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A forum for thought provoking questions & answers of a spiritual nature or as pertaining to the Urantia Papers.
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TA and spiritual advancment

Thu Dec 11, 2014 1:47 pm +0000

If a human is severely mentally retarded, he or she is still loved and cared for but what of spiritual progression. Would a persons mental function affect progression? I know, and have worked with many challenged children and I would not believe a benevolent god would forsake such a person. Does anyone have any insight?

Re: TA and spiritual advancment

Fri Dec 12, 2014 3:51 am +0000

Hi bowlingusmc,

I'm thinking that there are very likely many different conditions of mental challenges. It seems very possible that many children who lack the ability to read or write, for example, still have a mind that responds to affection or care, humor, sense of fun and adventure, and that can allow them to grow in important ways. And may function with adjuster or angelic ministry.

So the bottom line might be that we will not be able to judge whether a challenged person has a soul or not. With the caveat that behavior with strong anti-social or destructive tendencies might indicate the absence of moral functioning.

Re: TA and spiritual advancment

Fri Dec 12, 2014 8:10 am +0000

Life on earth is not fair; we're not all equal. That's what the mansion worlds are for... to correct the deficiencies of the physical life.
You might want read here about them...
http://truthbook.com/urantia-book/paper ... ion-worlds

Best wishes,

Re: TA and spiritual advancment

Fri Dec 12, 2014 8:30 am +0000

Hi Bowlingusmc,

I agree with Ricktare.
Riktare wrote:So the bottom line might be that we will not be able to judge whether a challenged person has a soul or not. With the caveat that behavior with strong anti-social or destructive tendencies might indicate the absence of moral functioning.

Bottom line is the question; is that personality capable of God-knowingness. And God only knows.

Regards, Louis

Re: TA and spiritual advancment

Fri Dec 12, 2014 8:42 am +0000

Good question posed and a puzzler indeed. My opinion is that the UB does not provide great specificity on the issue but I find reason to believe that any person who is "love responsive" and gives love to others is, by definition, spirit connected and is contributing to soul and spirit progress in fact and function. Normal minded folk who are not love responsive (and there are plenty of those) are not, by definition, progressing in spirit. There has been much debate and discussion here many times on who survives and does not and I cannot say I understand nor is it important for me to understand the survival requirements for others.

A related issue for possible discussion here is this: are some angels "smarter" than others? Will sleeping survivors awaken with the same level of intelligence as all others or will there be some differentiation still in mind "capacity"? Intelligence, as we measure it, is a function of the material, electro/chemical brain (not mind). Mind touches upon the brain but it is not the brain we are taught. Did the Alpheus Twins awaken still lower in intelligence than Peter and John, etc.? Or does resurrection in morontia form and with morontia mind equalize all?

We awaken as we departed related to spirit and experience. What about intelligence?


Re: TA and spiritual advancment

Fri Dec 12, 2014 1:42 pm +0000

IMO Faith IS The Key

And Our Fathers Mercy...

Regardless ...

Father WILL Welcome ALL !

Even those that Do Not yet know him yet ...

Re: TA and spiritual advancment

Mon Apr 06, 2015 8:00 am +0000

Yes. Charlie Porter is a man who raised a big family in Endwell New York. He had a mentally retarded son and raised him as well as he could. When Charlie Porter died at aged >90 years, the boy was passed onto the Highest Son of the Clan, a man who looked out after the disabled brother.

There is a remedial custody of Pre-Adjustered Souls, and those mentally disabled people may be categorised in the "innocent ones" who remain on Jerusem and are "brought along" by the dominant parent from Urantia. This custody is like having a pet, except usually regarded as a sacred obligation rather than "work on the farm".

If you were a parent who "raises a child who never grows up", you are burdened with a two-fold sympathy, the pity towards your child who is defective intellectually and therefore has no Adjuster, and the hope that your other children can eventually attain much more than you have. There is a general symptoms of parents who raise retarded children, that their good hopes are projected into the hopes for humanity, so that others may do what his own child cannot.

Re: TA and spiritual advancment

Mon Apr 06, 2015 4:11 pm +0000

This issue is very close to me. My oldest sister, my senior by one day less than three years, was severely mentally ill. Unlike many who have mental illness she presented symptoms almost at birth. My mother noticed problems with her by 2 years old, long before she could have had a thought adjuster. The psychiatric community called her Bi-Polar, Schizophrenic and Autistic all at the same time. I don't believe they really knew. I think what she had was a brain dysfunction or deformation that was what we might call a short circuit. Her deformity was that she had no ability to perform intellectual reasoning. She literally could not put two and two together. She had an amazing memory and could memorize others actions to appear as if she was semi-normal and by doing so she could mimic her way through life to some extent. She could tell what food she liked and what clothes she wanted to wear and if she wanted to go somewhere she could even drive a car, but she could not explain "why" anything. By the way she could only drive her car where she had been taken before. She could not figure out how to go somewhere she had never been. She had drives, urges and like Rodan of Alexander says, she could respond to the urges of life but she could not even imitate the "are of living" as only a human can do.

My parents tried to believe she was going to pop out of it and always treated her as "normal" but didn't seek any help for her. Of course she grew up in the 50s and 60s and there was not much help available. Because of her amazing memory she learned 5 languages and after trying for 10 years straight and with the distinct assistance of some very sympathetic teachers, she managed to earn a college degree in languages. But once she got out of school she found she could not perform the work of a job, any job. She couldn't do the basics of reason because nothing actually meant anything to her. She simply could not draw a conclusion about anything she had not memorized in advance. From that time on she seemed to lose interest in living as there was nobody who could tell her what to memorize so she could imitate life. So she quit trying to do what she could not. She was hospitalized 5 separate times and lived with our parents when not confined. She died at 59 from liver failure 6 years after overdosing on her prescription medications without knowing it. I was her caregiver for those last 6 years. Being with her was like having a pet, a very smart pet. She never seemed to lament her situation and was always rather pleasant, as long as she got what she wanted to eat and wear.

Brad mentions the ability to love in return. I am unable to state that she could do that. So I will be interested to see just what her condition earns her on Mansonia number 1. If she will pick up right where she left off she will not have much to work with. But I have hope. I loved her as I could but I never actually got to know her, it just seemed that there was nobody there to know.

This is not in any way an attempt to disparage her. She just happened to get bumped to the end of the line, the very end. What it does is make me examine the love of God in a way I don't think about often. She had no ability to choose to love God or to choose not to. I know he loves her. But after living as her brother for 59 years I never knew her love. It makes me very sensitive to our human tendency to be sentimental about these things. I don't believe we should waste much time on such things.

Last edited by Jim George on Mon Apr 06, 2015 8:58 pm +0000, edited 1 time in total.

Re: TA and spiritual advancment

Mon Apr 06, 2015 8:38 pm +0000

Jim George,

Wow. Thank you for sharing that. Your story left a very profound impression on me.

I too have family members that prompt me to share these concerns.

Every time I think about it, I eventually hear two loud voices from the depths of my soul:

(a) I simply do not have the intellectual capacity or experiential achievement to understand this issue, and I cannot draw any conclusions on how any of this will play out.

(b) Our God is mercy-dominated.

Things will balance out.

- quil
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