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An open forum for general discussions of a spiritual nature where guests and readers entertain the teachings of The Urantia Book.
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Re: Angels do not invade the sanctity of the human mind?

Fri Jun 14, 2019 2:05 pm +0000

Agon D. Onter wrote:
The Caligastia's staff of 100 were superhuman. They were not ordinary mortals like you and I.


They were ascendant candidates like any mortal who passes death and moves onto the mansion world.

Also, their TA was not detached because of being subnormal or having done anything wrong.


I never said that. I said TA can be detached when unfused. I used that reference to show in any unfused state the TA can be detached. So if a normal mind regresses to a subnormality, TA can detach from it.

Re: Angels do not invade the sanctity of the human mind?

Fri Jun 14, 2019 2:07 pm +0000

From a UB quote that describes SUPERHUMAN beings whose TA detached at the time they volunteered for service; you infer that it also means that a subnormal minded human's TA can detach after the human rapes somebody?

Re: Angels do not invade the sanctity of the human mind?

Fri Jun 14, 2019 2:09 pm +0000

Agon D. Onter wrote:From a UB quote that describes SUPERHUMAN beings whose TA detached at the time they volunteered for service; you infer that it also means that a subnormal minded human's TA can detach after the human rapes somebody?


Again, if TA is unfused, it can detach. I can't phrase it any other way.

Re: Angels do not invade the sanctity of the human mind?

Fri Jun 14, 2019 2:21 pm +0000

Appealing to a Judge, versus repentence unto "the Lord of our fathers." I believe that what Jesus says, reveals to each human individual, the personal need to reconcile with the first source and center, Jesus' manner reflects wisdom, in that man can find God in his own heart, but John's is more of an evolutionary approach, that in order to gain salvation, you should try to settle your account with God before you pass on. John led an entire generation of spiritual believers to Jesus, and told Jesus that he had need to be baptised by him, which is more or less a version of repentence or confession. You know in your own heart the truth, but probably every reasonable personal treatise is negotiable in order to become closer to fusion with the first source and center.

Re: Angels do not invade the sanctity of the human mind?

Fri Jun 14, 2019 2:26 pm +0000

brooklyn_born wrote:
Agon D. Onter wrote:
The Caligastia's staff of 100 were superhuman. They were not ordinary mortals like you and I.


They were ascendant candidates like any mortal who passes death and moves onto the mansion world.

Also, their TA was not detached because of being subnormal or having done anything wrong.


I never said that. I said TA can be detached when unfused. I used that reference to show in any unfused state the TA can be detached. So if a normal mind regresses to a subnormality, TA can detach from it.


And social crimes determine this? And Catholic mores?

Re: Angels do not invade the sanctity of the human mind?

Fri Jun 14, 2019 2:29 pm +0000

I started a new thread on this topic. We have beaten this one to a pulp. We are not even addressing the original topic.

fanofVan wrote:
brooklyn_born wrote:
Agon D. Onter wrote:
The Caligastia's staff of 100 were superhuman. They were not ordinary mortals like you and I.


They were ascendant candidates like any mortal who passes death and moves onto the mansion world.

Also, their TA was not detached because of being subnormal or having done anything wrong.


I never said that. I said TA can be detached when unfused. I used that reference to show in any unfused state the TA can be detached. So if a normal mind regresses to a subnormality, TA can detach from it.


And social crimes determine this? And Catholic mores?

Re: Angels do not invade the sanctity of the human mind?

Fri Jun 14, 2019 2:33 pm +0000

This entire topic is a rather bizarre echo of this one from last year...a perennial claim? Soul Possession - a locked topic.

viewtopic.php?f=1&t=5491

The soul without an adjuster...the saga continues....
Last edited by fanofVan on Fri Jun 14, 2019 3:00 pm +0000, edited 1 time in total.

Re: Angels do not invade the sanctity of the human mind?

Fri Jun 14, 2019 2:35 pm +0000

brooklyn_born wrote:
Agon D. Onter wrote:From a UB quote that describes SUPERHUMAN beings whose TA detached at the time they volunteered for service; you infer that it also means that a subnormal minded human's TA can detach after the human rapes somebody?


Again, if TA is unfused, it can detach. I can't phrase it any other way.


Well....you could provide any supporting text for your claims...if only there were some.

Re: Angels do not invade the sanctity of the human mind?

Fri Jun 14, 2019 2:37 pm +0000

fanofVan wrote:
brooklyn_born wrote:
Agon D. Onter wrote:From a UB quote that describes SUPERHUMAN beings whose TA detached at the time they volunteered for service; you infer that it also means that a subnormal minded human's TA can detach after the human rapes somebody?


Again, if TA is unfused, it can detach. I can't phrase it any other way.


Well....you could provide any supporting text for your claims...if only there were some.



I did in a new thread you are participating in.

Re: Angels do not invade the sanctity of the human mind?

Fri Jun 14, 2019 2:50 pm +0000

fanofVan wrote:
brooklyn_born wrote:
Agon D. Onter wrote:From a UB quote that describes SUPERHUMAN beings whose TA detached at the time they volunteered for service; you infer that it also means that a subnormal minded human's TA can detach after the human rapes somebody?


Again, if TA is unfused, it can detach. I can't phrase it any other way.


Well....you could provide any supporting text for your claims...if only there were some.



BB says: "I did in a new thread you are participating in."

No you didn't but you did change your claim. Your original claim is that TA's can and do abandon people who commit Catholic crimes/sins but they can get a new TA once a year at Pentecost if they repent.
Last edited by fanofVan on Fri Jun 14, 2019 2:59 pm +0000, edited 1 time in total.

Re: Angels do not invade the sanctity of the human mind?

Fri Jun 14, 2019 2:54 pm +0000

I see where this is going and really am not interested. I have done this dance with you in the past. Peace, Bradly.



fanofVan wrote:No you didn't but you did change your claim. Your original claim is that TA's can and do abandon people who commit Catholic crimes/sins but they can get new once a year at Pentecost if they repent.

Re: Angels do not invade the sanctity of the human mind?

Fri Jun 14, 2019 2:56 pm +0000

Bradly is correct.

Re: Angels do not invade the sanctity of the human mind?

Fri Jun 14, 2019 3:02 pm +0000

BB,
This is me, saying it is possible for TA to detach/ soul death, while the human is alive.

Agon D. Onter wrote:
fanofVan wrote:How does someone lose their TA?


Bradly, My interpretation of this verse of UB is that it IS possible for a living human to be abandoned by their TA. What I DO NOT think is possible, is for that person to get their TA back, which is something BB has claimed on this thread. That is definitely not correct.

“1. Spiritual (soul) death. If and when mortal man has finally rejected survival, when he has been pronounced spiritually insolvent, morontially bankrupt, in the conjoint opinion of the Adjuster and the surviving seraphim, when such co–ordinate advice has been recorded on Uversa, and after the Censors and their reflective associates have verified these findings, thereupon do the rulers of Orvonton order the immediate release of the indwelling Monitor. But this release of the Adjuster in no way affects the duties of the personal or group seraphim concerned with that Adjuster–abandoned individual. This kind of death is final in its significance irrespective of the temporary continuation of the living energies of the physical and mind mechanisms. From the cosmic standpoint the mortal is already dead; the continuing life merely indicates the persistence of the material momentum of cosmic energies.

Re: Angels do not invade the sanctity of the human mind?

Fri Jun 14, 2019 3:05 pm +0000

I apologized to you in the other thread. It was Bradly not you who stated it.


Agon D. Onter wrote:BB,
This is me, saying it is possible for TA to detach/ soul death, while the human is alive.

Agon D. Onter wrote:
fanofVan wrote:How does someone lose their TA?


Bradly, My interpretation of this verse of UB is that it IS possible for a living human to be abandoned by their TA. What I DO NOT think is possible, is for that person to get their TA back, which is something BB has claimed on this thread. That is definitely not correct.

“1. Spiritual (soul) death. If and when mortal man has finally rejected survival, when he has been pronounced spiritually insolvent, morontially bankrupt, in the conjoint opinion of the Adjuster and the surviving seraphim, when such co–ordinate advice has been recorded on Uversa, and after the Censors and their reflective associates have verified these findings, thereupon do the rulers of Orvonton order the immediate release of the indwelling Monitor. But this release of the Adjuster in no way affects the duties of the personal or group seraphim concerned with that Adjuster–abandoned individual. This kind of death is final in its significance irrespective of the temporary continuation of the living energies of the physical and mind mechanisms. From the cosmic standpoint the mortal is already dead; the continuing life merely indicates the persistence of the material momentum of cosmic energies.

Re: Angels do not invade the sanctity of the human mind?

Fri Jun 14, 2019 3:58 pm +0000

This is a scary topic! There is a great difference between ascending mortals who are capable of being assigned to worlds such as Urantia, and Jesus, having permanently detached from his indwelling Thought Adjuster, before the wedding at Cana. I believe that such detachment is incomparable to soul-death, in that the Thought Adjuster maintains or withholds a permanent relationship to that individual. It meant their own actions they had true responsibility, already having been deemed capable of recognition wisdom. Having the divine rest, is the pursuit of a human mind that can allow God to move freely about the universe, to collect energies and powers of new possibilities, I do not see why a Thought Adjuster would abandon a soul.
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