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fanofVan wrote:
To save one from a material drowning is but to be of service to others.


But that's not the crux of what Jesus said, is it? He said it's better to save a man's soul drowning in darkness than to save a man's body from drowning in the water. Both are service and one is greater than the other.

fanofVan wrote:
Do you save souls kat? From what exactly?


From spiritual darkness Bradly. Even Adam and Eve suffered from abject spiritual darkness. Jesus said not to hide your light under a bushel. He said the faithful are the "light of the world". He said to draw near to people so they can see your light and be helped by it.

(1570.14) 140:3.13 “You are the light of the world. A city set upon a hill cannot be hid. Neither do men light a candle and put it under a bushel, but on a candlestick; and it gives light to all who are in the house. Let your light so shine before men that they may see your good works and be led to glorify your Father who is in heaven.

(1691.4) 151:3.1 You are to let your light shine but do so with wisdom and discretion. No man, when he lights a lamp, covers it up with a vessel or puts it under the bed; he puts his lamp on a stand where all can behold the light.

And what is the light we shine? It is the Father who reigns in our life:

(1466.2) 132:7.2 If we know God, our real business on earth is so to live as to permit the Father to reveal himself in our lives, and thus will all God-seeking persons see the Father and ask for our help in finding out more about the God who in this manner finds expression in our lives.

fanofVan wrote:
I happen to think souls are safe without "saving" them. Did you ever notice that Jesus sent out the Apostles to "win" souls for the kingdom but not to save souls from hell fire and damnation, like the Baptists to come later?


You seem to be the only one talking about hell fire and damnation Bradly. You do know that souls can die don't you?

(1229.9) 112:3.2 1. Spiritual (soul) death. If and when mortal man has finally rejected survival, when he has been pronounced spiritually insolvent, morontially bankrupt, in the conjoint opinion of the Adjuster and the surviving seraphim, when such co-ordinate advice has been recorded on Uversa, and after the Censors and their reflective associates have verified these findings, thereupon do the rulers of Orvonton order the immediate release of the indwelling Monitor. But this release of the Adjuster in no way affects the duties of the personal or group seraphim concerned with that Adjuster-abandoned individual. This kind of death is final in its significance irrespective of the temporary continuation of the living energies of the physical and mind mechanisms. From the cosmic standpoint the mortal is already dead; the continuing life merely indicates the persistence of the material momentum of cosmic energies.

And I'm sure you know that souls can get lost and confused:

(1098.4) 100:5.1 The world is filled with lost souls, not lost in the theologic sense but lost in the directional meaning, wandering about in confusion among the isms and cults of a frustrated philosophic era.

Surely you are aware that there are unstable, undisciplined and timid souls who can benefit from examples of stability, discipline and courage

(1121.1) 102:2.8 Again, there are other types of unstable and poorly disciplined souls who would use the sentimental ideas of religion as an avenue of escape from the irritating demands of living. When certain vacillating and timid mortals attempt to escape from the incessant pressure of evolutionary life, religion, as they conceive it, seems to present the nearest refuge, the best avenue of escape.

And who hasn't been moved deeply by the realization that Jesus did all he could to save the soul of Judas Iscariot:

(1567.1) 139:12.8 This is just the reason why Jesus permitted Judas to go on to the very end, always doing everything possible to transform and save this weak and confused apostle. But when light is not honestly received and lived up to, it tends to become darkness within the soul. Judas grew intellectually regarding Jesus’ teachings about the kingdom, but he did not make progress in the acquirement of spiritual character as did the other apostles. He failed to make satisfactory personal progress in spiritual experience.

Finally, who isn't moved by the story of the Good Shepherd, how there's more joy in heaven over the saving one lost soul than the ninety-nine who were not lost? And lost souls only increase the Father's interest! We are supposed to learn how to become like our Father in heaven.

(1850.9) 169:1.2 Many times have I told you the story of the good shepherd who left the ninety and nine sheep in the fold while he went forth searching for the one that was lost, and how, when he had found the straying sheep, he laid it over his shoulder and tenderly carried it back to the fold. And when the lost sheep had been restored to the fold, you remember that the good shepherd called in his friends and bade them rejoice with him over the finding of the sheep that had been lost. Again I say there is more joy in heaven over one sinner who repents than over the ninety and nine just persons who need no repentance. The fact that souls are lost only increases the interest of the heavenly Father. I have come to this world to do my Father’s bidding, and it has truly been said of the Son of Man that he is a friend of publicans and sinners.


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[quote="supermath"]Please also note that fanofVan has been touting his evil "truth assurance" for years, though it never appears once in the papers.[/quote}

But the phrase "assurance of truth" appears:

(1111.4) 101:5.14 Increasingly throughout the morontia progression the assurance of truth replaces the assurance of faith. When you are finally mustered into the actual spirit world, then will the assurances of pure spirit insight operate in the place of faith and truth or, rather, in conjunction with, and superimposed upon, these former techniques of personality assurance.


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fanofVan wrote:
Still looking for disagreement where there is none! But disagreeable nonetheless. Go figure.


You mean disagreeing with you, right? You asked me to correct things that are inaccurate and that's what I'm doing. But I see you don't like it very much. The negative approach always stirs up defense mechanisms and defense mechanisms close the mind.


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A new idea presented in our experience of the Spirit of Truth? A better Plan? A means of alleviating complexity? Let's do that instead! I mean, this reflects how a culture's openness, in that Jesus promised "I go before you," in your own sacred work, and this is a reality that I suppose that I do not have the means for to give expression.

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I'm happy to be corrected kat. There is much about the UB and the truth and reality itself I have yet to learn and much I believe that is incorrect or incomplete. No worries....correct me as you wish. You appear quite eager to correct me and Nigel and Malaku...which makes me wonder why you let Stephen go on and on with false proclamations. Curious behavior indeed. You do know that he is not a new reader by any definition...right? His disagreements with the UB are not unintentional or accidental. Just so you know....


Bradly, you have been given a LOT of leeway here lately, but I am now warning you that one more of these references to Stephen, and you WILL earn yourself a time-out. How rude and how unkind it is to talk about someone who is here reading what you say, but being ignored and minimized and psychologized. If that was me, I would be very unhappy. And I suspect if it was you, you would be unhappy, too. That is why such behavior is not permitted here. It is divisive and inflammatory and unkind.

You have been warned...I implore you to address the topic, and not the person.


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SEla_Kelly wrote:
fanofVan wrote:
Consider yourself advised! Hahahahha…. I am but another child in God's kingdom. I am no fount of wisdom or experience. I am very irritating even...apparently!!=') "."


Hahahaha! Oh dear ok I at least for now keep much of your words under advicement. [en wiki: "As Robert Browning (a modern historian, not the poet) observed: "Did Justinian really bring himself in the end to make a choice, or did Callinicus make it for him? Only Callinicus knew."" - Justin II]


Glad to hear you laugh Stephen!!! I can take myself too seriously sometimes. And sometimes the uncertainties in life make our choices feel overwhelming so we take circumstances and situations too seriously as well. I want you to know that I always wish you the best...even when I disagree with your posts and become impatient. Often enough I simply do not understand your point and do not take adequate time to explore your intentions in discussion. That's on me.

And either way, things didn't work out so well for Callinicus!! Careful what you wish for! Hahahaha....


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fanofVan wrote:
The TA never makes the decision of "I will do better not as an Ascender". We have no choice but ascension Stephen.

See but that is exactly what constitutes the "failure to survive" for each mortal human individual. If the life in the soul of a mortal creature cannot ascend, than this effectually what the Thought Adjuster had deemed, and "life within that creature" must return to the grand universe thereto: i.e. "the life that each of us has in 'the Holy Spirit'" returning to the universe?

What does it mean when the last Tiger, needed to sustain its healthy population, has perished and the numbers are deemed unsustainable? A Tiger cannot have a soul, even though as a creature living within that body, has no identity, simply the life of the Holy Spirit, or the Oversoul of Creation?

You are saying that "the experiences are preserved in the Life of the Supreme Being", but now that I have considered this enough: do you think that if our world has lost its planetary endowment, that we would be more likely or less likely to receive such gift if we are petition, again in the future.

fanofVan introduces an interesting new topic: "Is the Holy Spirit a Person?" Explain again, your reasons why you believe He, or "it"? Here I will just say if the Holy Spirit is capable of representing the universal absolute in the life of every mortal creature, with or without adjutant ministry, I can say without prejudice: this is what I exist to do, to wrest universal realities from unqualified existences. The Divine Minister is a "He", one who is capable of representing the Holy Spirit to every mortal ascender. But see this concept "to wrest" reflect my limited creature knowledge of how to be like the universal father.


Finally, you bring up the brilliant scenario, as J.D. Salinger in the Catcher in the Rye, that to save a person's life from drowning, is not the same as to rescue that person's mind from misrepresentation or error of principle. But of course that is a final value, if a person's life in fact had been in jeopardy, and even in some cultures believe if you save a person's life then you must serve that person eternally.

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Well, suppose your friend died. Either he drowned or he actually committed suicide. Does the circumstance of death affect your judgment of that person? Or would you love such a person enough, to overcome the doubt about his own personal morality, in order to think, "well I would want to talk to that person, to meet up with that person, and find for your own reasoning?"

And, well, you always have the question if a person drowned was it their choice to drown, or your choice not to save that one.

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SEla_Kelly wrote:
Well, suppose your friend died. Either he drowned or he actually committed suicide. Does the circumstance of death affect your judgment of that person? Or would you love such a person enough, to overcome the doubt about his own personal morality, in order to think, "well I would want to talk to that person, to meet up with that person, and find for your own reasoning?"

And, well, you always have the question if a person drowned was it their choice to drown, or your choice not to save that one.


I wouldn't judge anyone by the manner of their death, no. Especially a friend. Even if suicide were certain. Morality here does not determine ultimate choices in Mansonia and I don't believe suicide is immoral. Just immature and impatient and a little selfish perhaps. Again with saving? Can we be saved from ourselves and our own choices by someone else?

Temporal suffering simply overwhelms some of us and we cannot find relief, comfort, or assurance. It is our duty and opportunity I think to serve all others by our empathy and sincere good intentions to relieve the suffering of others as best we can...


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And I am a little abashed about making continuous posts in a forum thread, but...

I must admit that I do not see "free will choices" as possible until after the human individual has ascended to have become the finalitor. And I hold this in the maximum potential for every human individual to find Paradise, be one with the father, and then make the free will choices.

And you are right, I am afraid to confirm that there are actual free will choices, since I am a jurist in this legal case, you used to talk about it a lot called Gabriel v. Lucifer, in other words Gabriel's indictment against the potential folly of a "Declaration of Liberty". "The HOly Spirit" AS the "Spirit of the Infinite Spirit" confirms that the Third Source and Center has attained the full expression of a personal relationship to the First Source and Center, while bestowing upon the potential of Unqualified Existences, to become universal, and this is experiencially revealed in the Supreme Being. So in "the spirit of the Spirit (3rd Source)," we have the actual existence of the potential of all human life, except as supplemented in our circumstance by the Nodite-extension(+Amadonite) and the Adamic Bestowal. This represents a very mixtured set of "Holy Spirits" to contribute life plasm, and a wonderful preponderance of the Original Andonic strain. In spite of the monstrous actualities that have entered into the circumstances of what I may constitute as a decision, I find that the amalgamation, as a fused harmony from every component of my existence, is beautiful. And I can also say this: although I may not say that I have actually attained wisdom, I have attained knowledge and I was given the potential to attain wisdom. But I admit, from the life within me, knowing wisdom is not enough to say that I love, that I am a loving being of the universe with every right to enter Paradise just as I welcome sentience to Nebadon.

If I say that a man is doing the will of God, this is something that in your society and in many cultures, is very applicable to the logical reasoning. How does a person know, recognise confirm, that his own child is doing a good job. How do you know when you have done God's will? Because of the satisfaction you have gained in convincing others? Or in the faith that you earn in seeing that the potentials for your child's life, can and in the reasoning should be satisfied. In other words you have done all you can to gain the potential for the human individual to become the finalitor, and then say, "he is in God's hands now." Only then you can say, that the individual has the ability to determine thereafter what he wants.

But if it is true that the human individual has become a finalitor, then there are infinite potentials that may be revealed in the potential of his further experiences. And then you would know, if I am also a finalitor we could have an eternal relationship, always knowing Michael the Creator Son as the father, the one who encourages and fosters, our journeys to become real souls, sharing the totality of experience as separate personalities.

Well if I could explain the circumstances of why our jurisdiction would attract many spirits who wish to know the difference between the eternal unity of the Three Original Deities, and the obligations of duty that extend from Trinity Function of the Supreme Being. As it is said, such beings assist our earthly affairs greatly in manners most unscrutinizable, "Observers" and those who had been intent to actually shaping their own affairs according to the recommendations of Michael the Creator Son and/or the Divine Minister of Salvington. How are they learning to manifest the full actualities of potential that stem from our world in the seventh universe. It seems to me, that everyone has a chance to judge themselves in the same manner, that as God such labours are a joy, and any person might fulfill the same obligations. That Gabriel is the first born child of Nebadon, and when He came into existence, he was conjointly Parented by Michael, and a Person who at the time was purely undifferentiable from the Third Source and Center. What do you think about how other created beings in the jurisdiction of Salvington, seeing Gabriel always as Primary Representative of Michael's Administration?

This is one thing: in the same way that the angels who have in fact failed to survive after this "war in heaven", as it is described, you have to be brave enough to look at Gabriel, and say "if those angels simply did not believe, could not fathom, that Lucifer could have done something wrong." Well "fanofVan" is definetly, well in my opinion, wont to assume that "neither is Gabriel fallible." He pins his own convictions to the infallibility of Gabriel.

But a person is told "to be able to change his mind", to redirect his focus to new goals. So if the identity of our SpiritMother, the Divine Minister of Salvington, could be reborn as a new personality, would you give Her a chance to find peace in that new situation, and "choose for himself"? I would think, well the Ancients of Days has the fully authority to enact new policy when such a Legal Case has been decided, but the opinion of the Divine Minister would matter very much. How did the rebellion affect Her Experience? "As a mother who knew she would give birth?" And if we are taught to see the soul as "the spirit who emerges from the Holy Spirit of the mortal tabernacle", how could we actually identify Him or Her or her? If I can be like the Divine Minister, I believe that I can recognise Holy Spirits who are also like the Divine Minister, and if I can know the Divine Minister then I must learn to recognise Him. I cannot know for certain because I have a mother, and I am the youngest of three brothers, and I never had a sister in my own family. And so this relationship to spirit is something of "an experiencial unknown" but I wish to believe in the existences of spirits and to treat my sisters in a more considerate fashion, and respectful of the full potential of any destiny that they may device.

Ok: and this is why I say that I believe that Simon Peter was doing the will of God when he denied his Master inside the gate of the temple, before his people gave Jesus to the Romans.

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SEla_Kelly wrote:
And I am a little abashed about making continuous posts in a forum thread, but...

I must admit that I do not see "free will choices" as possible until after the human individual has ascended to have become the finalitor. And I hold this in the maximum potential for every human individual to find Paradise, be one with the father, and then make the free will choices.

And you are right, I am afraid to confirm that there are actual free will choices, since I am a jurist in this legal case, you used to talk about it a lot called Gabriel v. Lucifer, in other words Gabriel's indictment against the potential folly of a "Declaration of Liberty". "The HOly Spirit" AS the "Spirit of the Infinite Spirit" confirms that the Third Source and Center has attained the full expression of a personal relationship to the First Source and Center, while bestowing upon the potential of Unqualified Existences, to become universal, and this is experiencially revealed in the Supreme Being. So in "the spirit of the Spirit (3rd Source)," we have the actual existence of the potential of all human life, except as supplemented in our circumstance by the Nodite-extension(+Amadonite) and the Adamic Bestowal. This represents a very mixtured set of "Holy Spirits" to contribute life plasm, and a wonderful preponderance of the Original Andonic strain. In spite of the monstrous actualities that have entered into the circumstances of what I may constitute as a decision, I find that the amalgamation, as a fused harmony from every component of my existence, is beautiful. And I can also say this: although I may not say that I have actually attained wisdom, I have attained knowledge and I was given the potential to attain wisdom. But I admit, from the life within me, knowing wisdom is not enough to say that I love, that I am a loving being of the universe with every right to enter Paradise just as I welcome sentience to Nebadon.

If I say that a man is doing the will of God, this is something that in your society and in many cultures, is very applicable to the logical reasoning. How does a person know, recognise confirm, that his own child is doing a good job. How do you know when you have done God's will? Because of the satisfaction you have gained in convincing others? Or in the faith that you earn in seeing that the potentials for your child's life, can and in the reasoning should be satisfied. In other words you have done all you can to gain the potential for the human individual to become the finalitor, and then say, "he is in God's hands now." Only then you can say, that the individual has the ability to determine thereafter what he wants.

But if it is true that the human individual has become a finalitor, then there are infinite potentials that may be revealed in the potential of his further experiences. And then you would know, if I am also a finalitor we could have an eternal relationship, always knowing Michael the Creator Son as the father, the one who encourages and fosters, our journeys to become real souls, sharing the totality of experience as separate personalities.

Well if I could explain the circumstances of why our jurisdiction would attract many spirits who wish to know the difference between the eternal unity of the Three Original Deities, and the obligations of duty that extend from Trinity Function of the Supreme Being. As it is said, such beings assist our earthly affairs greatly in manners most unscrutinizable, "Observers" and those who had been intent to actually shaping their own affairs according to the recommendations of Michael the Creator Son and/or the Divine Minister of Salvington. How are they learning to manifest the full actualities of potential that stem from our world in the seventh universe. It seems to me, that everyone has a chance to judge themselves in the same manner, that as God such labours are a joy, and any person might fulfill the same obligations. That Gabriel is the first born child of Nebadon, and when He came into existence, he was conjointly Parented by Michael, and a Person who at the time was purely undifferentiable from the Third Source and Center. What do you think about how other created beings in the jurisdiction of Salvington, seeing Gabriel always as Primary Representative of Michael's Administration?

This is one thing: in the same way that the angels who have in fact failed to survive after this "war in heaven", as it is described, you have to be brave enough to look at Gabriel, and say "if those angels simply did not believe, could not fathom, that Lucifer could have done something wrong." Well "fanofVan" is definetly, well in my opinion, wont to assume that "neither is Gabriel fallible." He pins his own convictions to the infallibility of Gabriel.

But a person is told "to be able to change his mind", to redirect his focus to new goals. So if the identity of our SpiritMother, the Divine Minister of Salvington, could be reborn as a new personality, would you give Her a chance to find peace in that new situation, and "choose for himself"? I would think, well the Ancients of Days has the fully authority to enact new policy when such a Legal Case has been decided, but the opinion of the Divine Minister would matter very much. How did the rebellion affect Her Experience? "As a mother who knew she would give birth?" And if we are taught to see the soul as "the spirit who emerges from the Holy Spirit of the mortal tabernacle", how could we actually identify Him or Her or her? If I can be like the Divine Minister, I believe that I can recognise Holy Spirits who are also like the Divine Minister, and if I can know the Divine Minister then I must learn to recognise Him. I cannot know for certain because I have a mother, and I am the youngest of three brothers, and I never had a sister in my own family. And so this relationship to spirit is something of "an experiencial unknown" but I wish to believe in the existences of spirits and to treat my sisters in a more considerate fashion, and respectful of the full potential of any destiny that they may device.


We cannot give birth to soul or progress in the Spirit or fuse or become finaliters or grow experiential wisdom without free will. To deny free will is itself a choice.

We are not jurists in such matters.


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But you are abstaining from the question why would you need to give a reply to say "No Comment." Maybe others in this group are not also jurists, but I have made every consideration necessary to be able to offer an opinion on this Case.

In other words, "I have volunteered all of the testimony that I have written and that you are able to read."

The question I asked "did Dave Rothwell kill himself? i.e. 'chose to'" or "did he die i.e. 'drown'?" in a society that could not represent him. The only shred of his own testimony, before 16 April 2010, was that his friends told me "he had to get off the grid." See this indicates that he did not die but committed such act with his own hand. And but in terms of the eventual survival of souls, it is the nonaction which destroys the survival of souls.

At least, it is a very good example one modern person suicide acute circumstances, or in the case of Saul from the olden times, "one who may have, in fact, drowned." But we know that in the marriage of David to the daughters of Saul, there is in fact a wise universe plan (Jesus pulling drowning Saul out of the Sea). So I will always ask, in the case of one "actually brave enough to take his own life", would he survive, and I can say, to myself, I want him to.

You can say this "we are not jurists", but I have affirmed the truth and have rendered a verdict. As to my own status as a finalitor, absolutely uncertain.

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SEla_Kelly wrote:
But you are abstaining from the question why would you need to give a reply to say "No Comment." Maybe others in this group are not also jurists, but I have made every consideration necessary to be able to offer an opinion on this Case.

In other words, "I have volunteered all of the testimony that I have written and that you are able to read."

The question I asked "did Dave Rothwell kill himself? i.e. 'chose to'" or "did he die i.e. 'drown'?" in a society that could not represent him. The only shred of his own testimony, before 16 April 2010, was that his friends told me "he had to get off the grid." See this indicates that he did not die but committed such act with his own hand. And but in terms of the eventual survival of souls, it is the nonaction which destroys the survival of souls.

At least, it is a very good example one modern person suicide acute circumstances, or in the case of Saul from the olden times, "one who may have, in fact, drowned." But we know that in the marriage of David to the daughters of Saul, there is in fact a wise universe plan (Jesus pulling drowning Saul out of the Sea). So I will always ask, in the case of one "actually brave enough to take his own life", would he survive, and I can say, to myself, I want him to.

You can say this "we are not jurists", but I have affirmed the truth and have rendered a verdict. As to my own status as a finalitor, absolutely uncertain.


You have not affirmed any truth nor rendered a valid or relevant verdict regarding the rebellion.


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fanofVan wrote:
You have not affirmed any truth nor rendered a valid or relevant verdict regarding the rebellion.


I indeed pity anyone who would say this to me.

I admit that I identify acts of will: I cannot properly discern what you are calling by that when humans are said to have made choices; however, I hold that in the sentience of a man, he can find Paradise, and when he does, he can constitute his own choices, as others have explained it to me earlier in this thread.

If I cannot render a verdict, then I cannot make a choice, and if I cannot make any choices, I admit, what potential does my individuating Thought Adjuster find in my soul? I have "gained the world", by understanding my own psychological identity as one who "has emerged out of creation", from the Holy Spirit. I have "gained the world" by understanding my psychological complex. And now I must ask myself, "now that I have gained the world, what does it mean if I have not attained the fullness of Paradise." I crave to drink from the water Jesus explained "we know not of" now. Indeed, I have brought a rational proof: that I would hope you could learn to recognise Michael the Creator as your brother, and so as I also your brother, as long as in this life while we may tread on Urantia, even though I may not be considered as a finalitor, even though I may become extinct as a human individual. Now that I have "gained the world", I realise that even if I do not ascend, I must do all I can in the most effortful and considerate fashion, to help my family so that they actually do and may become finalitors themselves.

But am I missing something? Are human choices made "in every tiny little effort", in every selection, "con toda palavra" or action? Are the choices you make a daily effort, or are rather efforts seen as simply a manner of reinforcement the universal potentials you preserve for your own children, the product of discipline? Okay I can accept, on the plane of reality, that humans are making microchoices, but only in relevence of Divine Insight, how such choices are acts of will that all stem from the original act of will, before even there was the creation. Before there was the Grand Universe, there has been the Eternal Son, and so you can see that the Grand Universe is, in some way materially a spiritual byproduct of the lowest functions of the Universal Father, just as the Holy Spirit is a spiritual byproduct of the lowest functions of the life in the Third Source and Center. But even how lowly is the matter, and how lowly is the spirit, between these possibilities have forged a lowly soul such as I, who has been given the power to know for himself the final result of such trials.

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SEla_Kelly wrote:
I must admit that I do not see "free will choices" as possible until after the human individual has ascended to have become the finalitor. And I hold this in the maximum potential for every human individual to find Paradise, be one with the father, and then make the free will choices.


It isn't possible to become a finaliter without making free-will choices, but that aside. You're right in that free-will is hedged by certain cosmic limitations which are lessened, or should I say widened, during the ascension to Paradise. Free will is not entirely free from the cosmic perspective. Here is a reference which describes the over-control of free will on the worlds of time and space:

(1301.6) 118.8.1 In the time-space creations, free will is hedged about with restraints, with limitations.

There are reasons for over-control of free will and it has to do with the fact that higher minds with a wider range of volitional freedom naturally limit all inferior will-creature's range of choice. It's how the universe works with the superior quality always preferable to the inferior, thus the more perfected creatures are given more liberty than the less perfected creatures.

(1303.3) 118.9.2  Mechanisms produced by higher minds function to liberate their creative sources but to some degree unvaryingly limit the action of all subordinate intelligences. To the creatures of the universes this limitation becomes apparent as the mechanism of the universes. Man does not have unfettered free will; there are limits to his range of choice, but within the radius of this choice his will is relatively sovereign.

Because we have personality we also have free will, the two are inseparable. If you have personality then you have free will. If you have no free will then you have no personality. If you are alive and have no personality, you are either a plant, animal or a living machine.

Personality is of divine origin and so is free will, but only the Father has finality of free will. The Father loves all personalities and draws them to himself in the personality circuit with one caveat, the personality must consent to being drawn toward him. The Father will never force a personality to do anything without consent because of the extraordinary value he places on personality and it's right to choose to recognize him as its Father. The Father sends out personality, but it must return to him of it's own free will.

(1299.6) 118:6.3 Within a local frame, volition may appear to function as an uncaused cause, but it unfailingly exhibits inheritance factors which establish relationship with the unique, original, and absolute First Causes.

(1299.7) 118.6.4  All volition is relative. In the originating sense, only the Father-I AM possesses finality of volition; in the absolute sense, only the Father, the Son, and the Spirit exhibit the prerogatives of volition unconditioned by time and unlimited by space. Mortal man is endowed with free will, the power of choice, and though such choosing is not absolute, nevertheless, it is relatively final on the finite level and concerning the destiny of the choosing personality.

Just for the sake of completeness, free will is defined in this reference:

(1431.5) 130:2.10  It was on this same day that we first heard that momentous truth which, stated in modern terms, would signify: “Will is that manifestation of the human mind which enables the subjective consciousness to express itself objectively and to experience the phenomenon of aspiring to be Godlike.” And it is in this same sense that every reflective and spiritually minded human being can become creative.


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