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The more you know what the Urantia Book says, the harder the goal becomes what it doesn't say.

(160:5.5) The social characteristics of a true religion consist in the fact that it invariably seeks to convert the individual and to transform the world. Religion implies the existence of undiscovered ideals which far transcend the known standards of ethics and morality embodied in even the highest social usages of the most mature institutions of civilization. Religion reaches out for undiscovered ideals, unexplored realities, superhuman values, divine wisdom, and true spirit attainment. True religion does all of this; all other beliefs are not worthy of the name. You cannot have a genuine spiritual religion without the supreme and supernal ideal of an eternal God. A religion without this God is an invention of man, a human institution of lifeless intellectual beliefs and meaningless emotional ceremonies. A religion might claim as the object of its devotion a great ideal. But such ideals of unreality are not attainable; such a concept is illusionary. The only ideals susceptible of human attainment are the divine realities of the infinite values resident in the spiritual fact of the eternal God.


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nod says: "The more you know what the Urantia Book says, the harder the goal becomes what it doesn't say. "


Yes...ignorance is bliss....enjoy!! Indeed, one must know what the Papers reveal before facing what they do not say. Contradicting what they say just demonstrates ignorance. You have claimed here that the UB is DANGEROUS!! I claim that it is a book of important facts that require great study to learn all those relevant facts for their application in daily living. So, is it what it says that's dangerous...or what it doesn't say? Or is it that what it doesn't say is more important than what it does say? Weird.

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The Urantia Book says that what it doesn't say will be earned (discovered) through real spiritual experience. Ignorance of this is what's weird. Knowing what the Urantia Book says should encourage the discovery of what it doesn't say. That's the goal that gets harder to reach when what it says is ignored.


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Perhaps we should learn the tens of thousands of facts within the UB before worrying so much about what's yet to learn? We have eternity to learn everything. After 40 years of reading and study, there is still much to learn for me in the 2000 pages of facts and truth already in my lap. I'm not ignoring what's within the Papers, I am studying it. Good luck in all your speculations. Such impatience must surely be a burden?

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106:0.1 (1162.1) IT IS not enough that the ascending mortal should know something of the relations of Deity to the genesis and manifestations of cosmic reality; he should also comprehend something of the relationships existing between himself and the numerous levels of existential and experiential realities, of potential and actual realities. Man’s terrestrial orientation, his cosmic insight, and his spiritual directionization are all enhanced by a better comprehension of universe realities and their techniques of interassociation, integration, and unification.


nod....you said "Knowing what the Urantia Book says should encourage the discovery of what it doesn't say."

Perhaps what you are suggesting/inferring is that study of the UB should lead one into a closer walk with the Spirit within, which then delivers personal/auto revelation (which certainly does not mean that the study/knowledge of the UB is a prerequisite for that relationship to blossom and bring forth fruit...as the UB teaches - factual knowledge is very helpful but it is not required for faith to leverage choice into personal growth - indeed, faith always trumps knowledge while faith with knowledge certainly trumps either choice in isolation). Or perhaps you mean that the actualization of truth by its application and discovery in personal experience is, likewise, not available within the UB but as a practical matter does require the experience of decision making, personal growth, and circle progress by actually living that which is learned within text?

I would heartily agree with both of those positions!! But of course....this is precisely WHAT the UB SAYS....it is not what it does not say but what it does say. I wonder still what the UB does not say that should be said?

The knowledge of the ages presented in the UB is not any form of substitute for living in and by truth in harmonic response to the Spirit within!! As we are clearly instructed with the words in the Papers! It is the combination of factual knowledge, living faith, and personal experience, we are taught in the Papers, that leads to circle progress and eventual fusion.

The quote above says that factual knowledge and understanding of the cosmology of the universe and the history of the world and universe and the relationships within all levels of the universe are very helpful to our "orientation", "insight", "directionization", and "comprehension" "of universe realities".

We are taught that epochal revelation is very important to individuals and to entire worlds to reduce ignorance and the failures of ignorance to achieve truth and respond to truth.....reduced confusions and elimination of error.

This book of knowledge comes to us at a time when we have the Son's Spirit of Truth and the Father's Spirit of TA, in addition to the Holy Spirit to effectively utilize such knowledge to our benefit. It is no accident as to its timing of delivery and its contents, to help us each and all to fully engage our minds in spiritization and personal/social progress by such factual knowledge for our "interassociation, integration, and unification".....certainly we might claim that this completion of spirit ministries is related to the "significance of the death of Jesus Christ" as well as the value of epochal revelation and also the evidence of planetary progress since Pentecost.

I hope I have achieved a better understanding of your thoughts here?

8)


Last edited by fanofVan on Fri Oct 28, 2016 8:04 am +0000, edited 1 time in total.

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fanofVan wrote:
I hope I have achieved a better understanding of your thoughts here?


Yes Brad, you have my thoughts understood very well.

Thank you for taking the time to research the book and for providing the quote you used to support it. It was refreshing reading your beautifully expressed post. I understand your thoughts completely.

I would like to emphasize what you said about faith and how it results in the knowledge of what the Urantia Book doesn't say and of course cannot say. Because these are the things that can only be revealed personally by the indwelling Spirit in accordance with our faith and how well we live our lives in accordance to God's will.

All these things are very beautiful and bring great joy to living - the most profound and truest miracle of all, simply having been given the privilege of being alive to live in God's great Universe.

And all of this to me makes the significance of the death of Jesus Christ very personal. It's through him that all of it is made possible, and I'm inexpressibly grateful.


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Very glad to have achieved mutual understanding. :wink: :biggrin:

One example from Jesus while living and while hanging on the cross which leverages our faith and brings true spirit progress within (and regardless of knowledge of cosmology, etc.): (A great tonic for anxiety and fear by the way.)

144:4.2 (1621.1) The earnest and longing repetition of any petition, when such a prayer is the sincere expression of a child of God and is uttered in faith, no matter how ill-advised or impossible of direct answer, never fails to expand the soul’s capacity for spiritual receptivity.

144:4.3 (1621.2) In all praying, remember that sonship is a gift. No child has aught to do with earning the status of son or daughter. The earth child comes into being by the will of its parents. Even so, the child of God comes into grace and the new life of the spirit by the will of the Father in heaven. Therefore must the kingdom of heaven — divine sonship — be received as by a little child. You earn righteousness — progressive character development — but you receive sonship by grace and through faith.

144:4.4 (1621.3) Prayer led Jesus up to the supercommunion of his soul with the Supreme Rulers of the universe of universes. Prayer will lead the mortals of earth up to the communion of true worship. The soul’s spiritual capacity for receptivity determines the quantity of heavenly blessings which can be personally appropriated and consciously realized as an answer to prayer.

144:4.5 (1621.4) Prayer and its associated worship is a technique of detachment from the daily routine of life, from the monotonous grind of material existence. It is an avenue of approach to spiritualized self-realization and individuality of intellectual and religious attainment.

144:4.6 (1621.5) Prayer is an antidote for harmful introspection. At least, prayer as the Master taught it is such a beneficent ministry to the soul. Jesus consistently employed the beneficial influence of praying for one’s fellows. The Master usually prayed in the plural, not in the singular. Only in the great crises of his earth life did Jesus ever pray for himself.

144:4.7 (1621.6) Prayer is the breath of the spirit life in the midst of the material civilization of the races of mankind. Worship is salvation for the pleasure-seeking generations of mortals.

144:4.8 (1621.7) As prayer may be likened to recharging the spiritual batteries of the soul, so worship may be compared to the act of tuning in the soul to catch the universe broadcasts of the infinite spirit of the Universal Father.

144:4.9 (1621.8) Prayer is the sincere and longing look of the child to its spirit Father; it is a psychologic process of exchanging the human will for the divine will. Prayer is a part of the divine plan for making over that which is into that which ought to be.

:biggrin: :idea: 8)


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nod....hope you will excuse my confusion.

You said: "The more you know what the Urantia Book says, the harder the goal becomes what it doesn't say."

Then said: "Knowing what the Urantia Book says should encourage the discovery of what it doesn't say. That's the goal that gets harder to reach when what it says is ignored."

Hate to quibble....but this has not been my experience at all. For me, it has become easier and easier to experience life by the light and map of the UB and to adjust my motives, intentions, priorities, and choices by its study and implementation in the daily walk of life. The goal does not become harder....but easier. That goal does not get "harder to reach"....but then, I, for one, am not and have not "ignored" what it teaches.

So....I fail to understand....again. Who is studying and ignoring? It is indeed true that many read (selectively) and come to very false conclusions (your post of your cousin's rant is one example - the DANGERS of the UB here at TB is an awesome example of ignoring what the UB actually says!).

Those who truly read the entire text multiple times and study it in earnest and then apply its teachings will not be misled or misguided or disappointed in the results of applying the techniques and realities presented to Paradise Pilgrims.

The map, the lamp, the path, the terrain, and the journey....within and without...a replete guide for an awesome adventure in a friendly universe filled with love, mercy, patience, and the gentle whisper of our pilot home.

I do not measure or worry about the progress of other tadpoles. But I do so enjoy the discovery of fact and truth by and with my fellows who also study this Guide Book to the Universe and Eternity!

8)


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It is interesting to note that circle progress does not relieve any truth seeker from the "vicissitudes" of life or the "edges of conflict" that must be traversed in our mortal life. Indeed, the angels seek out conflict for our personal resolution, by faith and by wisdom, repeatedly...over and over and over again....as an educational process for the tadpole!!

So, I did not mean to say my life has become easier or less complicated...but my approach has become more direct and faithful which has led to more confidence in my uncertainties, less stress in my disappointments, frustrations, and failures....and far more humor and patience with my obstacles!

We will learn to feast and fatten on uncertainties!!

It is not that life's challenges become less in number or severity, but my expanded time unit perspective of source and destiny certainly reduces all anxieties and fear regarding any and all material issues along the way. I have far more patience and confidence in my daily walk.

So....all mortals face the same issues....it is our responses to issues, circumstances, situations, and relationships that lead to a more productive and peaceful life. Fear not!

All is well in Father's Kingdom...if one is truly within that reality!

:wink: :biggrin: :idea: 8)


Last edited by fanofVan on Fri Oct 28, 2016 2:03 pm +0000, edited 1 time in total.

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fanofVan wrote:
nod....hope you will excuse my confusion.

You said: "The more you know what the Urantia Book says, the harder the goal becomes what it doesn't say."

Then said: "Knowing what the Urantia Book says should encourage the discovery of what it doesn't say. That's the goal that gets harder to reach when what it says is ignored."

Hate to quibble....but this has not been my experience at all. For me, it has become easier and easier to experience life by the light and map of the UB and to adjust my motives, intentions, priorities, and choices by its study and implementation in the daily walk of life. The goal does not become harder....but easier. That goal does not get "harder to reach"....but then, I, for one, am not and have not "ignored" what it teaches.

I'm glad you pointed this out Brad. Yes, I meant easier. I intended to clear it up by saying "Knowing what the Urantia Book says should encourage the discovery of what it doesn't say."

I need to admit that I've been engaging in using shock tactics to a degree (please forgive me), which I won't do anymore. I was raised by a man who spoke in opposite terms to me all the time, and it's one of those things that embedded deep in me that I struggle not to express like a programmed robot. He repeatedly told me that there isn't a God but I know now that what he was really saying was not to look to him for the answers, which led me to discover that God does exist, and comfortingly nearby, within, my Father in heaven. I often look back on the things I post and realize that this rather automatic part of my personality is way behind the curve, it kind of runs in the family. To me it's clear evidence that not only will I never fuse in the mortal life, I may never survive at all.

So I'm determined for a reset here. The Urantia Book is the greatest place to learn many of the things I needed to know in order to begin to grow spiritually. The rest will be determined by my faith and willingness to follow my inner guide to cooperate with the Father, and resist the sometimes overwhelming urge to contend with my brothers.

Your recent reply to me yesterday has opened my eyes much, and I'm relieved. SEla_Kelly's latest topic he posted a couple of days ago also made me realize more of what I needed to know.

I hope that helps to clear things up.


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nodAmanaV wrote:
fanofVan wrote:
nod....hope you will excuse my confusion.

You said: "The more you know what the Urantia Book says, the harder the goal becomes what it doesn't say."

Then said: "Knowing what the Urantia Book says should encourage the discovery of what it doesn't say. That's the goal that gets harder to reach when what it says is ignored."

Hate to quibble....but this has not been my experience at all. For me, it has become easier and easier to experience life by the light and map of the UB and to adjust my motives, intentions, priorities, and choices by its study and implementation in the daily walk of life. The goal does not become harder....but easier. That goal does not get "harder to reach"....but then, I, for one, am not and have not "ignored" what it teaches.

I'm glad you pointed this out Brad. Yes, I meant easier. I intended to clear it up by saying "Knowing what the Urantia Book says should encourage the discovery of what it doesn't say."

I need to admit that I've been engaging in using shock tactics to a degree (please forgive me), which I won't do anymore. I was raised by a man who spoke in opposite terms to me all the time, and it's one of those things that embedded deep in me that I struggle not to express like a programmed robot. He repeatedly told me that there isn't a God but I know now that what he was really saying was not to look to him for the answers, which led me to discover that God does exist, and comfortingly nearby, within, my Father in heaven. I often look back on the things I post and realize that this rather automatic part of my personality is way behind the curve, it kind of runs in the family. To me it's clear evidence that not only will I never fuse in the mortal life, I may never survive at all.

So I'm determined for a reset here. The Urantia Book is the greatest place to learn many of the things I needed to know in order to begin to grow spiritually. The rest will be determined by my faith and willingness to follow my inner guide to cooperate with the Father, and resist the sometimes overwhelming urge to contend with my brothers.

Your recent reply to me yesterday has opened my eyes much, and I'm relieved. SEla_Kelly's latest topic he posted a couple of days ago also made me realize more of what I needed to know.

I hope that helps to clear things up.


nod - I appreciate the admission and candor....explains much over these past 18 months. I welcome your "reset" and anticipate a more focused discussion on the UB teachings and our personal religious experience related thereto.

Based on my prior discussions, arguments, disagreements, and debates, I would suggest it is far too late for you "to begin to grow spiritually" - meaning only that I am certain such growth has already occurred in multiple aspects of your heart, mind, and soul. Don't be too hard on yourself. I hold no grudge nor harbor any ill will....and frankly, such discourse as we have had has enriched me due to all the research and thought I have had to muster to attempt to deliver contrast and allow the Papers to speak for themselves on so many issues!! It is by such questioning and such confusion that the student learns and the student teaches! No worries Brother.....I am quite confident of your soul's survival and the fullness of your potential.

It is not my place to advise you, however I am reminded of some text I have always found a comfort to me in times of self doubt and confusion and conflict (after all, did not every single Apostle who walked with the Master suffer from all three?):

100:4.1 (1097.5) Religious living is devoted living, and devoted living is creative living, original and spontaneous. New religious insights arise out of conflicts which initiate the choosing of new and better reaction habits in the place of older and inferior reaction patterns. New meanings only emerge amid conflict; and conflict persists only in the face of refusal to espouse the higher values connoted in superior meanings.

100:4.2 (1097.6) Religious perplexities are inevitable; there can be no growth without psychic conflict and spiritual agitation. The organization of a philosophic standard of living entails considerable commotion in the philosophic realms of the mind. Loyalties are not exercised in behalf of the great, the good, the true, and the noble without a struggle. Effort is attendant upon clarification of spiritual vision and enhancement of cosmic insight. And the human intellect protests against being weaned from subsisting upon the nonspiritual energies of temporal existence. The slothful animal mind rebels at the effort required to wrestle with cosmic problem solving.

100:5.2 (1098.5) The progression of religious growth leads from stagnation through conflict to co-ordination, from insecurity to undoubting faith, from confusion of cosmic consciousness to unification of personality, from the temporal objective to the eternal, from the bondage of fear to the liberty of divine sonship.

155:5.11 (1729.6) The religion of the spirit means effort, struggle, conflict, faith, determination, love, loyalty, and progress. The religion of the mind — the theology of authority — requires little or none of these exertions from its formal believers. Tradition is a safe refuge and an easy path for those fearful and halfhearted souls who instinctively shun the spirit struggles and mental uncertainties associated with those faith voyages of daring adventure out upon the high seas of unexplored truth in search for the farther shores of spiritual realities as they may be discovered by the progressive human mind and experienced by the evolving human soul.

110:3.5 (1206.3) Confusion, being puzzled, even sometimes discouraged and distracted, does not necessarily signify resistance to the leadings of the indwelling Adjuster. Such attitudes may sometimes connote lack of active co-operation with the divine Monitor and may, therefore, somewhat delay spiritual progress, but such intellectual emotional difficulties do not in the least interfere with the certain survival of the God-knowing soul. Ignorance alone can never prevent survival; neither can confusional doubts nor fearful uncertainty. Only conscious resistance to the Adjuster’s leading can prevent the survival of the evolving immortal soul.

34:7.8 (383.2) Having started out on the way of life everlasting, having accepted the assignment and received your orders to advance, do not fear the dangers of human forgetfulness and mortal inconstancy, do not be troubled with doubts of failure or by perplexing confusion, do not falter and question your status and standing, for in every dark hour, at every crossroad in the forward struggle, the Spirit of Truth will always speak, saying, “This is the way.”


Me here: you sound agitated, conflicted, confused, doubtful, and uncertain - hmmmm....sounds like you are most guilty indeed - of being human!! As the book says, none of this precludes the tadpole's survival from the pond of our birth!!

:wink: :biggrin: 8)


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A week ago on Monday, Oct. 24, SEla_Kelly posted: "Fanofvan makes pains to state that Jesus was a calculating person, but remember that most of the miracles he instigated were brought about via his unconscious (his love and will for the folks of Urantia)."

A very astute observation and I think topical to our discussion here!! Yes, I did propose that Jesus was not oblivious to the probabilities of ultimate outcomes and the intentions of his self proclaimed enemies and that he was calculating in his public ministry and strategic in his end-game before and after Transfiguration.

But I certainly agree that Jesus was also often surprised in life. Indeed, I think nearly half of the so-called miracles he performed were unintentional on his part....his human/creator compassion ("love and will") wished/willed compassionate "relief" for those victims of suffering and as this wish/will was not contrary to Father's will...his wish/will was immediately granted. A study of the miracles is a fascinating one.

Here's a link to the Foundation website's "Study" of the parables - 25 of them in chronological order:

http://www.urantia.org/jesus/part-ii-miracles#PART_II

I use the phrase "so-called" above to indicate my personal belief that everything in God's kingdom is miraculous but nothing and nobody supercedes the laws of the universe - performs miracles. The authors of the Papers describe much as miraculous to them as well - that which is not understood or explainable by the witness/participants in the "event" is a "miracle" to them (including mortal fusion with TA, the incarnation of a Creator Son, trinitization, and more).

Regarding his "death", the miracles suggest, again, that Jesus was a victim but not a hapless or helpless victim but, rather, the creator and ruler of a universe!!

Thanks SEla!

8)


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