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How Does God Know Everything?

Fri Apr 06, 2018 2:19 pm +0000

How does God know everything?

I've been told God knows everything since I was a small child. The lesson was to teach obedience to rules and my elders - it was focused on behavior. Over time it became more of a fable to me...I mean really - how could God know everything all the time everywhere? As a teenager, I began to notice that many adults apparently did not believe God knows everything based on their own choices and behaviors.

As a child I was taught to do the right thing to avoid punishment and this was also, and especially, true in regards to the 10 Commandments and Christian salvation....when punishment became eternal damnation and suffering in the lake of hell's fire and brimstone.....well, obedience took on a whole new importance! God knowing everything became a tool of fear by religious authorities to require and evaluate certain choices and behaviors which determined our life AFTER life. Then I noticed many such elders and leaders said one thing but did another which made the fear of God's knowledge subside further.

Finally I determined it was a fable, an invention by those with power to keep power over others...by fear, disgrace, guilt, and the rules. Boy, did I then break some rules!!

But there was a teaching by Jesus that stayed with me over time....that we should do right for the sake of right, that rightness (righteousness) was its own reward! Not to avoid sin and wrongness to avoid guilt and punishment - but, rather, to find the reward for doing right for right's sake. I came to consider the ethics of whether the ends do justify the means or the end never justifies unethical/immoral means and determined that it is the latter....or it was so for me...and I believed it to be so universally. One may not serve righteuosness unrighteously. Then I came to study the confirming truths of karma...or the inner consequences or repercussions of our choices...and the Christian reaping that which is sown....but more than our acts, it is our motives and our intentions and how those determine our choices and the outcomes and results of our choices that determines the harvest in one's mind, life, and soul.

And then I found the Urantia Book...or it found me! So much became clear, riddles were resolved, mysteries were answered, and clarity of details emerged which delivered great comfort to my mind.

And one of those is that God does indeed know everything, always. But this ledger and record of knowledge is a good thing; it is an instrument of love and mercy and kindness and patience and guidance and education and a record of personal progress measure and achievement and transformation and spiritization and transcendence along the pilgrim's path to Paradise! It is a record of right for rightness sake more than anything else! It is a record of our embrace of reality and faith and assurance recognition!

As to how does God know everything, and with whom does God share the knowledge of everything, and how is that done - the method is called reflectivity. The scope of refectivity is vast and remains mysterious even to the authors of the Papers. Let us consider:

9:7.1 [Part I]
The Conjoint Actor is able to co-ordinate all levels of universe actuality in such manner as to make possible the simultaneous recognition of the mental, the material, and the spiritual. This is the phenomenon of universe reflectivity, that unique and inexplicable power to see, hear, sense, and know all things as they transpire throughout a superuniverse, and to focalize, by reflectivity, all this information and knowledge at any desired point. The action of reflectivity is shown in perfection on each of the headquarters worlds of the seven superuniverses. It is also operative throughout all sectors of the superuniverses and within the boundaries of the local universes. Reflectivity finally focalizes on Paradise.

9:7.2 [Part I]
The phenomenon of reflectivity, as it is disclosed on the superuniverse headquarters worlds in the amazing performances of the reflective personalities there stationed, represents the most complex interassociation of all phases of existence to be found in all creation. Lines of spirit can be traced back to the Son, physical energy to Paradise, and mind to the Third Source; but in the extraordinary phenomenon of universe reflectivity there is a unique and exceptional unification of all three, so associated as to enable the universe rulers to know about remote conditions instantaneously, simultaneously with their occurrence.

9:7.3 [Part I]
Much of the technique of reflectivity we comprehend, but there are many phases which truly baffle us. We know that the Conjoint Actor is the universe center of the mind circuit, that he is the ancestor of the cosmic mind, and that cosmic mind operates under the dominance of the absolute mind gravity of the Third Source and Center. We know further that the circuits of the cosmic mind influence the intellectual levels of all known existence; they contain the universal space reports, and just as certainly they focus in the Seven Master Spirits and converge in the Third Source and Center.

9:7.4 [Part I]
The relationship between the finite cosmic mind and the divine absolute mind appears to be evolving in the experiential mind of the Supreme. We are taught that, in the dawn of time, this experiential mind was bestowed upon the Supreme by the Infinite Spirit, and we conjecture that certain features of the phenomenon of reflectivity can be accounted for only by postulating the activity of the Supreme Mind. If the Supreme is not concerned in reflectivity, we are at a loss to explain the intricate transactions and unerring operations of this consciousness of the cosmos.

I hope you will consider exploring the many quotes related to "reflective and reflectivity" and I hope for your comments, discussion, and thoughts on the fact and functionality that nothing in all of time and space is unknown to God or to those with whom God shares his universal and unlimited knowledge.

https://urantia-association.org/search/ ... t%5B%5D=-1

:idea: 8)

Re: How Does God Know Everything?

Sat Apr 07, 2018 5:34 am +0000

The UB teaches that there are "circuits" of certain universal realities that originate in and emanate from and return to Paradise, or perhaps more accurately God, as one of the expressions of the Trinity. They are referred to as gravity circuits - they include the personality, mind, spirit, and material gravity circuits. The purposes of these circuits is the organization, unification, integration, harmonization, continuity, functionality, connectivity, and expression of the Creators and all of creation and all creatures in that creation....nothing and no one is not connected in Creation....whether those and that which are eternal and perfected or created in time and space and perfecting. Everything and everyone is connected to God and originates from and by God in multiple circuits of connectivity and orbit...no matter how close or distant or remote by time or space or size or mass or any other measure of fact, function, meaning, or value....everything real or potentially real originates in/by/from and returns to its source.

Reflectivity functions within every circuit. Each circuit has a function of monitoring and knowing every fact and detail of every 'transaction' and 'interaction' and 'reaction' in the circuit. Nothing occurs within a circuit that is not known by the source and monitor of the circuit. And the source and monitor of each circuit has the power and ability to "focalize" any data or set of data from any point within the circuit to any other point in the circuit...or any other circuit point....as these circuits also 'impinge' upon each other and are coordinated and cooperate with one another as directed by those Deities charged with them.

This is how and why God knows everything...no matter how small or distant among all the trillions upon trillions of beings throughout the farflung universe of universes and all the potential being actualized and all the potential being created by the actualization of potential and in all that ever was or ever will be...God knows every iota about the totality of everything and every tittle within every iota!!! Even thoughts and yearnings and hopes and motives and intentions and spiritization and loyalty and dignity and nobility and personal integration and integrity and ability and tenacity and capacity and potential and destiny and evenutations and outcomes in time of that not yet even potential!!!! God knows everything. There is nothing God does not know. And God can and does share this knowing with whomever he wills in and by the circuits of knowing!

This is the final and absolute assurance we have of truth, fact, love, mercy, patience, understanding, fairness, kindness, justice, and certainty of right and wrong in all matters related to all individuals and all acts and motives of all individuals in all situations in all of time and all of space and all of eternity and all that has been and all that is to come!

And for us mortals in time and space, it is evolutionary faith assurance and revelatory truth assurance that teaches us this fact and foundation of our existance upon which we may build that truth adventure of discovery and expression that is our legacy and we may do so with absolute trust and confidence....the sublime assurance that brings poise, peace, and happiness to us no matter the material struggle or the sufferings we might encounter or endure....exemplified by Jesus the Son of Man.

6. The Mind-Gravity Circuit

(103.6) 9:6.1 The Third Source and Center, the universal intelligence, is personally conscious of every mind, every intellect, in all creation, and he maintains a personal and perfect contact with all these physical, morontial, and spiritual creatures of mind endowment in the far-flung universes. All these activities of mind are grasped in the absolute mind-gravity circuit which focalizes in the Third Source and Center and is a part of the personal consciousness of the Infinite Spirit.

(103.7) 9:6.2 Much as the Father draws all personality to himself, and as the Son attracts all spiritual reality, so does the Conjoint Actor exercise a drawing power on all minds; he unqualifiedly dominates and controls the universal mind circuit. All true and genuine intellectual values, all divine thoughts and perfect ideas, are unerringly drawn into this absolute circuit of mind.

(104.1) 9:6.3 Mind gravity can operate independently of material and spiritual gravity, but wherever and whenever the latter two impinge, mind gravity always functions. When all three are associated, personality gravity may embrace the material creature — physical or morontial, finite or absonite. But irrespective of this, the endowment of mind even in impersonal beings qualifies them to think and endows them with consciousness despite the total absence of personality.

(104.2) 9:6.4 Selfhood of personality dignity, human or divine, immortal or potentially immortal, does not however originate in either spirit, mind, or matter; it is the bestowal of the Universal Father. Neither is the interaction of spirit, mind, and material gravity a prerequisite to the appearance of personality gravity. The Father’s circuit may embrace a mind-material being who is unresponsive to spirit gravity, or it may include a mind-spirit being who is unresponsive to material gravity. The operation of personality gravity is always a volitional act of the Universal Father.

(104.3) 9:6.5 While mind is energy associated in purely material beings and spirit associated in purely spiritual personalities, innumerable orders of personality, including the human, possess minds that are associated with both energy and spirit. The spiritual aspects of creature mind unfailingly respond to the spirit-gravity pull of the Eternal Son; the material features respond to the gravity urge of the material universe.

(104.4) 9:6.6 Cosmic mind, when not associated with either energy or spirit, is subject to the gravity demands of neither material nor spiritual circuits. Pure mind is subject only to the universal gravity grasp of the Conjoint Actor. Pure mind is close of kin to infinite mind, and infinite mind (the theoretical co-ordinate of the absolutes of spirit and energy) is apparently a law in itself.


Just a reminder....all that I post that is not a direct quote from the UB is only opinions of a student of that text and is likely to be incomplete if not inaccurate and is only based upon my limited understanding and perception...others' opinions and perspective are welcome!

Re: How Does God Know Everything?

Sat Apr 07, 2018 6:33 am +0000

28:5.19 (313.1) 7. The Discerner of Spirits. A special liaison exists between the counselors and advisers of the second Havona circle and these reflective angels. They are the only seconaphim attached to the Universal Censors but are probably the most uniquely specialized of all their fellows. Regardless of the source or channel of information, no matter how meager the evidence at hand, when it is subjected to their reflective scrutiny, these discerners will forthwith inform us as to the true motive, the actual purpose, and the real nature of its origin. I marvel at the superb functioning of these angels, who so unerringly reflect the actual moral and spiritual character of any individual concerned in a focal exposure.

28:5.20 (313.2) The Discerners of Spirits carry on these intricate services by virtue of inherent “spiritual insight,” if I may use such words in an endeavor to convey to the human mind the thought that these reflective angels thus function intuitively, inherently, and unerringly. When the Universal Censors behold these presentations, they are face to face with the naked soul of the reflected individual; and this very certainty and perfection of portraiture in part explains why the Censors can always function so justly as righteous judges. The discerners always accompany the Censors on any mission away from Uversa, and they are just as effective out in the universes as at their Uversa headquarters.

28:6.13 (315.6) 4. The Solemnity of Trust. Trust is the crucial test of will creatures. Trustworthiness is the true measure of self-mastery, character. These seconaphim accomplish a double purpose in the economy of the superuniverses: They portray to all will creatures the sense of the obligation, sacredness, and solemnity of trust. At the same time they unerringly reflect to the governing authorities the exact trustworthiness of any candidate for confidence or trust.

17:3.2 [Part I]
The Reflective Spirits have names, but these designations are not revealed on the worlds of space. They pertain to the nature and character of these beings and are a part of one of the seven universal mysteries of the secret spheres of Paradise.

17:3.3 [Part I]
The attribute of reflectivity, the phenomenon of the mind levels of the Conjoint Actor, the Supreme Being, and the Master Spirits, is transmissible to all beings concerned in the working of this vast scheme of universal intelligence. And herein is a great mystery: Neither the Master Spirits nor the Paradise Deities, singly or collectively, disclose these powers of co-ordinate universal reflectivity just as they are manifested in these forty-nine liaison personalities of Majeston, and yet they are the creators of all these marvelously endowed beings. Divine heredity does sometimes disclose in the creature certain attributes which are not discernible in the Creator.

17:3.4 [Part I]
The personnel of the reflectivity service, with the exception of Majeston and the Reflective Spirits, are all the creatures of the Infinite Spirit and his immediate associates and subordinates. The Reflective Spirits of each superuniverse are the creators of their Reflective Image Aids, their personal voices to the courts of the Ancients of Days.

17:3.5 [Part I]
The Reflective Spirits are not merely transmitting agents; they are retentive personalities as well. Their offspring, the seconaphim, are also retentive or record personalities. Everything of true spiritual value is registered in duplicate, and one impression is preserved in the personal equipment of some member of one of the numerous orders of secoraphic personalities belonging to the vast staff of the Reflective Spirits.

17:3.6 [Part I]
The formal records of the universes are passed up by and through the angelic recorders, but the true spiritual records are assembled by reflectivity and are preserved in the minds of suitable and appropriate personalities belonging to the family of the Infinite Spirit. These are the live records in contrast with the formal and dead records of the universe, and they are perfectly preserved in the living minds of the recording personalities of the Infinite Spirit.

Me here: The circuits operate at every level of universe organization and in all its constituent parts if sourced in Paradise. The functionality of the circuits is applicable at the Super and Local Universe levels and is an important element in the organization, creation, management, development, and progress at every level of these time and space progressive and perfecting regions. So any thought or belief or claim that anything might by unknown or mysterious or secret or secreted or secretable or misunderstood or inaccurate or otherwise incomplete or inaccurate is a falsehood.

All may not be known or knowable by all but it certainly is known by some and is transmittable and transferrable to any by focalization within in any gravity circuit....and all that is known and knowable is duly recorded and archived and retrievable and transmittable at any time to any mind in any place by reflectivity. There can be no doubt as to the certainty of God's knowing and knowledge and the fact of this knowledge related to all beings and all things in all time and all space since all beginnings and before those beginnings and for all of eternity and all of eternity to come.

There are those pitiful voices and minds who have attended and posted here which endlessly lament their claimed unreliability and uncertainty of fairness, mercy, testimony, knowledge, fact, etc. in the ministry of justice in heaven and those who accuse the celestial hosts and our universe and planetary rulers of very human weaknesses and failures. Pity for them who lack the assurance of faith and truth and wallow in such darkness, doubt, suspicion, fear, anxiety, and paranoia. For nothing could be more impossible!! Nothing could be further from reality!!

And this is the message of the Jesusonian Gospel and of the FER....we may trust and be assured that love rules the universe and we are family in a friendly and Divinely organized and managed universe of grand adventure and progress. We may be certain of that and act accordingly! May all the doubters and anxious folk come to the light of this great truth and good news!

This is why I claim and how I came to know that it is a good thing that God knows everything. For he knows us by his love for us and his kindness and mercy and patience is that of a loving parent who nurtures and guides their beloved children through all the errors and mistakes inherent in learning better and better by trial and error to excel and grow and gain strength and capability by experiential maturity and the perfecting that time delivers to all beings....potential is not realized without a struggle and volitional victory that only maturity by experience might deliver.

We are given that time by our loving parents...sufficient time and opportunity to overcome the imperfections of immaturity and inexperience. We are judged by our hopes and ideals and the flicker that leads us forward toward the greater light within and we are not judged harshly or quickly or unkindly or unfairly. How does one judge a child for being childish? Consider the age appropriate standard for our own children. Do they run before they walk or walk before they stand? Neither does the soul. Do our heavenly parents judge us more strictly than we judge our own children? Indeed not...just the opposite in fact....we are judged even more patiently and kindly and lovingly as we grow.

17:3.7 [Part I]
The reflectivity organization is also the news-gathering and the decree-disseminating mechanism of all creation. It is in constant operation in contrast with the periodic functioning of the various broadcast services.

17:3.8 [Part I]
Everything of import transpiring on a local universe headquarters is inherently reflected to the capital of its superuniverse. And conversely, everything of local universe significance is reflected outward to the local universe capitals from the headquarters of their superuniverse. The reflectivity service from the universes of time up to the superuniverses is apparently automatic or self-operating, but it is not. It is all very personal and intelligent; its precision results from perfection of personality co-operation and therefore can hardly be attributed to the impersonal presence-performances of the Absolutes.

17:3.9 [Part I]
While Thought Adjusters do not participate in the operation of the universal reflectivity system, we have every reason to believe that all Father fragments are fully cognizant of these transactions and are able to avail themselves of their content.

28:6.14 (316.1) On Urantia, you grotesquely essay to read character and to estimate specific abilities, but on Uversa we actually do these things in perfection. These seconaphim weigh trustworthiness in the living scales of unerring character appraisal, and when they have looked at you, we have only to look at them to know the limitations of your ability to discharge responsibility, execute trust, and fulfill missions. Your assets of trustworthiness are clearly set forth alongside your liabilities of possible default or betrayal.

28:6.15 (316.2) It is the plan of your superiors to advance you by augmented trusts just as fast as your character is sufficiently developed to gracefully bear these added responsibilities, but to overload the individual only courts disaster and insures disappointment. And the mistake of placing responsibility prematurely upon either man or angel may be avoided by utilizing the ministry of these infallible estimators of the trust capacity of the individuals of time and space. These seconaphim ever accompany Those High in Authority, and never do these executives make assignments until their candidates have been weighed in the secoraphic balances and pronounced “not wanting.”

Me here: So our very progress and perfecting proceeds according to the function of 'knowing'. We are advanced by this knowing far more than we might be 'judged' by the knowing. We are measured and weighed by the quantity and quality of our experience and we are trusted and tested according to the 'knowing' of our capacity and capability. Remember helping our babies to sit up and stand and our toddlers to walk and to throw a ball and then throw it straight and true? Remember the thrill they and we enjoyed? That's what the 'knowing' is all about! To teach and nurture and share the thrill of such victory!! It's a good thing, a very good thing indeed!

:wink: :biggrin: 8)

Re: How Does God Know Everything?

Sat Apr 14, 2018 7:45 am +0000

Although this thread appears to be a musing, I perceive you will consider me seriously.

I do not believe that "God knows everything." Let me be clear, that I accept that God has the full awareness of every universe phenomenon, and that His Existential Nature pervades the myriad realms which our souls may not even fathom.

However, we must consider the distinction between "What is known", "What is knowable", and "What is unknowable". We can consider this for ourselves in a finite sense, whereas even for God, we can say that the need for experience, the need for experiencial Deity, that the Supreme Being's very existence indicates that there is mystery even for God. There are "knowables" which have not yet been edified in their finalities.

Now, it may be too audacious for me to claim that there are suches such as "unknowables" for God.

But I refuse to equate omniscience per se with the claim that "God knows everything". I can only assume that in my own pursuit of the maximum knowledge, that God is seeking to attain maximum knowledge, and that most/much of such knowledge was inherent and existential to His Being.

Re: How Does God Know Everything?

Tue Apr 17, 2018 10:37 am +0000

Greetings SEla!!

I understand your meaning and have similar thoughts myself. The point of the topic and text is that God knows everything that happens and has happened. But I am also perplexed by God's ability to know the future realization and actualization of what is now merely potential!

I have read opinions that God does indeed know the future of all outcomes from the position of eternity and infinity existence beyond the limits of time and space. If so, I certainly do not understand that.

While it may be "audacious" of you....I hope you might consider to explore the "unknowables" you perceive or believe to be potential related to the First Source and Center.

We are told there is a purpose to the reality of the experiential Deity we know as God The Supreme and I think one of those purposes is to come to know or learn such unknowables.

I think the issue is very appropriate to the topic SEla...and thanks for speaking up!

Bradly 8)

Re: How Does God Know Everything?

Wed Apr 18, 2018 5:39 am +0000

The UB does not specify or define that which is "unknowable" but does suggest that there is such a thing. Perhaps that which is unknowable is the free will choice in the moment which is still to be chosen by free will creatures...and mostly, I think, by the lower orders of those, whose unpredictability and unreliability is more unknowable, perhaps, but also everything that might be considered spontaneous and creative or co-creative or delivered to mind by insight and the formation of individual wisdom due to experience at every level of time and space?

Paper 118 offers insight into how the unknowables of free will and omniscience can coexist in reality. It has to do with the localized and temporal limits of experiential free will so that only those free will choices based on reality and aligned with or expressions of the Divine Will radiate throughout all of reality for all of eternity. The repercussions of free will are predetermined so to speak by the filtering mechanisms of reality. In this way, the ultimate and eventuated future and outcome of time is knowable to God before time itself delivers that outcome. We are told we cannot understand this and I obviously don't....hahahahaha. Still a good exercise in speculation and reflection.

7. Omniscience and Predestination

(1300.5) 118:7.1 The function of Creator will and creature will, in the grand universe, operates within the limits, and in accordance with the possibilities, established by the Master Architects. This foreordination of these maximum limits does not, however, in the least abridge the sovereignty of creature will within these boundaries. Neither does ultimate foreknowledge — full allowance for all finite choice — constitute an abrogation of finite volition. A mature and farseeing human being might be able to forecast the decision of some younger associate most accurately, but this foreknowledge takes nothing away from the freedom and genuineness of the decision itself. The Gods have wisely limited the range of the action of immature will, but it is true will, nonetheless, within these defined limits.

(1300.6) 118:7.2 Even the supreme correlation of all past, present, and future choice does not invalidate the authenticity of such choosings. It rather indicates the foreordained trend of the cosmos and suggests foreknowledge of those volitional beings who may, or may not, elect to become contributory parts of the experiential actualization of all reality.

(1300.7) 118:7.3 Error in finite choosing is time bound and time limited. It can exist only in time and within the evolving presence of the Supreme Being. Such mistaken choosing is time possible and indicates (besides the incompleteness of the Supreme) that certain range of choice with which immature creatures must be endowed in order to enjoy universe progression by making freewill contact with reality.

(1301.1) 118:7.4 Sin in time-conditioned space clearly proves the temporal liberty — even license — of the finite will. Sin depicts immaturity dazzled by the freedom of the relatively sovereign will of personality while failing to perceive the supreme obligations and duties of cosmic citizenship.

(1301.2) 118:7.5 Iniquity in the finite domains reveals the transient reality of all God-unidentified selfhood. Only as a creature
becomes God identified, does he become truly real in the universes. Finite personality is not self-created, but in the superuniverse arena of choice it does self-determine destiny.

Here's the keyword search results for omniscience:

https://urantia-association.org/search/ ... t%5B%5D=-1


Re: How Does God Know Everything?

Thu Apr 19, 2018 12:41 am +0000

There is also another aspect to consider with the concept "unknowable". The Unqualified Absolute is one case in point. There are surely mysteries embedded in Him/Her/It that escape every finite being. How can something that is unqualified in the absolute sense be knowable?

Re: How Does God Know Everything?

Fri Apr 20, 2018 6:24 pm +0000

As much as you purport that God knows exactly what will happen, is the condition of how much potentials "has been given unto the hand of man" (mankind). We control in a deterministic fashion, for instance, the level of cooperation for the adjutant spirit ministry, and to a certain extent the archangel circuit of Nebadon on Urantia, and the diplomatic peaceful relationship we have with our midway cousins. Our ability to determine the future can be known only by God's profound knowledge that is lain within each human's divine potential (potentiality). But what causeways may run their course, can only be born of a truly religious and unconsciously based emotive, that allow us to fulfill God's will. To have God's will fulfilled on Urantia, that is the same as to say that each person will have the most of everything good & grand in life.

Re: How Does God Know Everything?

Sat Apr 21, 2018 9:04 am +0000

Who has purported "that God knows exactly what will happen"? You claim that God does not. An interesting topic. My claim is that God knows everything that does happen, as it happens, and all that has happened...that's all I claimed...or intended to.

And I think God knows all the eventuations of all potentials...in total. But I agree there is that which is unknowable.

Ricktare - the issue is not that which is unknowable to mortal or celestial minds or any minds in time and space but the unknowables of God. What does God not know?

And I agree there is that which is unknowable to God...but I don't know what that might include.

Appropriate topic related to my title here: How Does God Know Everything? The first question should be Does God Know Everything? If not, then what doesn't God know?

My intention here was to introduce Reflectivity and its function. Perhaps my claim overreached reflectivity?


Re: How Does God Know Everything?

Sun Apr 22, 2018 1:29 pm +0000

The topic title indicates a question but it also implies that God does know everything.

I'm a little surprised that the answer is not forthcoming even though the answer is in the UB itself.
It plainly indicates that our Father resides in a place where time is not active, and if we live in a time relative reality, our Father knows the future before it occurs for us, therefore seeing things without the influence of time, knows what we will choose in our future.

Now the question would be, if He knows everything, why does He not intervene?

The answer should be simple and would not require presenting the entire narration of the UB in order to answer this question? But, there are some who just like to be the center of attention.

Re: How Does God Know Everything?

Mon Apr 23, 2018 5:40 am +0000

So does God know every future choice made by every free will? Or does God know only the ultimate outcomes of those collective choices over time? There is a significant difference far beyond semantics in the two - the results and the determination of those results- or the aggregation results but not the aggregating process of the result. And what then is meant by "unknowable"? For, according to text, there is obviously that so described and it lies beyond or within omniscience.

So, the result of perfecting will be perfection...God knows that result of perfecting. Does God know of the process of perfecting by experiential free will and all those choices? I don't think so. There is no predestination or fate on any individual basis. No personal preexistence and no personal predestination or fate. So, omniscience must be defined within and limited by those realities as well.

110:2.1 (1204.5) When Thought Adjusters indwell human minds, they bring with them the model careers, the ideal lives, as determined and foreordained by themselves and the Personalized Adjusters of Divinington, which have been certified by the Personalized Adjuster of Urantia. Thus they begin work with a definite and predetermined plan for the intellectual and spiritual development of their human subjects, but it is not incumbent upon any human being to accept this plan. You are all subjects of predestination, but it is not foreordained that you must accept this divine predestination; you are at full liberty to reject any part or all of the Thought Adjusters’ program. It is their mission to effect such mind changes and to make such spiritual adjustments as you may willingly and intelligently authorize, to the end that they may gain more influence over the personality directionization; but under no circumstances do these divine Monitors ever take advantage of you or in any way arbitrarily influence you in your choices and decisions. The Adjusters respect your sovereignty of personality; they are always subservient to your will.

The text says that God does not intervene in free will. Rather, limits are placed upon its effective area/sphere of repercussion. Righteous choices have unlimited and unrestricted effects while evil/error, sin, and iniquity are always restrained, contained, and confined by both spatial and time effects to limit all effects of those and keep them temporal...thus they have no effect upon ultimacy, eventuation, realization, or the futures of time and space reality....or any eternal quality or quantity of being.

It is my hope that the Urantia Papers remain as the center of all attention here and at every study group and gathering of students.

As to reflectivity and omniscience:

9:7.3 (105.3) Much of the technique of reflectivity we comprehend, but there are many phases which truly baffle us. We know that the Conjoint Actor is the universe center of the mind circuit, that he is the ancestor of the cosmic mind, and that cosmic mind operates under the dominance of the absolute mind gravity of the Third Source and Center. We know further that the circuits of the cosmic mind influence the intellectual levels of all known existence; they contain the universal space reports, and just as certainly they focus in the Seven Master Spirits and converge in the Third Source and Center.

9:7.4 (105.4) The relationship between the finite cosmic mind and the divine absolute mind appears to be evolving in the experiential mind of the Supreme. We are taught that, in the dawn of time, this experiential mind was bestowed upon the Supreme by the Infinite Spirit, and we conjecture that certain features of the phenomenon of reflectivity can be accounted for only by postulating the activity of the Supreme Mind. If the Supreme is not concerned in reflectivity, we are at a loss to explain the intricate transactions and unerring operations of this consciousness of the cosmos.

9:7.5 (105.5) Reflectivity appears to be omniscience within the limits of the experiential finite and may represent the emergence of the presence-consciousness of the Supreme Being. If this assumption is true, then the utilization of reflectivity in any of its phases is equivalent to partial contact with the consciousness of the Supreme.

What is included in the "unknowable" - for omniscience does NOT imply the knowing of the unknowable?

3:3.5 [Part I]
Omnipotence does not imply the power to do the nondoable, the ungodlike act. Neither does omniscience imply the knowing of the unknowable. But such statements can hardly be made comprehensible to the finite mind. The creature can hardly understand the range and limitations of the will of the Creator.


Re: How Does God Know Everything?

Wed Apr 25, 2018 5:47 am +0000

Good references fanOfVan. It may be that the existence of the Unqualified Absolute and Thought Adjusters are due to The Universal Father's decision to divest himself, on certain planes of existence and functioning, of certain aspects or repercussions of omniscience. Possibly that was quite necessary if the finite cosmos were to work as it does to provide true opportunity for evolving and perfecting creatures.

Then, it's maybe not as much of a mystery because that which is "unknowable" is due to his chosen divestment. But the mystery of completely understanding such things still exists and may always exist for finite beings. I suppose we might even question whether "unknowable" even really exists or is possible in the absolute. The concept of a quality of "unknowable" may be an allowance on the part of our spiritual seniors because is useful to our growing minds.

Re: How Does God Know Everything?

Wed Apr 25, 2018 7:27 am +0000

Agree Riktare...I doubt that even finality will bring evolutionary, experiential beings a true understanding of all the mysteries of God, Paradise, Havona, Deity, Divinity, Infinity, Eternity - either timelessness or without beginning....and many other such realities.

Been studying Paper 118 and would appreciate any help by any student to consider a review of the teachings therein related to the topic at hand....how does God know everything?...or does God know everything?...and what is unknowable to God?...and what's the difference in knowing ultimate outcomes and pre-knowing the free will choices and outworking of potential, especially an ever increasing potential delivered by the endless procession of the realization of prior potential.

Will perfecting ever result in perfection? Does enlightening ever result in enlightenment? I don't think so, no. I think both are inherently forevermore in scope and scale....experiential wisdom cannot cease to grow until there is nothing else to experience, there is no more potential or uncertainty to experience. Such experiential beings and Deity in or from time and space are forever liberated from the fetters and "limitations of pre-evolutionary existence."

The very function/result of potential actualization is ever greater potential....which theoretically precludes and prevents any ultimacy at all...and yet we know each universe level and era has its fulfillment and becomes the antechamber of the next epoch and era and the destiny for all prior epochs and eras:

118:0.10 (1294.10) Creative growth is unending but ever satisfying, endless in extent but always punctuated by those personality-satisfying moments of transient goal attainment which serve so effectively as the mobilization preludes to new adventures in cosmic growth, universe exploration, and Deity attainment.

118:0.11 (1294.11) While the domain of mathematics is beset with qualitative limitations, it does provide the finite mind with a conceptual basis of contemplating infinity. There is no quantitative limitation to numbers, even in the comprehension of the finite mind. No matter how large the number conceived, you can always envisage one more being added. And also, you can comprehend that that is short of infinity, for no matter how many times you repeat this addition to number, still always one more can be added.

118:0.12 (1294.12) At the same time, the infinite series can be totaled at any given point, and this total (more properly, a subtotal) provides the fullness of the sweetness of goal attainment for a given person at a given time and status. But sooner or later, this same person begins to hunger and yearn for new and greater goals, and such adventures in growth will be forever forthcoming in the fullness of time and the cycles of eternity.

118:0.13 (1294.13) Each successive universe age is the antechamber of the following era of cosmic growth, and each universe epoch provides immediate destiny for all preceding stages. Havona, in and of itself, is a perfect, but perfection-limited, creation; Havona perfection, expanding out into the evolutionary superuniverses, finds not only cosmic destiny but also liberation from the limitations of pre-evolutionary existence.

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