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One thing I have wrestled with in contemplating the afterlife is what will happen to atheists who sincerely can not find a way to believe in God and essentially reject Him. They are searching for the truth as well and having been an atheist for many years myself I find myself feeling that they are almost justified in in their unbelief in some ways given the superstitious state of modern religion. Why shouldn't everyone get a chance to be revived and be taught about the ascension scheme before they make the decision to accept or reject it? It doesn't seem fair to me that given our current world climate and confusion how can anyone really fully be considered to have rejected God beyond all hope or rehabilitation without having visited the mansion worlds and being shown the better way or love? If that same exact personality who did not survive Urantia was raised on normal planet they would most likely survive right? So how is it fair for them to not be given that opportunity for survival? It seems like if you have the misfortune of being born on a rebellion planet the odds of your soul surviving get worse while if you are raised on a normal sphere they get significantly better. If the non-survivors knew that surviving death or a community of love existed I'm sure many of the people who rejected the idea of God here would reconsider. The revelators also say "if you survive" a few times causing me to wonder how many people actually do survive statistically?

Does anyone else wonder about this or have any insights into this?


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"if you survive"; it is an interesting point the real question is how life experience prepares souls for life after the resurrection. It is less of an issue of theology or intellect and more about how the individual takes in resources and socialises, her interaction with the universe.

I do not think it is fair to suggest that atheist or spiritual believer in Deity are on equal footing. Yes you do point out valid that the religious truth in preachment has been distorted and abused, but would this be fair to suggest that a person did not receive enough spiritual experiences or revelations that would affirm the existence of spiritual usherance towards perfection.

You are really saying there is not enough ministry sometimes, human or divine, and if it is true for a rare few I would hope they have small dispensations that allows them to taste the fruits of the afterlife. But what it really comes down to is the perfection hungers of each soul, which God is fully aware and abiding/encouraging.

You are right we must protect the name of God and uphold fellowships for the benefit of maturation of the individual. The opportunity to survive is proferred to all willing souls, which is why any potential disappointment that would lead to despondence goes against faith.

Questioning whether one identifies as atheist, yet does that person still have faith? I think it is possible given that such identification pertains to the intellect, whereas I think faith pertains to the perfection hunger.

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to the Underlaying Unity of All Life so that the Voice of Intuition may guide Us closer to Our Common Keeper


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112:5.8 The governments of Orvonton and Nebadon do not claim absolute perfection for the detail working of the universal plan of mortal repersonalization, but they do claim to, and actually do, manifest patience, tolerance, understanding, and merciful sympathy. We had rather assume the risk of a system rebellion than to court the hazard of depriving one struggling mortal from any evolutionary world of the eternal joy of pursuing the ascending career.

112:5.9 This does not mean that human beings are to enjoy a second opportunity in the face of the rejection of a first, not at all. But it does signify that all will creatures are to experience one true opportunity to make one undoubted, self-conscious, and final choice. The sovereign Judges of the universes will not deprive any being of personality status who has not finally and fully made the eternal choice; the soul of man must and will be given full and ample opportunity to reveal its true intent and real purpose.


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Greetings,

When it comes to the issue of atheism, I believe it important to distinguish whether or not the individual has rejected the idea of God as portrayed in the various organized religions, or has the individual rejected an actual personal relationship with his or her spiritual Father. If a person has had a spiritual relationship, has experienced the birth of a soul, then that person will survive regardless of his or her ideas about God. Sincere doubts only slow growth, they do not prevent it.

I think that many who reject the idea of God as presented by organized religions do not completely reject the experience with God, which would be the embrace of truth, beauty and goodness. A desire for truth is enough. I also think that anyone who desires to live, regardless of whether or not they can bring themselves to believe in an afterlife, will get the opportunity to live. The desire for self-survival is sufficient. I think that is part of the flicker of faith phenomenon. Those who want to go on will get every opportunity to do so.

Also, I think it is a blunder to blame the rebellion and default as the reason why people have difficulty believing in God or choosing survival. The rebellion and default hampered the spiritual growth of the entire planet, but they do not affect the inner life of the individual. The rebellion has become a scapegoat for weak souls. If anything, the rebellion has improved our inner spiritual radar. With the absence of external divine leadership, the impulse is greater to search for internal divine leadership in order to make up for the loss.

One error of human thinking respecting these problems consists in the idea that all evolutionary mortals on an evolving planet would choose to enter upon the Paradise career if sin had not cursed their world. The ability to decline survival does not date from the times of the Lucifer rebellion. Mortal man has always possessed the endowment of freewill choice regarding the Paradise career. 54:6:9

Caligastia rebelled, Adam and Eve did default, but no mortal subsequently born on Urantia has suffered in his personal spiritual experience because of these blunders. Every mortal born on Urantia since Caligastia's rebellion has been in some manner time-penalized, but the future welfare of such souls has never been in the least eternity-jeopardized. No person is ever made to suffer vital spiritual deprivation because of the sin of another. Sin is wholly personal as to moral guilt or spiritual consequences, notwithstanding its far-flung repercussions in administrative, intellectual, and social domains. 67:7:7

The mistakes of mortal mind and the errors of human conduct may markedly delay the evolution of the soul, although they cannot inhibit such a morontia phenomenon when once it has been initiated by the indwelling Adjuster with the consent of the creature will. But at any time prior to mortal death this same material and human will is empowered to rescind such a choice and to reject survival. 111:3:1

In so far as man's evolving morontia soul becomes permeated by truth, beauty, and goodness as the value-realization of God-consciousness, such a resultant being becomes indestructible. If there is no survival of eternal values in the evolving soul of man, then mortal existence is without meaning, and life itself is a tragic illusion. But it is forever true: What you begin in time you will assuredly finish in eternity — if it is worth finishing. 111:3:7

Respectfully,
Rexford


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(166:3.3) "You also have another saying among you, and one that contains much truth: That the way which leads to eternal life is straight and narrow, that the door which leads thereto is likewise narrow so that, of those who seek salvation, few can find entrance through this door. You also have a teaching that the way which leads to destruction is broad, that the entrance thereto is wide, and that there are many who choose to go this way. And this proverb is not without its meaning. But I declare that salvation is first a matter of your personal choosing. Even if the door to the way of life is narrow, it is wide enough to admit all who sincerely seek to enter, for I am that door. And the Son will never refuse entrance to any child of the universe who, by faith, seeks to find the Father through the Son.


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I feel like I have more clarity now, thank you all for your insights and for sharing relevant passages. Yes, I agree that atheists can perhaps find God in their hearts while rejecting Him intellectually. I haven't read the UB all the way through in a few of years now so it is nice to be reminded that every opportunity to survive will be given to every soul regardless of intellectual understanding or beliefs. I remember now that this is one of the greatest attractors for me regarding the UB as I find that so many religions demand that intellectual belief in a certain dogma or set of religious rules are what assure survival and I could just never buy into that. I've always felt that finding God in the spirit was far more important that getting all the facts right. I think this is also why people are so attracted to certain adaptable forms of Buddhism.


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Greetings,

The problem with some forms of Buddhism is that they do not address the personality of God. Searching for the spirit of God can result in finding just about anything divine; but, searching for the personality of God gives you an actual Divine Being that can be known. Personalities really need to have relationships with other personalities, both human and divine. A relationship with a non-personal spirit does not fully satisfy the needs of a personality and cannot hold the interest of the soul for long.

In Paper 94, Section 12:4-7 explains that Buddhism is currently going through a renaissance and offers some new hope to the East.

Respectfully,
Rexford


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trizzat and any who are interested: you will find there have been many discussions here about who survives and who does not. You may wish to use the "Search" button in the top right corner for:

atheism; atheist; atheists; survive; survivor; survivorship - there are over 25 pages of conversation links to such discussions.

I am enjoying this one too! I don't equate the reasonable rejection of evolutionary religions and their falsehoods and hypocritical practices as any form of God-rejection. As has been said, is their an appreciation of and pursuit of truth, beauty, and goodness? Is there love of others in the person? From whence comes these? The Spirit response is the deliverer of all such things and the belief in those is a form of belief in God, the source of all of those, no?

It is hard to tell or say who embraces the spirit in ways which build soul while rejecting the priesthood and church.

Thanks to all!

Bradly 8)


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The problem with some forms of Buddhism is that they do not address the personality of God. Searching for the spirit of God can result in finding just about anything divine; but, searching for the personality of God gives you an actual Divine Being that can be known. Personalities really need to have relationships with other personalities, both human and divine. A relationship with a non-personal spirit does not fully satisfy the needs of a personality and cannot hold the interest of the soul for long.


I think what often happens in the sects of Buddhism that I am most familiar with is that the personality of God is conflated with the personality of the Buddha archetype. Becoming 'more like Buddha' is a goal for many and I find this analogous to becoming God-like in the UB. I think the failure of Buddhism (besides denying it's followers a personal relationship with God the Father) is to fail to recognize the source of such divine attributes, but I also think that this is done by design.


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Greetings trizzat,

It seems that the search for one's inner Buddha is a worthwhile effort:

This philosophy also held that the Buddha (divine) nature resided in all men; that man, through his own endeavors, could attain to the realization of this inner divinity. And this teaching is one of the clearest presentations of the truth of the indwelling Adjusters ever to be made by a Urantian religion. 94:11:5

Respectfully,
Rexford


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That's right Rex, but let's not forget what Jesus said to Ganid:

(132:7.4) "Your Buddha was much better than your Buddhism. Buddha was a great man, even a prophet to his people, but he was an orphan prophet; by that I mean that he early lost sight of his spiritual Father, the Father in heaven. His experience was tragic. He tried to live and teach as a messenger of God, but without God. Buddha guided his ship of salvation right up to the safe harbor, right up to the entrance to the haven of mortal salvation, and there, because of faulty charts of navigation, the good ship ran aground. There it has rested these many generations, motionless and almost hopelessly stranded. And thereon have many of your people remained all these years. They live within hailing distance of the safe waters of rest, but they refuse to enter because the noble craft of the good Buddha met the misfortune of grounding just outside the harbor. And the Buddhist peoples never will enter this harbor unless they abandon the philosophic craft of their prophet and seize upon his noble spirit. Had your people remained true to the spirit of Buddha, you would have long since entered your haven of spirit tranquillity, soul rest, and assurance of salvation.


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trizzat wrote:
I also think that this is done by design.

A most interesting comment.

Isn't traditional organized religion the stage where the "devil" performs his most nefarious acts?


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This is what makes the mysterious appearance of the Urantia Book so telling. I look around and see that there are many ancient lies (as well as many new ones) being exposed.

(150:4.2) "I declare to you that there is nothing covered up that is not going to be revealed; there is nothing hidden that shall not be known."


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nodAmanaV wrote:
trizzat wrote:
I also think that this is done by design.

A most interesting comment.

Isn't traditional organized religion the stage where the "devil" performs his most nefarious acts?


I'm not really familiar with philosophies dealing with the "devil" beyond the common tropes so I'm not really sure. What I was referring to is that a common traditional Buddhist stance is to essentially concern themselves with only what is knowable and consider it impossible to really know if God exists or not and therefore they do not necessarily reject God conceptually, but instead avoid addressing the concept all together in order to focus more on the humanistic and cultivation of inner divinity. In a way it is like gathering fruits and not being concerned what tree they came from.

Interestingly I find this to be a double edged sword. On the one hand many people are attracted to the idea of spirituality without the a need to concern themselves with potentially 'mythological' figures and these people would otherwise not be involved in spiritual practices, but on the other hand it denies them the personal relationship with divinity aspect that monotheism affords. Interestingly I have noticed that many New Age versions of Buddhism are popping up that have incorporated all sort of celestial entities which people claim to have relationships with, not unlike those in the UB community who believe in the channeling movement. Perhaps a lot of new Buddhists would get a lot out of reading the UB.


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