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Joined: Tue Dec 26, 2006 9:44 am +0000
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p381:4 34:6.10 The purpose of all this ministration is, "That you may be strengthened with power through his spirit in the inner man." And all this represents but the preliminary steps to the final attainment of the perfection of faith and service, that experience wherein you shall be "filled with all the fullness of God," "for all those who are led by the spirit of God are the sons of God."


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 Post subject: Re: Subjective/Objective
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Joined: Wed Aug 05, 2009 7:47 pm +0000
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Dear Amy,

I am of another race from you, a Bidayuh ethnic from a far away Sarawak, Malaysia. My empathy with you, that is, if i read your postings right. The rest of the forumers had gave excellent gleams about love. i couldn't ask for more.

Do not force yourself to love if you do not have one or even to understand it if you don't; becos it doesn't matter, anywhere. (at least with your present state of preception). Love could only be undserstood by those who had experience/recieving it or by those who have given of it.

It is useless or futile to love when we refuse to believe of its existence and the working of its;it is absurd for a person go to a doctor and ask that the pain of a broken arm be removed before the bone is set? This would be ridiculous because the pain is the result of the break. Cure and heal the break and thus the pain. a bitter tree can only become sweet by being grafted onto a sweet tree. Never ever force yourself to think and to understand but take you time and at your own pace and phase. I am well aware that it is easier said then done and no amount of sayings could convince or relieve you if you chose not to convinced or relieved.

The very fact you questioned and seek for answers is the very answers; and its beginning, for the difficult life lessons that you faced. As far as God /divine love is concerned; seek not to understand so that you may believe, but believe so that you may understand (quote: Augustine of Hippo).

You are right when saying that there is no reality in this mortal; but reality only exist in the spiritual life; the minds and the world of God later on. Nano science seek to understand the smallest of particles but yet we have not understand that our very own physical body also is pervaded by spaces and nano particles of the same cosmic origin; therefore there is no reality per se but only the spirits is real. How could you love when you have not experience love or maybe refuse to believe.
Even if we assume for the sake of argument that there is no love, we would further the cause of ignorance, not the truth of it, especially to those who have not experient of it.
God and love has no need or desire for anyone to prove or to believe. Our arguments and perspective are feeble, our minds limited. God desires rathjer that we should enjoy this life and his life-giving presence and so bear witness to something far more sublime and convincing than anything the rational mind can produce.
You are not an odd, i do not mean to sound being nice here; but yes, really you are not odd but simply just having a different route; a difficult one that is, compared to me.

What i am ver, very sure is that there is love is this life and there is life in this thing call love. I can say this because i have experience it, and right now still... in my wife, my three beautiful chlildren, my siblings, relatives and friends. I enjoy my trip back to my village every weekend and the surrounding trees and the sunset. It may not be perfect all the time given the choice, i choose and tried my best all the time to experient this thing call love and to give love whenver and whoever i can. The result is i recieve back love.

Do not be afraid to love or to recieve love, Amy. In all honesty and even thought i am very far away from you, I GAVE YOU MY LOVE AS A FELLOW HUMAN BEING, AND PLIZ, RECEIVE IT.


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 Post subject: Re: Subjective/Objective
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Joined: Thu Feb 11, 2010 2:44 am +0000
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Very often "objective" is treated as a vital goal while "subjective" is used as a criticism. Objective judgements are good; subjective judgments are arbitrary.
Objective standards are good; subjective standards are corrupt. Reality isn't so clean and neat: there are areas where objectivity is preferable, but other areas where subjectivity is better.
The distinction between objective and subjective normally refers to judgements and claims which people make.
Objective judgements and claims are assumed to be free from personal considerations, emotional perspectives, etc. Subjective judgements and claims, however, are assumed to be heavily influenced by such personal considerations.

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Joined: Sun Mar 13, 2011 4:35 am +0000
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16:9.7 Unselfishness, aside from parental instinct, is not altogether natural; other persons are not naturally loved or socially served. It requires the enlightenment of reason, morality, and the urge of religion, God-knowingness, to generate an unselfish and altruistic social order. Man’s own personality awareness, self-consciousness, is also directly dependent on this very fact of innate other-awareness, this innate ability to recognize and grasp the reality of other personality, ranging from the human to the divine.

technical stuff, just luv baby. tub uses words and ideas to try to explain things which may or may not get through to me, who's to know exactly what the author is trying to say all the time. all we can do is get an overall flavor in the overall sense of all of tub as to what is right and wrong. objectively speaking i shouldn't be so subjective in my opinions unless my subjective objectiveness is correct. :smile:

Amy wrote:
As is my habit I was listening to my UB CD before retiring, and in Paper 16 I heard this:

[16:9.8] Unselfish social consciousness must be, at bottom, a religious consciousness; that is, if it is
objective; otherwise it is a purely subjective philosophic abstraction and therefore devoid of love. Only a
God-knowing individual can love another person as he loves himself.


Well gosh! I was taught that being objective is a really hard thing to do, and that we are all pretty much hopelessly subjective... so how do you know if you are being objective when it could just be your own subjective opinion that you are objective, and nothing more?

It's late and I'm tired, so I'm going to think about this in the morning....

a.


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