventually to amalgamate with the mortal inhabitants of that sphere. Planetary Adams are both descending and ascending Sons, but we ordinarily class them as ascending.

(110.5) 10:2.7 The Eternal Son alone experiences the fullness of divine personality relationship, consciousness of both sonship with the Father and paternity to the Spirit and of divine equality with both Father-ancestor and Spirit-associate. The Father knows the experience of having a Son who is his equal, but the Father knows no ancestral antecedents. The Eternal Son has the experience of sonship, recognition of personality ancestry, and at the same time the Son is conscious of being joint parent to the Infinite Spirit. The Infinite Spirit is conscious of twofold personality ancestry but is not parental to a co-ordinate Deity personality. With the Spirit the existential cycle of Deity personalization attains completion; the primary personalities of the Third Source and Center are experiential and are seven in number.

SEla_Kelly wrote:
I would love to hear someone explain how in only one lifetime, Adam the one sent to Urantia could have chosen to remain alone without his partner.


Don't forget that on Michael's third bestowal he appeared as a solitary emergency Material Son, with no partner, on an isolated, quarantined planet. It certainly is possible.

(1312.5) 119:3.4 Thus did this unique Material Son begin his difficult career on a quarantined world of secession and rebellion, located in a beleaguered system without any direct communication with the outside universe, working alone for one whole generation of planetary time. This emergency Material Son effected the repentance and reclamation of the defaulting Planetary Prince and his entire staff and witnessed the restoration of the planet to the loyal service of the Paradise rule as established in the local universes. In due time a Material Son and Daughter arrived on this rejuvenated and redeemed world, and when they had been duly installed as visible planetary rulers, the transitory or emergency Planetary Prince took formal leave, disappearing at noon one day. On the third day thereafter, Michael appeared in his accustomed place on Salvington, and very soon the superuniverse broadcasts carried the fourth proclamation of the Ancients of Days announcing the further advancement of the sovereignty of Michael in Nebadon.


Top
 Profile Send private message  
Reply with quote  
PostPosted:  
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Sun Jan 22, 2012 11:16 pm +0000
Posts: 1122
Location: Nanticoke NY
fanofVan wrote:
Did you know that all Adams and Eves and their children born on material/evolutionary worlds DO receive TA's?? Guardian Angels, midwayers, and the Materials all receive TA's at a certain point in their careers and go to the Corps of Finality to serve with mortal finaliters. The process is called humanization. Very interesting. Learned about it a year or so ago...pretty new concept to me. 8)


Wow no I have not heard of that! I am very interested to hear how Adam and Eve have attained actual personalities, what part the existential creation played and what part this was an acquirement of experience!


84:7.28 Marriage, with children and consequent family life, is stimulative of the highest potentials in human nature and simultaneously provides the ideal avenue for the expression of these quickened attributes of mortal personality; [68:1.4 " But co-operation is not a natural trait of man."]


Combinences i.e. "amalgamations". 36:2.11 "trait determinors" i.e. the 48 sets of trait determinors which controls the expression of personality in Urantian Life. How does the Adamic Gift of free association - 81:1.2 "the associative imagination and beauty appreciation of the Nodites and Adamites" arise om the trait determinors? The Combinence of Adam: UB 21:2.5 the patterns used to compose Adam, from the Eternal Mother-Son. Combinence is the physical totality of a creature if he is made in his adult form by the creator - what is it about the intrinsic properties of the pattern - all of them together - that help Adam to function? So we know that in the Adam & Eve of Jerusem, this combinence: the physical patterns which make the final form of life, is divinely composed - what a miracle to have parents such as this. The fact of their existence is like a beacon to my mind, that out of my own human patterns of thought/action, I could be like Adam: I could amalgamate the 48 patterns of character traits, which I hold in my own biology, properly and become a man, and be a married man like him to a person who will become like Eve, or at least to hold that a man should be able to have this privelege of having to raise a family. To gain combinence: i.e. to become a man. To become a man perfected as God had intended, in finality.

_________________
to the Underlaying Unity of All Life so that the Voice of Intuition may guide Us closer to Our Common Keeper


Top
 Profile Send private message  
Reply with quote  
PostPosted:  
Offline

Joined: Wed Feb 20, 2019 12:11 pm +0000
Posts: 932
SEla_Kelly wrote:
I am very interested to hear how Adam and Eve have attained actual personalities,


One does not "attain" a personality. Personalities are not earned. Personalities are a gift from the Father. Personality presence is an either/or situation. Either it is present or it is not. Creatures on this planet without personality are called animals.

SEla_Kelly wrote:
How does the Adamic Gift of free association -


Free association is not an Adamic gift. Free association of thought is part of adjutant mind ministry which is provided by the Divine Minister of Nebadon.

(402.4) 36:5.7 2. The spirit of understanding - the impulse of co-ordination, the spontaneous and apparently automatic association of ideas. This is the gift of the co-ordination of acquired knowledge, the phenomenon of quick reasoning, rapid judgment, and prompt decision.

SEla_Kelly wrote:
48 sets of trait determinors which controls the expression of personality in Urantian Life.


The 48 trait determiners concern the material body and its material constituents which provide the underlying capacity for mind and spirit ministry. Material character traits are also inherited, but not the personality. Personality is a unique pattern from Paradise.

SEla_Kelly wrote:
81:1.2 "the associative imagination and beauty appreciation of the Nodites and Adamites" arise from the trait determinors?


I'm sorry but the reference you mention, 81:1.2, does not seem to be related to the question. It's about climate changes and civilization.

Are you asking how one's genetic makeup influences spirit receptivity? I believe it is determined by gland chemistry. Reference:

(566.7) 49:5.19 3. Spirit-reception series. There are three groups of mind design as related to contact with spirit affairs. This classification does not refer to the one-, two-, and three-brained orders of mortals; it refers primarily to gland chemistry, more particularly to the organization of certain glands comparable to the pituitary bodies. The races on some worlds have one gland, on others two, as do Urantians, while on still other spheres the races have three of these unique bodies. The inherent imagination and spiritual receptivity is definitely influenced by this differential chemical endowment.

As for the Nodites and their spiritual receptivity capacity, we do know that when they engaged in reproduction their resulting physical offspring were superior to the Andonites in all ways, including spiritual. This is remarkable because their physical trait determiners were obtained from the Andonic people. It is written that this occurrence was due to mutations to the human genes caused by Satania life-maintenance circuits within the bodies of the Nodites. Reference:

(857.1) 77:2.4 Since the one hundred corporeal members of the Prince’s staff carried germ plasm of the Andonic human strains, it would naturally be expected that, if they engaged in sexual reproduction, their progeny would altogether resemble the offspring of other Andonite parents. But when the sixty rebels of the staff, the followers of Nod, actually engaged in sexual reproduction, their children proved to be far superior in almost every way to both the Andonite and the Sangik peoples. This unexpected excellence characterized not only physical and intellectual qualities but also spiritual capacities.

(857.2) 77:2.5 These mutant traits appearing in the first Nodite generation resulted from certain changes which had been wrought in the configuration and in the chemical constituents of the inheritance factors of the Andonic germ plasm. These changes were caused by the presence in the bodies of the staff members of the powerful life-maintenance circuits of the Satania system. These life circuits caused the chromosomes of the specialized Urantia pattern to reorganize more after the patterns of the standardized Satania specialization of the ordained Nebadon life manifestation.manifestation. The technique of this germ plasm metamorphosis by the action of the system life currents is not unlike those procedures whereby Urantia scientists modify the germ plasm of plants and animals by the use of X rays.


Top
 Profile Send private message  
Reply with quote  
PostPosted:  
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Sun Jan 22, 2012 11:16 pm +0000
Posts: 1122
Location: Nanticoke NY
How does the Adam & Eve, the prepattern of Material Sons & Daughters, factor into the thoughts and the ideas of Adam & Eve of Jerusem's children? And how do the 48 sets of trait determinors factor into the ultimate mind capacity of the human individual? How does the associative intellect operate upon the platform of these predetermined (or inheritable) traits, and as in its ideal expression through human-adjuster personality?

_________________
to the Underlaying Unity of All Life so that the Voice of Intuition may guide Us closer to Our Common Keeper


Last edited by SEla_Kelly on Wed Apr 10, 2019 3:06 pm +0000, edited 1 time in total.

Top
 Profile Send private message  
Reply with quote  
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 62 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1, 2, 3, 4, 5  Next

All times are UTC - 7 hours


Who is online

Registered users: Google [Bot]


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You can post attachments in this forum

Search for:
Jump to:  
cron
Powered by phpBB® Forum Software © phpBB Group