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 Post subject: Re: What is Assurance?
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158:7.5 After they had recovered from the first shock of Jesus' stinging rebuke, and before they resumed their journey, the Master spoke further: “If any man would come after me, let him disregard himself, take up his responsibilities daily, and follow me. For whosoever would save his life selfishly, shall lose it, but whosoever loses his life for my sake and the gospel's, shall save it. What does it profit a man to gain the whole world and lose his own soul? What would a man give in exchange for eternal life? Be not ashamed of me and my words in this sinful and hypocritical generation, even as I will not be ashamed to acknowledge you when in glory I appear before my Father in the presence of all the celestial hosts. Nevertheless, many of you now standing before me shall not taste death till you see this kingdom of God come with power.”

181:1.8 in the full assurance that he was achieving the Father's will
When I heard the first staged-production of "Resurection of the Publick Universal Friend", in Penn Yann, NY, I remember the actor saying, as Jemima Wilkinson, "Remember that God loves ya," during the epilogue of the play. But Remember this, she tried to do God's will, and she forsook herself. God's love is stern, and often enough it is the thing that you are most afraid of.

Jesus said "if you love me" you will feed my sheep. There is an advanced injunction that comes out of Peter's love, man's loyalty. If you know that God loves you, you must reciprocate this love.


180:5.8 this rule of universal relationship is revealed only in its spiritual realization, in the interpretation of the law of conduct by the spirit of the Son to the spirit of the Father that indwells the soul of mortal man
"Any man's interpretation of the law", meaning "Universal Law", that every man has this relationship to the First Source, has that relationship to the Paradise Father.

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SEla_Kelly wrote:
158:7.5 After they had recovered from the first shock of Jesus' stinging rebuke, and before they resumed their journey, the Master spoke further: “If any man would come after me, let him disregard himself, take up his responsibilities daily, and follow me. For whosoever would save his life selfishly, shall lose it, but whosoever loses his life for my sake and the gospel's, shall save it. What does it profit a man to gain the whole world and lose his own soul? What would a man give in exchange for eternal life? Be not ashamed of me and my words in this sinful and hypocritical generation, even as I will not be ashamed to acknowledge you when in glory I appear before my Father in the presence of all the celestial hosts. Nevertheless, many of you now standing before me shall not taste death till you see this kingdom of God come with power.”

181:1.8 in the full assurance that he was achieving the Father's will
When I heard the first staged-production of "Resurection of the Publick Universal Friend", in Penn Yann, NY, I remember the actor saying, as Jemima Wilkinson, "Remember that God loves ya," during the epilogue of the play. But Remember this, she tried to do God's will, and she forsook herself. God's love is stern, and often enough it is the thing that you are most afraid of.

Jesus said "if you love me" you will feed my sheep. There is an advanced injunction that comes out of Peter's love, man's loyalty. If you know that God loves you, you must reciprocate this love.


180:5.8 this rule of universal relationship is revealed only in its spiritual realization, in the interpretation of the law of conduct by the spirit of the Son to the spirit of the Father that indwells the soul of mortal man
"Any man's interpretation of the law", meaning "Universal Law", that every man has this relationship to the First Source, has that relationship to the Paradise Father.



Another horrific falsehood and misrepresentation!! God's love is NOT stern!! Or aloof or angry or withheld or difficult to acquire or to receive nor is it earned or deserved. Neither do we need to forsake ourselves or our own best interest or our happiness do know God's will or to do God's will!!!

To "disregard" self is merely to set aside self importance and false liberty in recognition of the value and importance of others - each and all others - as fellow children in the family of God. We may choose false liberty or true liberty and thereby come the results which accompany each of those choices....either blessing or consequences and suffering. The choice is ours.

You are posting quotations here again for which there are no sources except your own imagination!! Who said and where is it written - "Any man's interpretation of the law..." or that those words might mean "Universal Law"???????

180:5.8 is about the assurance that comes to mortals by their understanding of the Golden Rule:

180:5.8 (1950.3) But the highest realization and the truest interpretation of the golden rule consists in the consciousness of the spirit of the truth of the enduring and living reality of such a divine declaration. The true cosmic meaning of this rule of universal relationship is revealed only in its spiritual realization, in the interpretation of the law of conduct by the spirit of the Son to the spirit of the Father that indwells the soul of mortal man. And when such spirit-led mortals realize the true meaning of this golden rule, they are filled to overflowing with the assurance of citizenship in a friendly universe, and their ideals of spirit reality are satisfied only when they love their fellows as Jesus loved us all, and that is the reality of the realization of the love of God.

181:1.8 (1954.5) A certain amount of both stoicism and optimism are serviceable in living a life on earth, but neither has aught to do with that superb peace which the Son of God bestows upon his brethren in the flesh. The peace which Michael gives his children on earth is that very peace which filled his own soul when he himself lived the mortal life in the flesh and on this very world. The peace of Jesus is the joy and satisfaction of a God-knowing individual who has achieved the triumph of learning fully how to do the will of God while living the mortal life in the flesh. The peace of Jesus’ mind was founded on an absolute human faith in the actuality of the divine Father’s wise and sympathetic overcare. Jesus had trouble on earth, he has even been falsely called the “man of sorrows,” but in and through all of these experiences he enjoyed the comfort of that confidence which ever empowered him to proceed with his life purpose in the full assurance that he was achieving the Father’s will.

181:1.10 (1955.1) The peace of Jesus is, then, the peace and assurance of a son who fully believes that his career for time and eternity is safely and wholly in the care and keeping of an all-wise, all-loving, and all-powerful spirit Father. And this is, indeed, a peace which passes the understanding of mortal mind, but which can be enjoyed to the full by the believing human heart.

Me here: The lessons in the quotes referenced (but not posted) by Stephen are that the more we progress in the Spirit and the more we grow the fruits of the Spirit and embrace the Golden Rule, the more Divine Assurance we receive. Assurance is a mechanism and force of response by Deity to our response to Deity!! Divine Assurance is a feedback loop of reinforcement and supporting comfort and confidence and affirmation....assurance of our standing as beloved children!!

Only those living without Divine Assurance might believe or preach that God's love is stern or earned. The quote from Paper 158 is irrelevant to the topic and, as usual, posted out of context!! Here Peter has the audacity to lecture the Master on the mission and ministry of Michael's 7th bestowal and does so out of the childish belief in the earthly material kingdom he hopes to help rule and sit near the throne of!! This is a very particular and very personal and very situational rebuke of Peter's immature blindness and self interest. Peter's embrace of false liberty and self interest roused the Master's rebuke!

158:7.3 (1759.5) In answer to Andrew, Jesus said: “My brethren, it is because you have confessed that I am the Son of God that I am constrained to begin to unfold to you the truth about the end of the bestowal of the Son of Man on earth. You insist on clinging to the belief that I am the Messiah, and you will not abandon the idea that the Messiah must sit upon a throne in Jerusalem; wherefore do I persist in telling you that the Son of Man must presently go to Jerusalem, suffer many things, be rejected by the scribes, the elders, and the chief priests, and after all this be killed and raised from the dead. And I speak not a parable to you; I speak the truth to you that you may be prepared for these events when they suddenly come upon us.” And while he was yet speaking, Simon Peter, rushing impetuously toward him, laid his hand upon the Master’s shoulder and said: “Master, be it far from us to contend with you, but I declare that these things shall never happen to you.”

158:7.4 (1760.1) Peter spoke thus because he loved Jesus; but the Master’s human nature recognized in these words of well-meant affection the subtle suggestion of temptation that he change his policy of pursuing to the end his earth bestowal in accordance with the will of his Paradise Father. And it was because he detected the danger of permitting the suggestions of even his affectionate and loyal friends to dissuade him, that he turned upon Peter and the other apostles, saying: “Get you behind me. You savor of the spirit of the adversary, the tempter. When you talk in this manner, you are not on my side but rather on the side of our enemy. In this way do you make your love for me a stumbling block to my doing the Father’s will. Mind not the ways of men but rather the will of God.”

158:7.5 (1760.2) After they had recovered from the first shock of Jesus’ stinging rebuke, and before they resumed their journey, the Master spoke further: “If any man would come after me, let him disregard himself, take up his responsibilities daily, and follow me. For whosoever would save his life selfishly, shall lose it, but whosoever loses his life for my sake and the gospel’s, shall save it. What does it profit a man to gain the whole world and lose his own soul? What would a man give in exchange for eternal life? Be not ashamed of me and my words in this sinful and hypocritical generation, even as I will not be ashamed to acknowledge you when in glory I appear before my Father in the presence of all the celestial hosts. Nevertheless, many of you now standing before me shall not taste death till you see this kingdom of God come with power.”

158:7.6 (1760.3) And thus did Jesus make plain to the twelve the painful and conflicting path which they must tread if they would follow him. What a shock these words were to these Galilean fishermen who persisted in dreaming of an earthly kingdom with positions of honor for themselves! But their loyal hearts were stirred by this courageous appeal, and not one of them was minded to forsake him. Jesus was not sending them alone into the conflict; he was leading them. He asked only that they bravely follow.

158:7.7 (1760.4) Slowly the twelve were grasping the idea that Jesus was telling them something about the possibility of his dying. They only vaguely comprehended what he said about his death, while his statement about rising from the dead utterly failed to register in their minds. As the days passed, Peter, James, and John, recalling their experience upon the mount of the transfiguration, arrived at a fuller understanding of certain of these matters.


Last edited by fanofVan on Wed Jan 08, 2020 7:03 am +0000, edited 2 times in total.

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The more we understand, embrace, and pursue true liberty, the more Divine Assurance and fruits of the Spirit we enjoy and the more progress in the Spirit we achieve!! The more we impose our will upon others for our own perceived self interest, the more we regress and remove ourselves from the Spirit within...we have made choices which are contrary to the Golden Rule and the law of love and God's will and the more we will suffer the consequences of such self importance. In the quotes above from Paper 158, Peter is giving voice to his own perception of his own best interest and is giving no thought to God's will in this matter....or the will of Jesus as the Son of God.

This is the reason for the rebuke...Peter was showing audacity and presumptuousness in his own will and false liberty. The more we are aligned with reality and the greater our reality-response, the more Divine Assurance we are given and feel and the greater is that sublime peace demonstrated by Jesus and which, we are told, every tadpole can attain even in this life!!


1. True and False Liberty

54:1.1 (613.3) Of all the perplexing problems growing out of the Lucifer rebellion, none has occasioned more difficulty than the failure of immature evolutionary mortals to distinguish between true and false liberty.

54:1.2 (613.4) True liberty is the quest of the ages and the reward of evolutionary progress. False liberty is the subtle deception of the error of time and the evil of space. Enduring liberty is predicated on the reality of justice—intelligence, maturity, fraternity, and equity.

54:1.3 (613.5) Liberty is a self-destroying technique of cosmic existence when its motivation is unintelligent, unconditioned, and uncontrolled. True liberty is progressively related to reality and is ever regardful of social equity, cosmic fairness, universe fraternity, and divine obligations.

54:1.4 (613.6) Liberty is suicidal when divorced from material justice, intellectual fairness, social forbearance, moral duty, and spiritual values. Liberty is nonexistent apart from cosmic reality, and all personality reality is proportional to its divinity relationships.

54:1.5 (613.7) Unbridled self-will and unregulated self-expression equal unmitigated selfishness, the acme of ungodliness. Liberty without the associated and ever-increasing conquest of self is a figment of egoistic mortal imagination. Self-motivated liberty is a conceptual illusion, a cruel deception. License masquerading in the garments of liberty is the forerunner of abject bondage.

54:1.6 (614.1) True liberty is the associate of genuine self-respect; false liberty is the consort of self-admiration. True liberty is the fruit of self-control; false liberty, the assumption of self-assertion. Self-control leads to altruistic service; self-admiration tends towards the exploitation of others for the selfish aggrandizement of such a mistaken individual as is willing to sacrifice righteous attainment for the sake of possessing unjust power over his fellow beings.

54:1.7 (614.2) Even wisdom is divine and safe only when it is cosmic in scope and spiritual in motivation.

54:1.8 (614.3) There is no error greater than that species of self-deception which leads intelligent beings to crave the exercise of power over other beings for the purpose of depriving these persons of their natural liberties. The golden rule of human fairness cries out against all such fraud, unfairness, selfishness, and unrighteousness. Only true and genuine liberty is compatible with the reign of love and the ministry of mercy.

54:1.9 (614.4) How dare the self-willed creature encroach upon the rights of his fellows in the name of personal liberty when the Supreme Rulers of the universe stand back in merciful respect for these prerogatives of will and potentials of personality! No being, in the exercise of his supposed personal liberty, has a right to deprive any other being of those privileges of existence conferred by the Creators and duly respected by all their loyal associates, subordinates, and subjects.

54:1.10 (614.5) Evolutionary man may have to contend for his material liberties with tyrants and oppressors on a world of sin and iniquity or during the early times of a primitive evolving sphere, but not so on the morontia worlds or on the spirit spheres. War is the heritage of early evolutionary man, but on worlds of normal advancing civilization physical combat as a technique of adjusting racial misunderstandings has long since fallen into disrepute.

2. The Theft of Liberty

54:2.1 (614.6) With the Son and in the Spirit did God project eternal Havona, and ever since has there obtained the eternal pattern of co-ordinate participation in creation—sharing. This pattern of sharing is the master design for every one of the Sons and Daughters of God who go out into space to engage in the attempt to duplicate in time the central universe of eternal perfection.

54:2.2 (614.7) Every creature of every evolving universe who aspires to do the Father’s will is destined to become the partner of the time-space Creators in this magnificent adventure of experiential perfection attainment. Were this not true, the Father would have hardly endowed such creatures with creative free will, neither would he indwell them, actually go into partnership with them by means of his own spirit.

54:2.3 (614.8) Lucifer’s folly was the attempt to do the nondoable, to short-circuit time in an experiential universe. Lucifer’s crime was the attempted creative disenfranchisement of every personality in Satania, the unrecognized abridgment of the creature’s personal participation—freewill participation—in the long evolutionary struggle to attain the status of light and life both individually and collectively. In so doing this onetime Sovereign of your system set the temporal purpose of his own will directly athwart the eternal purpose of God’s will as it is revealed in the bestowal of free will upon all personal creatures. The Lucifer rebellion thus threatened the maximum possible infringement of the freewill choice of the ascenders and servers of the system of Satania—a threat forevermore to deprive every one of these beings of the thrilling experience of contributing something personal and unique to the slowly erecting monument to experiential wisdom which will sometime exist as the perfected system of Satania. Thus does the Lucifer manifesto, masquerading in the habiliments of liberty, stand forth in the clear light of reason as a monumental threat to consummate the theft of personal liberty and to do it on a scale that has been approached only twice in all the history of Nebadon. *

54:2.4 (615.1) In short, what God had given men and angels Lucifer would have taken away from them, that is, the divine privilege of participating in the creation of their own destinies and of the destiny of this local system of inhabited worlds.

54:2.5 (615.2) No being in all the universe has the rightful liberty to deprive any other being of true liberty, the right to love and be loved, the privilege of worshiping God and of serving his fellows.


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We are taught the greatest obstacles to personal growth are ignorance and prejudice. Students of the UB should understand the grandness of the tadpole's ignorance and certainly should we be free of that blinding and stubborn and arrogant prejudice of entrenchment of beliefs and opinions regarding universe realities.

There are those who seek knowledge and understanding with an appreciation for how little we know and how much there is to learn, and then there are those among us who enjoy a very faulty if great assurance in their own perception and close their eyes and mind to everything that conflicts with or contradicts their entrenched beliefs.

Whether the student believes the UB or not, it will certainly challenge our preconceptions and expose our prejudices. But it is the UB that we study here and not each other's preconceptions or prejudices about universe realities. So...those opinions and beliefs contrary to the UB need due consideration for their differences to the source material studied here.


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Whether the student believes the UB or not, it will certainly challenge our preconceptions and expose our prejudices. But it is the UB that we study here and not each other's preconceptions or prejudices about universe realities. So...those opinions and beliefs contrary to the UB need due consideration for their differences to the source material studied here.


Well said, and worth remembering. No matter what other argument or opinion may be presented here by anyone, the final authority of the teachings of The Urantia Book are in the pages of the text. We may all read the text, but not everyone who reads the text may come to the same conclusions about what is being read. Additionally, not everyone who comes here presenting ideas or opinions is accurate in their assessment of the text or entirely transparent as to their motivations.

Some here like to argue for argument's sake, which is unfortunate. Some come here to learn, some to share what they are learning. It is always up to the reader of the threads to make their own assessment of what is being said here. And I advise to always default to those who are able and willing to use the text of the book as the basis for what they are saying or opining. In the end, as fanofvan says, it is the UB we study here. We're all entitled to our opinions, and we are all, in the end, responsible for our own opinions.

When in doubt - if EVER in doubt - always go into the text to discover the answer for yourself.


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fanofVan wrote:
Me here: The lessons in the quotes referenced (but not posted) by Stephen are that the more we progress in the Spirit and the more we grow the fruits of the Spirit and embrace the Golden Rule, the more Divine Assurance we receive. Assurance is a mechanism and force of response by Deity to our response to Deity!! Divine Assurance is a feedback loop of reinforcement and supporting comfort and confidence and affirmation....assurance of our standing as beloved children!!


I am really in agreement with what you say, but then here you say assurance is a mechanism. But man has in his own arsenal of faith-potential, only this "the fulcrumof tact" a metaphorical mechanism, an axiom, by which to produce verity or gain the achievement of assurance in faith, that one has done God's will. How do you qualify such mechanism in human experience? Because by virtue of human tact, we can veritably see such human individual continuously elect the highest moral value within the imperative of human potentiation, an ethical standard at least of assurance as a mechanism.



42:11.1 In the evaluation and recognition of mind it should be remembered that the universe is neither mechanical nor magical; it (the universe) is a creation of mind and a mechanism of law.
if assurance is transmitted by Deity (experiencially), that is an experiencial responsibility of man also and not just a divine relationship.

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SEla_Kelly wrote:
fanofVan wrote:
Me here: The lessons in the quotes referenced (but not posted) by Stephen are that the more we progress in the Spirit and the more we grow the fruits of the Spirit and embrace the Golden Rule, the more Divine Assurance we receive. Assurance is a mechanism and force of response by Deity to our response to Deity!! Divine Assurance is a feedback loop of reinforcement and supporting comfort and confidence and affirmation....assurance of our standing as beloved children!!


I am really in agreement with what you say, but then here you say assurance is a mechanism. But man has in his own arsenal of faith-potential, only this "the fulcrumof tact" a metaphorical mechanism, an axiom, by which to produce verity or gain the achievement of assurance in faith, that one has done God's will. How do you qualify such mechanism in human experience? Because by virtue of human tact, we can veritably see such human individual continuously elect the highest moral value within the imperative of human potentiation, an ethical standard at least of assurance as a mechanism.



42:11.1 In the evaluation and recognition of mind it should be remembered that the universe is neither mechanical nor magical; it (the universe) is a creation of mind and a mechanism of law.
if assurance is transmitted by Deity (experiencially), that is an experiencial responsibility of man also and not just a divine relationship.


I appreciate the attempted agreement...but much of what you write here does not agree with me and is not confirmed by the UB so far as I can tell.

For example, you claim that assurance "is an experiential responsibility of man". This is not true according to the UB. Assurance is a result of the faith experience and personal religious and spiritual growth. Assurance is like fruit....it grows by response as fruit grows on the vine or tree and as grain grows on the stem. It is not a function of responsibility but is a function of response. Our response to the yearn and urge and hunger and thirst delivered by Deity brings a response from and by Deity....we respond to Deity and Deity responds to the response!!!

It is a karmic reciprocity of cause and effect whereby the effect then becomes further cause for ever greater effect....an amplification system/mechanism. There would never be Divine Assurance if it were the "responsibility of man". Another contradiction I'm afraid and not at all in agreement with me....even a little.

The fulcrum of tact you cite above has nothing whatsoever to do with assurance or God's will or moral value or the topic at hand. The quote you posted is about social tact as a charming gift for reducing social misunderstandings and avoiding conflict and trouble due to lack of emotional adjustment and our immaturity!! Certainly something for me to improve upon and aspire to!!

156:5.18 (1740.5) As you grow older in years and more experienced in the affairs of the kingdom, are you becoming more tactful in dealing with troublesome mortals and more tolerant in living with stubborn associates? Tact is the fulcrum of social leverage, and tolerance is the earmark of a great soul. If you possess these rare and charming gifts, as the days pass you will become more alert and expert in your worthy efforts to avoid all unnecessary social misunderstandings. Such wise souls are able to avoid much of the trouble which is certain to be the portion of all who suffer from lack of emotional adjustment, those who refuse to grow up, and those who refuse to grow old gracefully.

Me here: Now here's a couple of "fulcrum" quotes which do address the topic of assurance in certain ways. Both quotes below describe our cooperation with the Spirit within and our faith and our decisions based on faith and the actions we take thereby as providing great leverage which contributes to progress and Divine Assurance of our personal connection to Deity:

108:5.8 (1192.3) The Thought Adjusters would like to change your feelings of fear to convictions of love and confidence; but they cannot mechanically and arbitrarily do such things; that is your task. In executing those decisions which deliver you from the fetters of fear, you literally supply the psychic fulcrum on which the Adjuster may subsequently apply a spiritual lever of uplifting and advancing illumination.

110:6.17 (1211.2) The motivation of faith makes experiential the full realization of man’s sonship with God, but action, completion of decisions, is essential to the evolutionary attainment of consciousness of progressive kinship with the cosmic actuality of the Supreme Being. Faith transmutes potentials to actuals in the spiritual world, but potentials become actuals in the finite realms of the Supreme only by and through the realization of choice-experience. But choosing to do the will of God joins spiritual faith to material decisions in personality action and thus supplies a divine and spiritual fulcrum for the more effective functioning of the human and material leverage of God-hunger. Such a wise co-ordination of material and spiritual forces greatly augments both cosmic realization of the Supreme and morontia comprehension of the Paradise Deities.


Me here: Morontia (soul) comprehension IS a form of Divine Assurance!! The more reality-response we have and the more we comprehend Deity within then the more Assurance we receive which unleashes even more growth. Our decisions AND our awareness upon which we make our choices combine as lever and fulcrum for Deity to uplift our very being through the Circles of Progress and toward our eternal destiny potential!!

It is by the Divine relationship and our response to that relationship - the relationship is the lever and our response to the relationship is the fulcrum upon which Deity uses both the lever and the fulcrum to deliver energy and force and the motion and propulsion of spiritization and progress!!

I would say Divine Assurance is a Deity response-gift to our own mortal/creature freewill experiential response to the Spirit within exhibited by the growth of spirit and wisdom and reality alignment due to our personal faith and truth experience.

Rather than say it is man's responsibility...it would be more accurate to describe the mortal's response-ABILITY as the fulcrum described above. God has the responsibility and has created and delivers the means of our progress and destiny. We must only respond to that reality God has created and delivers to each being.

The more responsive we are to the Spirit the more responsive we become to the Spirit, which is the nature of spirit gravity as we have previously discovered...the gravitational effect of the spirit gravity circuit increases as we gain spirituality and as we get closer to our Spirit nature by transferring the seat of our personal identity from material to spiritual. Or so I understand the UB to teach.

:wink: 8)


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I think that what you or I think about assurance is not as significant as what the midwayer author of Book IV wished to convey through the usage of that word "assurance". To me, he meant that assurance was Jesus' personal means of signification, in order to convey to the mind of another human individual that you are doing or have done God's will.

If you try to assure others, you are attempting to justify their actions, and you are also suggesting "this is what it means to me to do God's will." Assurance might also be significant of one's love and affectations, for "as a man wills, so goes his love." But if you stake your assurance merely on the prospect of "earning God's love", you are forgetting the persent actionable imperative in the highest moral goal of your own household. You are forgetting the simplicity of "returning to one's responsibility", and what that might mean for every man.

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I think that what you or I think about assurance is not as significant as what the midwayer author of Book IV wished to convey through the usage of that word "assurance". To me, he meant that assurance was Jesus' personal means of signification, in order to convey to the mind of another human individual that you are doing or have done God's will.


You are entitled to your opinion about what assurance is.

However, to anyone who wishes to see what the teachings of The Urantia Book are concerning assurance, please see the following link listing over 140 citations of that word in the text.

https://truthbook.com/search2/direct.cfm?StartRow=1&criteria=assurance&newSearch=Search#RESULTS

MaryJo


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SEla_Kelly wrote:
I think that what you or I think about assurance is not as significant as what the midwayer author of Book IV wished to convey through the usage of that word "assurance". To me, he meant that assurance was Jesus' personal means of signification, in order to convey to the mind of another human individual that you are doing or have done God's will.

If you try to assure others, you are attempting to justify their actions, and you are also suggesting "this is what it means to me to do God's will." Assurance might also be significant of one's love and affectations, for "as a man wills, so goes his love." But if you stake your assurance merely on the prospect of "earning God's love", you are forgetting the persent actionable imperative in the highest moral goal of your own household. You are forgetting the simplicity of "returning to one's responsibility", and what that might mean for every man.


As I have previously (and redundantly) stated...We mortals do not and cannot deliver Divine Assurance one to another!! We may, and indeed should and are taught to, share our own personal Assurance with others. Our faith and truth Assurance experience should, if genuine, result in a poise and sublime peace of mind and sweet natured perspective of reality - even in the midst of turmoil and loss and uncertainty and even chaos and material collapse!! Divine Assurance is a very real and very powerful force!! To share or give testimony of that Divine Assurance we know for ourselves by our faith and truth and trust experience is a kind and generous and helpful force for good and certainly is NOT an endorsement or excuse for ANY bad behavior. What a horrific and false claim!

Only you have preached here that we must earn God's love...and you still do so again here and now in this very post! And again you post unattributed quotations which have no source except your own imagination!!

Jesus did not convince others of the truth of his words or the sincerity of his intentions...he demonstrated those in his life and his demeanor and his faith and his trust in God and the friendly universe...no matter the trials and tribulations suffered, including his own torture and murder. Divine Assurance has absolutely nothing whatsoever to do with conveyance or convincing another mortal of anything at all.

We are taught that for mortals and to mortals and between mortals there cannot be any proof or conveyance or convincing that any know or do the will of God...but one. The only such evidence is demonstrations of the fruits of the Spirit!! Only that poise and trust and joy of faith and truth Assurance experience can convey to others our own personal Spirituality or Spirit and reality alignment.

But no one may convey to any other a personal religious experience and that Divine Assurance which comes by that individual and direct relationship with the inner Spirit.

101:2.16 Religion must ever be its own critic and judge; it can never be observed, much less understood, from the outside. Your only assurance of a personal God consists in your own insight as to your belief in, and experience with, things spiritual. To all of your fellows who have had a similar experience, no argument about the personality or reality of God is necessary, while to all other men who are not thus sure of God no possible argument could ever be truly convincing.

Me here: However, since the Spirit of Truth was gifted to us, that ministry of mind is one of confirmation and affirmation which can and does deliver Divine Assurance.

Divine Assurance, according to the UB, is not about any proof or validation of doing God's will either...or not exactly. Assurance is a result of our faith and truth experience and our personal spiritization and branch being connected to the vine. All of these are indeed God's will but they have nothing to do with "what" we do or "what" we choose or "what" we know or understand or believe so much as "why" we choose what we choose. God does not judge our knowledge OR our wisdom but ONLY our intentions. God's will is expressed by our motives, intentions, and priorities in the intersections of choice related to circumstances, situations, and relationships. The "what" of God's will takes care of itself over time by our growth and experiential wisdom acquired.

Assurance is a paternal affection and our emotional reaction to that affection as children of God who enjoy God's personal presence within and that Divine Affection of a loving parent. A baby knows such assurance without doing or knowing the "will" of the parent.

Still do you cling to and proclaim this falsehood Stephen...that things must be known and believed and things must be done and that God's will must be known to make progress in the Spirit or to experience the Divine Affection and Divine Assurance. These are complete fabrications of your own invention which totally contradict the teachings within the Urantia Papers.

True religious experience is not about knowing God's will, it is about RESPONDING to God's presence! Assurance is itself a religious experience.

To wit:

1:5.4 Even though material mortals cannot see the person of God, they should rejoice in the assurance that he is a person; by faith accept the truth which portrays that the Universal Father so loved the world as to provide for the eternal spiritual progression of its lowly inhabitants; that he “delights in his children.” God is lacking in none of those superhuman and divine attributes which constitute a perfect, eternal, loving, and infinite Creator personality.

101:0.3 Religion, the conviction-faith of the personality, can always triumph over the superficially contradictory logic of despair born in the unbelieving material mind. There really is a true and genuine inner voice, that "true light which lights every man who comes into the world." And this spirit leading is distinct from the ethical prompting of human conscience. The feeling of religious assurance is more than an emotional feeling. The assurance of religion transcends the reason of the mind, even the logic of philosophy. Religion is faith, trust, and assurance.

101:1.6 Faith unites moral insight with conscientious discriminations of values, and the pre-existent evolutionary sense of duty completes the ancestry of true religion. The experience of religion eventually results in the certain consciousness of God and in the undoubted assurance of the survival of the believing personality.

101:2.14 Your deepest nature—the divine Adjuster—creates within you a hunger and thirst for righteousness, a certain craving for divine perfection. Religion is the faith act of the recognition of this inner urge to divine attainment; and thus is brought about that soul trust and assurance of which you become conscious as the way of salvation, the technique of the survival of personality and all those values which you have come to look upon as being true and good.

101:2.15 The realization of religion never has been, and never will be, dependent on great learning or clever logic. It is spiritual insight, and that is just the reason why some of the world's greatest religious teachers, even the prophets, have sometimes possessed so little of the wisdom of the world. Religious faith is available alike to the learned and the unlearned.

101:5.11 Personally revealed religions are sponsored by the bestowal spirits representing the three persons of the Paradise Trinity and are especially concerned with the expansion of truth. Evolutionary religion drives home to the individual the idea of personal duty; revealed religion lays increasing emphasis on loving, the golden rule.

101:5.12 Evolved religion rests wholly on faith. Revelation has the additional assurance of its expanded presentation of the truths of divinity and reality and the still more valuable testimony of the actual experience which accumulates in consequence of the practical working union of the faith of evolution and the truth of revelation. Such a working union of human faith and divine truth constitutes the possession of a character well on the road to the actual acquirement of a morontial personality.

101:5.13 Evolutionary religion provides only the assurance of faith and the confirmation of conscience; revelatory religion provides the assurance of faith plus the truth of a living experience in the realities of revelation. The third step in religion, or the third phase of the experience of religion, has to do with the morontia state, the firmer grasp of mota. Increasingly in the morontia progression the truths of revealed religion are expanded; more and more you will know the truth of supreme values, divine goodnesses, universal relationships, eternal realities, and ultimate destinies.

101:5.14 Increasingly throughout the morontia progression the assurance of truth replaces the assurance of faith. When you are finally mustered into the actual spirit world, then will the assurances of pure spirit insight operate in the place of faith and truth or, rather, in conjunction with, and superimposed upon, these former techniques of personality assurance.

8) Bradly


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Regarding the source, experience, and sharing of our personal feelings and certainties of Divine Assurance:

101:3.1 Religion is so vital that it persists in the absence of learning. It lives in spite of its contamination with erroneous cosmologies and false philosophies; it survives even the confusion of metaphysics. In and through all the historic vicissitudes of religion there ever persists that which is indispensable to human progress and survival: the ethical conscience and the moral consciousness.

101:3.2 Faith-insight, or spiritual intuition, is the endowment of the cosmic mind in association with the Thought Adjuster, which is the Father's gift to man. Spiritual reason, soul intelligence, is the endowment of the Holy Spirit, the Creative Spirit's gift to man. Spiritual philosophy, the wisdom of spirit realities, is the endowment of the Spirit of Truth, the combined gift of the bestowal Sons to the children of men. And the co-ordination and interassociation of these spirit endowments constitute man a spirit personality in potential destiny.

101:3.3 It is this same spirit personality, in primitive and embryonic form, the Adjuster possession of which survives the natural death in the flesh. This composite entity of spirit origin in association with human experience is enabled, by means of the living way provided by the divine Sons, to survive (in Adjuster custody) the dissolution of the material self of mind and matter when such a transient partnership of the material and the spiritual is divorced by the cessation of vital motion.

101:3.4 Through religious faith the soul of man reveals itself and demonstrates the potential divinity of its emerging nature by the characteristic manner in which it induces the mortal personality to react to certain trying intellectual and testing social situations. Genuine spiritual faith (true moral consciousness) is revealed in that it:

1. Causes ethics and morals to progress despite inherent and adverse animalistic tendencies. *
2. Produces a sublime trust in the goodness of God even in the face of bitter disappointment and crushing defeat.
3. Generates profound courage and confidence despite natural adversity and physical calamity.
4. Exhibits inexplicable poise and sustaining tranquillity notwithstanding baffling diseases and even acute physical suffering.
5. Maintains a mysterious poise and composure of personality in the face of maltreatment and the rankest injustice.
6. Maintains a divine trust in ultimate victory in spite of the cruelties of seemingly blind fate and the apparent utter indifference of natural forces to human welfare.
7. Persists in the unswerving belief in God despite all contrary demonstrations of logic and successfully withstands all other intellectual sophistries.
8. Continues to exhibit undaunted faith in the soul's survival regardless of the deceptive teachings of false science and the persuasive delusions of unsound philosophy.
9. Lives and triumphs irrespective of the crushing overload of the complex and partial civilizations of modern times.
10. Contributes to the continued survival of altruism in spite of human selfishness, social antagonisms, industrial greeds, and political maladjustments.
11. Steadfastly adheres to a sublime belief in universe unity and divine guidance regardless of the perplexing presence of evil and sin.
12. Goes right on worshiping God in spite of anything and everything. Dares to declare, "Even though he slay me, yet will I serve him."

101:3.17 We know, then, by three phenomena, that man has a divine spirit or spirits dwelling within him: first, by personal experience—religious faith; second, by revelation—personal and racial; and third, by the amazing exhibition of such extraordinary and unnatural reactions to his material environment as are illustrated by the foregoing recital of twelve spiritlike performances in the presence of the actual and trying situations of real human existence. And there are still others.

101:3.18 And it is just such a vital and vigorous performance of faith in the domain of religion that entitles mortal man to affirm the personal possession and spiritual reality of that crowning endowment of human nature, religious experience.

102:2.1 Observing minds and discriminating souls know religion when they find it in the lives of their fellows. Religion requires no definition; we all know its social, intellectual, moral, and spiritual fruits. And this all grows out of the fact that religion is the property of the human race; it is not a child of culture. True, one's perception of religion is still human and therefore subject to the bondage of ignorance, the slavery of superstition, the deceptions of sophistication, and the delusions of false philosophy.

102:2.2 One of the characteristic peculiarities of genuine religious assurance is that, notwithstanding the absoluteness of its affirmations and the stanchness of its attitude, the spirit of its expression is so poised and tempered that it never conveys the slightest impression of self-assertion or egoistic exaltation. The wisdom of religious experience is something of a paradox in that it is both humanly original and Adjuster derivative. Religious force is not the product of the individual's personal prerogatives but rather the outworking of that sublime partnership of man and the everlasting source of all wisdom. Thus do the words and acts of true and undefiled religion become compellingly authoritative for all enlightened mortals.

102:2.3 It is difficult to identify and analyze the factors of a religious experience, but it is not difficult to observe that such religious practitioners live and carry on as if already in the presence of the Eternal. Believers react to this temporal life as if immortality already were within their grasp. In the lives of such mortals there is a valid originality and a spontaneity of expression that forever segregate them from those of their fellows who have imbibed only the wisdom of the world. Religionists seem to live in effective emancipation from harrying haste and the painful stress of the vicissitudes inherent in the temporal currents of time; they exhibit a stabilization of personality and a tranquillity of character not explained by the laws of physiology, psychology, and sociology.

Me here: In my opinion - only those without Divine Assurance do not share it with others. After all, one may not share what one does not possess!!

The reason for this sharing of Divine Assurance is that the very experience of Divine Assurance changes us. Profoundly changes us!! We become different people as we gain Divine Assurance by our personal religious experience!! We change our motives and intentions and priorities and choices and situational reactions and circumstantial responses! We are attaching our branch to the vine and the fruits of the Spirit are growing and growing and showing and showing!!!

It is ridiculous to suggest and impossible to achieve the withholding of our Divine Assurance Experience! Our lives are the very expressions of our experience! It is inevitable. It cannot be prevented. And it certainly should not be.

It is by our personal expression of our personally experienced faith, truth, and Divine Assurance that we change our perspective of the world around us and how we also change that world around us for the better!! To express faith and truth and assurance and wisdom is the very purpose of experiential reality itself.

140:3.13 "You are the light of the world. A city set upon a hill cannot be hid. Neither do men light a candle and put it under a bushel, but on a candlestick; and it gives light to all who are in the house. Let your light so shine before men that they may see your good works and be led to glorify your Father who is in heaven."

Bradly 8)


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I can assure others, when they trust me enough to consider my mind and my advice. It is something that Parents to for Children. Of course it is better for Beings to be self-directed in all ways of action and of the mind - that way faith can be of enough assurance!

Also, children assure me, by acting they way they do. They give me the kind of assurance that the Havoners have:
3:5.17 The creatures of Havona are naturally brave, but they are not courageous in the human sense. They are innately kind and considerate, but hardly altruistic in the human way. They are expectant of a pleasant future, but not hopeful in the exquisite manner of the trusting mortal of the uncertain evolutionary spheres. They have faith in the stability of the universe, but they are utter strangers to that saving faith whereby mortal man climbs from the status of an animal up to the portals of Paradise. They love the truth, but they know nothing of its soul-saving qualities. They are idealists, but they were born that way; they are wholly ignorant of the ecstasy of becoming such by exhilarating choice. They are loyal, but they have never experienced the thrill of wholehearted and intelligent devotion to duty in the face of temptation to default. They are unselfish, but they never gained such levels of experience by the magnificent conquest of a belligerent self. They enjoy pleasure, but they do not comprehend the sweetness of the pleasure escape from the pain potential.

And when other people are striving for righteousness, acting on faith, there is no good reason, if you are an honourable person, to "leave them in the cold", to withhold the recognition of truth, the recognition that another person is becoming a better worker, or more psychologically mature. There is no good reason to withhold or to hide, on a personal basis, the fact that you have come to trust others, the assurance of finally recognising - conveying - that you and your brother bear mutual goals.

Now Bradley has declared that humans are not required to assure others... But I find assurance necessary, at the day's end, in order to keep going in the arteries of progress. I need to trust people. Like the Rolling Stone's song "I cannot get no satisfaction" - people need to know what is good - in order to do more good.

So when you say "mortals cannot convey Divine assurance", I have already taken assurance to be a psychological quality to be earned by faith. Hence, even though a human attribute, human assurance is also divine. Remember that it is not good, according to the theological criticism of UB, for your conception of Jesus to be purely divine with zero consideration for his human experiences.

When you are talking this "Only God may promulgate the divine assurance", you are quitting the game before it starts. It is incumbent on householders to teach the ways of the house (we all must simply do the best each of we can). And so with assurance, you must answer the inner needs of the child, "yes this is good", or "no this is not good". Or "yes you have my permission" - like when Jesus gave Andrew the permission to follow him.

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If you think about this "the experience of God's love" as the means of the Adjuster assuring, by faith, the mind of the human individual. But if you can do better work, if you can realise God's will in the fullness, you yourself can find more ways to love others. Sure, I can have the experience of God's love now, but if I can forget about my perceived need for love, then I can go through the endurance of life now, and experience God's blessing later. I am terribly insecure about "cashing in" on God's love, because it means personally that I might become indolent. It is not even about my experience of knowing God and becoming like Him, I need to know that my capacity to love others is growing in time!

Even though God loves me, but this experience of being loved could be a temporal experience. My enemies will become jealous and maybe try to hurt me, if this experience is something exclusive. Being loved comes with it this "unbearable burden" that Prophet Jeremiah warned us not to complain about.

And then there is always this question, good boys and girls who did not have the chance to realise the fullness of God's love before their soul transpired unto Jerusem. Nigel and people like my friend Stephen need some kind of assurance, that those little ones survived, at least they pray for it. So, assurance, in my book at least, always is with respect to the human individual's realisation of the preserved potential for the eternal life. It is not about the knowing-experience of God's love, or of seeing God as a person, it is knowing that in eternity, there is the opportunity for the endless selfless service - that is how one earns eternal life, by becoming happy and enthusiastic about toil.

It is the assurance of having the opportunity for eternal service. "Enduring Love" or "Eternal torment" from God, I could have it either way!!!

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SEla_Kelly wrote:
If you think about this "the experience of God's love" as the means of the Adjuster assuring, by faith, the mind of the human individual. But if you can do better work, if you can realise God's will in the fullness, you yourself can find more ways to love others. Sure, I can have the experience of God's love now, but if I can forget about my perceived need for love, then I can go through the endurance of life now, and experience God's blessing later. I am terribly insecure about "cashing in" on God's love, because it means personally that I might become indolent. It is not even about my experience of knowing God and becoming like Him, I need to know that my capacity to love others is growing in time!

Even though God loves me, but this experience of being loved could be a temporal experience. My enemies will become jealous and maybe try to hurt me, if this experience is something exclusive. Being loved comes with it this "unbearable burden" that Prophet Jeremiah warned us not to complain about.

And then there is always this question, good boys and girls who did not have the chance to realise the fullness of God's love before their soul transpired unto Jerusem. Nigel and people like my friend Stephen need some kind of assurance, that those little ones survived, at least they pray for it. So, assurance, in my book at least, always is with respect to the human individual's realisation of the preserved potential for the eternal life. It is not about the knowing-experience of God's love, or of seeing God as a person, it is knowing that in eternity, there is the opportunity for the endless selfless service - that is how one earns eternal life, by becoming happy and enthusiastic about toil.

It is the assurance of having the opportunity for eternal service. "Enduring Love" or "Eternal torment" from God, I could have it either way!!!


Your defiance of the UB and embrace and proclamations of falsehoods are well known here Stephen. Thankfully you do not define Divine Assurance for anybody. God's love is NEVER temporal or exclusive or unbearable or a burden...it is none of those...not ever. And your torment is of your own invention and self inflicted.

And I just posted about mortals sjaring our own feelings of assurance with one another as important and an inevitable expression of that experience. You accuse me falsely and misquote me still again!


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Maybe not! but if my descriptions are sensible, and useful, if my words are helpful to others, let us see. Thanks for the boding of temperance. But in the end, I can rest easier knowing that at least I have expressed my view, that I have tried to do God's will. After all, God's love is unquestionable, all pervasive, yet hardly perceptible! It is too effervescent and transformative, and so many times I have counted myself out, and every time something new comes around for me to work on. But the guidance of the First Source and Center is too subtle for me to know its operation. I go natural cycles of doubt; in my darkened status, I cannot always discern God's love for every Being; but this is part of my personal psychological growth, it is even a part of my realisation of God's love for me. Well, but you know what it means to serve others, even to be obligated to serve them, when they tell you sincerely that you answered their prayer. God loves me? But why does he not find me more decent opportunities for labour, or answer more of my prayers after all? Why does God not help me to grow into the man he wanted me to become?

Clarification: God's love is not temporal, but God's love for me could be temporal, since I Stephen Kelly could be a temporal being.

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