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fanofVan wrote:
Stephen Sela asks above: "What about the simple functioning of the adjutant mind spirits, and the human choice actions in the universe, and any interference I may have caused in the adjutant mind spirits. Is there any way to know observatively or retrospectively to understand the shape that the universe has taken in lieu of my existences, and whatfor, or whymay has this shape occurred."

you are asking about concepts presented in the UB let us consider them in relation to their relevant presentations in the UB. (ok)

However, the universes have a built-in repercussion-limiter which works to protect reality and others from the repercussions of individual choice. The lower the order of being and the further outward in materiality one exists, the more limited is the range of repercussion. The mortal orders certainly cannot disrupt or effect the adjutant circuit or the circuits of physical/material gravity, spirit gravity, mind gravity, personality gravity or any of the ministering Spirits or the TA's (except our own relationship with our personal TA) or planetary. System, or Universe governance or management, etc.

Nor can our personal choices or repercussions prevent any other mortal from their own religious experience, connection to the Spirit, or opportunity for the eternal adventure.




a) "in lieu of": in return of this total: the adjutant mind spirits, "my own technicolor dreamcoat" that I give back to the Divine Minister at the end of my life.

you have many words, many "rumours of war", many "official policies", many conflicting definitions of loyalty, and when a caucus or political grouping begins to accept specific goals, specific definitions of what it means for a citizen to be loyal. there are two levels of superimposition: the symbols of the state and the ministry of the Divine Minister. Since there are two levels of sovereignty that of the State and that of the human individual, then you have to hold yourself accountable for the "MTV" that you let your children watch in your own home.

What about the actual interference, patterns which indicate trauma, traumatic experiences, within the audiences. "A Hitler" I do not know what that is? Do you mean like "an Adolphus Hitersonian", just as in the way you pretend to be "a Jesusonian". A leader cannot affect the mind ministry, but can impose such banners upon an entire nation, Mao Tse Dong convinced the confucians to make it so (as in China). National Media is accountable for the total publication, whether there is one succinct promulgation from a controlled state, or there is a nearly unlimited freedom to promote new ideas if they can gain currency (as in America). Do Parents allow Children to develop an anti-social attitude within the walls of their house, via unmonitored media consumption, and fail to recite the morals that their own fathers and mothers taught them? Let this prospect become observable for my own words actions, and published media, so that people can know even in the capitalist populist setting, wherein patterns from the leaders, have induced compulsions or trauma. And then all I can ask is from the stage of the world state to have mercy on the people who I have hurt, not to go forward with compulsory loyalty requirements for universal citizenship, and to see wherein maturational habits, which represent the essent of future state values, are naturally forged in other households.

Personally personally personally, you should broaden this consideration into what a man actually feels personally accountable for. Jesus started out writing very little in his own home, but he did recite much in the Chazan School. The very humble charcoal placcards he let his siblings use to write on, in his home school, were adopted in Technique by Pontius Pilate [187:1.2], when he would write the name of the convict, and the offense which Rome had deemed to be sufficient for execution.
126:3.4 on a piece of smooth cedar board about eighteen inches square, with a piece of charcoal he wrote out the prayer which became from that time on the standard family petition.

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SEla_Kelly wrote:
fanofVan wrote:
Stephen Sela asks above: "What about the simple functioning of the adjutant mind spirits, and the human choice actions in the universe, and any interference I may have caused in the adjutant mind spirits. Is there any way to know observatively or retrospectively to understand the shape that the universe has taken in lieu of my existences, and whatfor, or whymay has this shape occurred."

you are asking about concepts presented in the UB let us consider them in relation to their relevant presentations in the UB. (ok)

However, the universes have a built-in repercussion-limiter which works to protect reality and others from the repercussions of individual choice. The lower the order of being and the further outward in materiality one exists, the more limited is the range of repercussion. The mortal orders certainly cannot disrupt or effect the adjutant circuit or the circuits of physical/material gravity, spirit gravity, mind gravity, personality gravity or any of the ministering Spirits or the TA's (except our own relationship with our personal TA) or planetary. System, or Universe governance or management, etc.

Nor can our personal choices or repercussions prevent any other mortal from their own religious experience, connection to the Spirit, or opportunity for the eternal adventure.




a) "in lieu of": in return of this total: the adjutant mind spirits, "my own technicolor dreamcoat" that I give back to the Divine Minister at the end of my life.

you have many words, many "rumours of war", many "official policies", many conflicting definitions of loyalty, and when a caucus or political grouping begins to accept specific goals, specific definitions of what it means for a citizen to be loyal. there are two levels of superimposition: the symbols of the state and the ministry of the Divine Minister. Since there are two levels of sovereignty that of the State and that of the human individual, then you have to hold yourself accountable for the "MTV" that you let your children watch in your own home.

What about the actual interference, patterns which indicate trauma, traumatic experiences, within the audiences. "A Hitler" I do not know what that is? Do you mean like "an Adolphus Hitersonian", just as in the way you pretend to be "a Jesusonian". A leader cannot affect the mind ministry, but can impose such banners upon an entire nation, Mao Tse Dong convinced the confucians to make it so (as in China). National Media is accountable for the total publication, whether there is one succinct promulgation from a controlled state, or there is a nearly unlimited freedom to promote new ideas if they can gain currency (as in America). Do Parents allow Children to develop an anti-social attitude within the walls of their house, via unmonitored media consumption, and fail to recite the morals that their own fathers and mothers taught them? Let this prospect become observable for my own words actions, and published media, so that people can know even in the capitalist populist setting, wherein patterns from the leaders, have induced compulsions or trauma. And then all I can ask is from the stage of the world state to have mercy on the people who I have hurt, not to go forward with compulsory loyalty requirements for universal citizenship, and to see wherein maturational habits, which represent the essent of future state values, are naturally forged in other households.

Personally personally personally, you should broaden this consideration into what a man actually feels personally accountable for. Jesus started out writing very little in his own home, but he did recite much in the Chazan School. The very humble charcoal placcards he let his siblings use to write on, in his home school, were adopted in Technique by Pontius Pilate [187:1.2], when he would write the name of the convict, and the offense which Rome had deemed to be sufficient for execution.
126:3.4 on a piece of smooth cedar board about eighteen inches square, with a piece of charcoal he wrote out the prayer which became from that time on the standard family petition.


I "pretend" to be Jesusonian? What might you mean by such an accusation?

What are "compulsory loyalty requirements for universal citizenship"?

What does "essent" mean?

Apparently you do not know the meaning of "in lieu of"?

The Hitler reference was about Adolf, and was given as an example of the extent to which any one mortal might influence and cause chaos and suffering for so many other mortals - although limited by the temporal boundries of time and space, still did Hitler (and Stalin and others) exert a significant effect upon a significant number of others - a recent example of an extreme related to the topic of "the reach of repercussions" of mortal choices. The Adamic default and the System rebellion are examples of the additional range of suffering potential for the sin and iniquity of celestials compared to mortals. The "range of repercussion" is always limited but that range is larger or smaller depending upon the source of the sin and iniquity. Sorry you were unable to discern and understand the point. Oh well....


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What are you talking about I am not accusing you of anything Bradley! I say you pretend to be a Jesusonian. Let Michael the Creator Son say IF you truly are His Son!

There are no such compulsory loyalty requirements for universal citizenship, but often National Governments impose Loyalty Standards, and choose to execute beaurocrats who fail in such standards. In America, there are so many definitions of treasonous conduct that even one who has tried to act in what he has deemed to have been the State's own Best Interest, as a citizen of the State and not of his own family. In universal citizenship, an ascender must become like the universal father, acting on the Universal Father's behalf, but in National Government, there is degrees of service and increasing price for loyalty until a Governor is separated from his own home temporarily in order to Rule as a serviceman unto the State, or Empire.

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SEla_Kelly wrote:
What are you talking about I am not accusing you of anything Bradley! I say you pretend to be a Jesusonian. Let Michael the Creator Son say IF you truly are His Son!


You deny your accusation...which you then repeat!! Hahahahaha….what a putz!

:roll: :lol:


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I am no putz I am a Pontifocal Lorax. And you can waste words until your time is up professing to be a Jesus' Son, but no one really recognises the truth your claims but actually I look to the way you look after you own household, the way "loyalty unto those of your own flesh & blood". I do not infer any real logic, from how you make declarations and then arbitrarily and excessively "quotes scriptures". Why cannot people express their true opinions here in truthbook forum? Because Bradley became the expert and imposes the need to proof every idea and people feel bullied "can't tell you what I really think anymore", "can't even express my actual opinions".

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SEla_Kelly wrote:
I am no putz I am a Pontifocal Lorax. And you can waste words until your time is up professing to be a Jesus' Son, but no one really recognises the truth your claims but actually I look to the way you look after you own household, the way "loyalty unto those of your own flesh & blood". I do not infer any real logic, from how you make declarations and then arbitrarily and excessively "quotes scriptures". Why cannot people express their true opinions here in truthbook forum? Because Bradley became the expert and imposes the need to proof every idea and people feel bullied "can't tell you what I really think anymore", "can't even express my actual opinions".


Careful with those Pushem and Pullem levers there! I think you have too many pickles in your jar!! Or is it too few?

True logic does not depend upon inference Stephen. My posting of quotes is never arbitrary and it is only your opinion that they are excessive...and that only because you declare them theoretical only in all your declarations which contradict the text I post. All of us express our true opinions as far as I can tell Stephen. Indeed, some are clearer than others. But your own have recently reached new levels of clarity no doubt. And they do so often contradict the Papers when compared to its contents. I am no expert, I merely post the actual contents in contrast and contradiction to your beliefs, theories, declarations, and proclamations you post here "in lieu of" the actual facts, truths, and teachings of the UB.

So then....nothing on "Personality - identity" ????


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AGAIN I am asking about the centrifugal consequences of my own sin: "how symbols, words, actions, have I caused intereference in the ministrations of the Divine Minister?" How to recognise emotional trauma in the human individual's attempt to coordinate his efforts with this ministry? Likewise, if I have symbolically represented the truth in a manner that inspires other human individuals, how does this enhance Divine Minister's encircuitment within that one?

How do certain issues of identity help the Divine Minister to assist in our adaptations, and how can symbols superimposed on our psyche sometimes reflect certain status of the individual. For instance, you know if a child draw a picture of herself with a frown and a cloud with lightning rainies above her, it reflects the troubled psyche, and how would you interpret that to help the Divine Minister regain activity within their mind?

How to recognise depression in animals, and how various states of mental activity indicate the functioning of certain of the adjutant spirits?

How does the symbolic consciousness of man's private intellect reflect the notion of motivation which lends to the enhanced ministry of the adjutant mind spirits by the Divine Minister?

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What are "centrifugal consequences"?

What exactly do you mean by the symbolic consciousness of the man's private intellect? Text please? Is there a public intellect? Whose motivation are you describing?

What is the enhanced ministry of the adjutants? You keep claiming this with no supporting text to explain it.

As has already been told you by others, no one may interfere with the ministrations of any Deity or mind ministry except for their own. And as also verified, plants and animals offer no contributions to the Supreme nor do they experience or express truth, beauty, or goodness.

Depression in animals? You have some related text about your concerns for depressed animals? Which species are most susceptible? What are the primary causes of depression in animals? What are the symptoms and recommended treatments? How does such non-human depression affect humanity and our own mental health and spiritual progress?


Last edited by fanofVan on Thu May 09, 2019 2:30 pm +0000, edited 2 times in total.

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fanofVan wrote:
What are "centrifugal consequences"?
Which species are most susceptible? What are the primary causes of depression in animals? What are the symptoms and recommended treatments? How does such non-human depression affect humanity and our own mental health and spiritual progress?


Humans are the most susceptible. The Symptoms of Depression might indicate a lack of full functioning of the adjutant mind ministry. Children who grow up in homes depend on their brothers and sisters, and especially their parents in order to gain skills that are servicable in the universe. If I am an older sibling and I fight with a younger sibling, say I win the argument and make you feel bad. But what if the person I did that to, chose to suppress certain urges because of my action, and it takes a course of his life because his mind had closed off the partaking of a portion of this ministry?

Symbolism is not an actual ministry, but as symbols contain an imaginable identity, superimposed upon the human consciousness, how would that be similar or different to forces, mind adjutants, that also have access to and impinge upon the human consciousness. You going into a full denial mode and mocking me, well I admit that the individual can adapt in many ways. This is important to me: if symbols used by the state cause fear or cognitive dissonance, it could stultify the adjutant mind ministry, centrifugally or impersonally. I am not talking about the way a mature human individual would react, but what about the way impressions are created in the child's experiences, and as a parent how you feel responsible for explaining the truths or the blatant intimidation tactics of the state to such a child.

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Humans are not animals. As the UB clearly teaches.

What am I in denial of?


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I protest to the moderators regarding this constant ugliness.


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Humans are the most susceptible. The Symptoms of Depression might indicate a lack of full functioning of the adjutant mind ministry. Children who grow up in homes depend on their brothers and sisters, and especially their parents in order to gain skills that are servicable in the universe. If I am an older sibling and I fight with a younger sibling, say I win the argument and make you feel bad. But what if the person I did that to, chose to suppress certain urges because of my action, and it takes a course of his life because his mind had closed off the partaking of a portion of this ministry?


We all eventually have to take responsibility for our own reactions and responses to life - and to the slings and arrows of others. And we cannot be constantly in fear of offending someone, as long as that is not our motivation.

If our motivation in life is to be agreeable, even in disagreement, we are then (in my opinion) not responsible for another's response to us. An old 12-Step slogan goes: What others think of me is none of my business. And I agree with that. We can't take offense against others for what they think or feel. However, being deliberately mean, sarcastic, or caustic towards one another can never end well.

Having said that - I think both fanofVan and SeLA_Kelly may need to chill out. Your slings and arrows towards one another are becoming a distraction here. It costs nothing to be respectful. Perhaps this thread has reached an end.

MaryJo


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SEla_Kelly wrote:
What are you talking about I am not accusing you of anything Bradley! I say you pretend to be a Jesusonian. Let Michael the Creator Son say IF you truly are His Son!

There are no such compulsory loyalty requirements for universal citizenship, but often National Governments impose Loyalty Standards, and choose to execute beaurocrats who fail in such standards. In America, there are so many definitions of treasonous conduct that even one who has tried to act in what he has deemed to have been the State's own Best Interest, as a citizen of the State and not of his own family. In universal citizenship, an ascender must become like the universal father, acting on the Universal Father's behalf, but in National Government, there is degrees of service and increasing price for loyalty until a Governor is separated from his own home temporarily in order to Rule as a serviceman unto the State, or Empire.


You said...twice so far...that I "pretend to be a Jesusonian" Stephen. And then you question whether I am truly a Son of God.

pre·tend
[prəˈtend]

VERB

speak and act so as to make it appear that something is the case when in fact it is not.

synonyms:

make as if · profess · affect · dissimulate · dissemble · pose · posture · put it on · put on a false front · go through the motions · sham · fake it · kid

Me here: Are not all believers and ascenders "Sons" and Daughters of God? Can one give birth to soul and not be? Indeed, who might you exclude? How about Lucifer and the rebels? Do you recall the Prodigal Son? Isn't that parable precisely and definitively proof of my own sonship Stephen...and Lucifer's...still? You said "IF" I am a son. This is a most serious accusation. One not to be taken lightly. Why do you say such a thing? What is your intended meaning? Which of God's children are not his children?

And what must God's children "do" exactly to qualify as and remain as God's children?

You were the one here who claimed there are "compulsory loyalty requirements for universal citizenship" and now you say there are not? Very confusing. Which is it?

You then declare what ascenders must do and compare this to autocratic human political injustices. Also confusing and dark.

Hmmmm…


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No I only meant it is not my call. Okay it is not compulsory, but it is compulsory if you want to gain wisdom and survive, certain things one must experiencially gain to become the brother of Jesus, especially to heed the word of God and to fulfill the will of the Universal Father. Well that sounds simple but it must be wrought of the unconscious religious desire. When I look at the issue of personal survival, I will not leave this to my own judgment, but to the Ancients of Days. IF you are striving to become like God, fulfilling your family obligations and treating your neighbours as you treat yourself, then you should not worry about it. IF is a question for everyone especially myself. This is not an accusation and if your have gained that assurance of yes Michael is my Brother, on all creature levels of mind? then good for you: to me that would be like the beginning of universe service.

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SEla_Kelly wrote:
No I only meant it is not my call. Okay it is not compulsory, but it is compulsory if you want to gain wisdom and survive, certain things one must experiencially gain to become the brother of Jesus, especially to heed the word of God and to fulfill the will of the Universal Father. Well that sounds simple but it must be wrought of the unconscious religious desire. When I look at the issue of personal survival, I will not leave this to my own judgment, but to the Ancients of Days. IF you are striving to become like God, fulfilling your family obligations and treating your neighbours as you treat yourself, then you should not worry about it. IF is a question for everyone especially myself. This is not an accusation and if your have gained that assurance of yes Michael is my Brother, on all creature levels of mind? then good for you: to me that would be like the beginning of universe service.


I feel very confident in our mutual status as Sons Stephen and as believers and have a profound assurance of my commitment to and future as an ascender. I know this is a friendly universe ruled by love. I also know that the UB teaches us that Divine Assurance comes to us early...and often.

See: viewtopic.php?f=11&t=5434

Oh, and thank you for the direct reply to questions and the clarification of your intentions and meanings. Both very helpful to discussion. So let us return to some earlier questions for additional clarification and understanding:

What are "centrifugal consequences"?

What exactly do you mean by the symbolic consciousness of the man's private intellect? Is there a public intellect?

What is the enhanced ministry of the adjutants?


Last edited by fanofVan on Tue May 14, 2019 3:12 pm +0000, edited 2 times in total.

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