Urantia Book Forum

Urantia Book Discussion Board : Study Group
It is currently Sat Dec 07, 2019 8:09 pm +0000

All times are UTC - 7 hours




Post new topic This topic is locked, you cannot edit posts or make further replies.  [ 360 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1 ... 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15 ... 24  Next
Author Message
PostPosted:  
Offline

Joined: Sun Mar 25, 2012 5:29 am +0000
Posts: 3955
katroofjebus wrote:
fanofVan wrote:
So you're sticking with anxiety is a healthy thing? The UB says anxiety "must be abandoned" and Jesus preached against worry and anxiety. Please choose for yourself.


Yes, I'm sticking to the fact that anxiety is part of the divine plan. It is a gift-in-disguise. What the revelation is asking us to do is use the gift and not let it use us, or enslave us. We are meant to abandon our bondage to it. Anxiety itself is a powerful tool, but when used improperly can cause unnecessary suffering. It's a matter of perspective not unlike this reference:

(555.4) 48:6.25  Even as mortals, so have these angels been father to many disappointments, and they will point out that sometimes your most disappointing disappointments have become your greatest blessings. Sometimes the planting of a seed necessitates its death, the death of your fondest hopes, before it can be reborn to bear the fruits of new life and new opportunity. And from them you will learn to suffer less through sorrow and disappointment, first, by making fewer personal plans concerning other personalities, and then, by accepting your lot when you have faithfully performed your duty.


Likewise so is cannibalism, slavery , ghost fear, totems, genocide, greed, and all manner of evil and error are also parts of the social and personal hammer and anvil. All manner of primitive and superstitious beliefs and practices are required to be overcome in life. Not perpetuated.

Anxiety is inferior to faith. Which do you recommend? Which is preferred in the teachings? One is something to mature out of (abandoned) while faith is to be embraced and fill our hearts to end our anxieties....but not the uncertainties of life which will continue but will be calmly and confidently faced by faith and trust.

So elemental even children do it.

Thanks to you no sophist...humor is always welcome and almost always appropriate. Great timing....very funny. And very timely in its serious truthful portrayal that Adam and Eve felt anxiety toward their own challenges of the Garden. Eventually impatience got the best of Eve. Immaturity and inexperience and uncertainties lef to worry and anxiety which was the cause of very bad choices. Anxiety is an inferior motivator we are told.


Last edited by fanofVan on Mon May 20, 2019 6:16 am +0000, edited 1 time in total.

Top
 Profile Send private message  
 
PostPosted:  
Offline

Joined: Wed Oct 17, 2018 4:14 pm +0000
Posts: 210
Location: Left Coast
maryjo606 wrote:
Quote:
Maybe Adam and Eve felt a little anxiety when they contemplated coming up with a million violet offspring?


LOL! They surely must have felt anxiety and unease - in fact we are told they were discouraged at times over the state of affairs here. I haven't got the time right now, but I might just look into that...how they dealt with it - or if...

Of course, we do know that Eve responded when given a plan that she thought might help matters...


The jest was in the spirit of what the Reversion Directors do.
48:4.5 1. Reminiscent jests. Quips growing out of the memories of past episodes in one’s experience of combat, struggle, and sometimes fearfulness, and ofttimes foolish and childish anxiety. To us, this phase of humor derives from the deep-seated and abiding ability to draw upon the past for memory material with which pleasantly to flavor and otherwise lighten the heavy loads of the present.


Top
 Profile Send private message  
 
PostPosted:  
Offline
Moderator

Joined: Sat Dec 30, 2006 9:13 am +0000
Posts: 1039
Location: Denver CO
Quote:
Maryjo...you may parse and parcel this Revelation like Stephen as you wish and claim some parts more and less important than other parts and no reader or believer here should take any part too seriously if you dare to...but what a grave error and profound evil in my opinion. At this place, a study group of the Revelation you declare we should not take too seriously or too literally the teachings of this Epocal Revelation??!!


I have no idea what you're talking about. I offered my experience with anxiety.

And the Adam and Eve response was simply an attempt to lighten the tone here, as nosophist points out.

Maybe you might try to lighten up a little bit yourself, fanofvan...


Top
 Profile Send private message  
 
PostPosted:  
Offline

Joined: Wed Feb 20, 2019 12:11 pm +0000
Posts: 932
maryjo606 wrote:
Maybe you might try to lighten up a little bit yourself, fanofvan...


Wouldn't that be lovely? I long to see it. Thank you Maryjo for you candid sincerity.

fanofVan wrote:
All manner of primitive and superstitious beliefs and practices are required to be overcome in life. Not perpetuated.


But anxiety is not a belief, nor is it practice Bradly. it's an emotion, a very human emotion we all share.


Top
 Profile Send private message  
 
PostPosted:  
Offline

Joined: Wed Feb 20, 2019 12:11 pm +0000
Posts: 932
Riktare wrote:
It might be worthwhile too to remember that words in English (and most other human languages on this planet) are often not so precise and descriptive in detail. That is probably why we see different narratives involving anxiety from different authors and in different situations.

I think giving too much credence to Thesauruses very definitely "dumbs down" our sensitivities to more refined and more accurate use of words. It seems fairly obvious that a word like anxiety can mean a large range of experiences and conditions. I tend to like the word "commotion" to capture the stimulus aspect of anxiety that is often quite essential to trigger growth of faith and willingness to cooperate when we are otherwise stagnant.


Well said. Anxiety covers a wide range of emotional attitudes and behaviors. You prefer "commotion", I prefer "disquietude", yet we are both referring to the same phenomenon of human experience. And both act as a stimulus for growth, which is why they are there in the first place. They are mind ministry urges and drives given to us by our Divine Mother for a divine purpose – evolution.


Top
 Profile Send private message  
 
PostPosted:  
Offline
Moderator

Joined: Sat Dec 30, 2006 9:13 am +0000
Posts: 1039
Location: Denver CO
I would like to offer this wonderful advice of Jesus to the young man who was afraid:

Quote:
“This day, my son, you are to be reborn, re-established as a man of faith, courage, and devoted service to man, for God’s sake. And when you become so readjusted to life within yourself, you become likewise readjusted to the universe; you have been born again— born of the spirit —and henceforth will your whole life become one of victorious accomplishment. Trouble will invigorate you; disappointment will spur you on; difficulties will challenge you; and obstacles will stimulate you. Arise, young man! Say farewell to the life of cringing fear and fleeing cowardice. Hasten back to duty and live your life in the flesh as a son of God, a mortal dedicated to the ennobling service of man on earth and destined to the superb and eternal service of God in eternity.”


The whole story is here: https://truthbook.com/urantia-book/paper-130-on-the-way-to-rome#U130_6_0

Jesus didn't say that the young man would not have any more difficulties in life, or that he would not be anxious anymore. But he did tell him that even though he would have these difficulties, he could now face them with a new determination to overcome.

This decision to face our insecurities and fears and anxieties does make all things new. It gives the believer a new vista from which to see and deal with life's problems. But it does not take the problems away. And Jesus is always with us to share in our efforts, our failings, and our victories.

Sometimes it takes a lifetime to achieve mastery over this very basis issue of anxiety and uncertainty, but it does not mean the believer is weak or insincere if it takes that long, or if our energy flags along the way. This is a dark world with much to overcome. Jesus understands and fellowships us every step of the way.

Praise God and thank God...


Top
 Profile Send private message  
 
PostPosted:  
Offline

Joined: Wed Oct 17, 2018 4:14 pm +0000
Posts: 210
Location: Left Coast
maryjo606 wrote:
I would like to offer this wonderful advice of Jesus to the young man who was afraid:

Quote:
“This day, my son, you are to be reborn, re-established as a man of faith, courage, and devoted service to man, for God’s sake. And when you become so readjusted to life within yourself, you become likewise readjusted to the universe; you have been born again— born of the spirit —and henceforth will your whole life become one of victorious accomplishment. Trouble will invigorate you; disappointment will spur you on; difficulties will challenge you; and obstacles will stimulate you. Arise, young man! Say farewell to the life of cringing fear and fleeing cowardice. Hasten back to duty and live your life in the flesh as a son of God, a mortal dedicated to the ennobling service of man on earth and destined to the superb and eternal service of God in eternity.”


The whole story is here: https://truthbook.com/urantia-book/paper-130-on-the-way-to-rome#U130_6_0

Jesus didn't say that the young man would not have any more difficulties in life, or that he would not be anxious anymore. But he did tell him that even though he would have these difficulties, he could now face them with a new determination to overcome.

This decision to face our insecurities and fears and anxieties does make all things new. It gives the believer a new vista from which to see and deal with life's problems. But it does not take the problems away. And Jesus is always with us to share in our efforts, our failings, and our victories.

Sometimes it takes a lifetime to achieve mastery over this very basis issue of anxiety and uncertainty, but it does not mean the believer is weak or insincere if it takes that long, or if our energy flags along the way. This is a dark world with much to overcome. Jesus understands and fellowships us every step of the way.

Praise God and thank God...


Supreme fodder.


Top
 Profile Send private message  
 
PostPosted:  
Offline

Joined: Wed Feb 20, 2019 12:11 pm +0000
Posts: 932
fanofVan wrote:
Why do you twist my words and post out of context snippets?


I'm sorry. I wasn't aware of doing such a thing. Your writing style is confusing. But I do find it interesting that you get upset and anxious when your words are twisted. As I see it, that's precisely what you do to Stephen's writing on a regular basis. Perhaps you are unaware you do this? I was unaware of twisting yours, so it is likely that you are as well. But now you know.

fanofVan wrote:
We agree and yet you argue.


Sorry again, but I was not arguing. I was opining.

fanofVan wrote:
To claim our progress delivers a natural end to uncertainties is a falsehood. Just as is the claim that anxiety is healthy or desirable or something to embrace and defend in others when simple faith and trust delivers true assurance and peace to mind according to the promise of Jesus and the Revelation.


My friend, now you have twisted my words. No one has said that anxiety should be embraced, that would be unhealthy. However, recognizing the fact that anxiety is a symptom of disharmony with the Thought Adjuster is very healthy. It's not possible to fix a problem until you recognize there is a problem. Anxiety, and all its synonymous emotions, serves that function. It alerts the mind that it has failed to utilize all the gifts at its disposal.

I think you do the student community a great disservice by denying this over and over again. And the fact that so many have come forward on this forum to share their own transformational stories regarding anxiety tells me that you are way off base. Or, perhaps it's the way you use words. Either way, your hostility tells me you are anxious, perturbed, worried, troubled, bothered and upset.

fanofVan wrote:
ANXIETY MUST BE ABANDONED ....does the UB make this emphatic and unequivocal statement????!!!! Why yes it does!


Yes, it does say that. But you've taken it out of context. Read the entire Book and relate it to all other references to anxiety and abandonment. To abandon something means to give it up. What did Jesus teach about giving up bad habits? He said it cannot be done by a mere act of will. The only way to abandon anxiety is to learn to love higher attitudes and then be transformed by those higher levels of thinking. It is a gradual process which requires spiritual growth and progress. There is not a human being alive who can shut off anxiety, or any other human emotion, like a light switch. The four higher faith attitudes are learned by falling in love with them. Consider what Jesus taught here:

(1738.4) 156:5.5 “But let me warn you against the folly of undertaking to surmount temptation by the effort of supplanting one desire by another and supposedly superior desire through the mere force of the human will. If you would be truly triumphant over the temptations of the lesser and lower nature, you must come to that place of spiritual advantage where you have really and truly developed an actual interest in, and love for, those higher and more idealistic forms of conduct which your mind is desirous of substituting for these lower and less idealistic habits of behavior that you recognize as temptation. You will in this way be delivered through spiritual transformation rather than be increasingly overburdened with the deceptive suppression of mortal desires. The old and the inferior will be forgotten in the love for the new and the superior. Beauty is always triumphant over ugliness in the hearts of all who are illuminated by the love of truth. There is mighty power in the expulsive energy of a new and sincere spiritual affection. And again I say to you, be not overcome by evil but rather overcome evil with good.”

Please note that what he is teaching us here applies to anxiety. The mere force of human will will not supplant anxiety by assurance. This is the same as saying anxiety cannot be abandoned and replaced with faith-assurance by a simple act of willpower. Jesus then gives us instruction on how to go about abandoning an inferior (anxious) way of thinking. The process he recommends is to develop an interest in a higher way of thinking, to fall in love with "idealistic forms of conduct", which in this case would be trust, faith-trust. A persistent desire for a higher way of thinking and behaving is transformative. This means that it is a gradual weaning off of adjutant anxiety. Do you understand this Bradly? And if you understand it, do you agree that anxiety could never be abandoned unless a person finds it disagreeable and uncomfortable which is the impetus for finding a better way? This is the purpose of anxiety and why it is healthy, meaning purposeful. There's a reason God gave it to us. What the Revelation is teaching us is that we can free ourselves from anxiety by recognizing the fact that it does not need to have power over us; there is something better worth seeking.

fanofVan wrote:
Get over it....and stop recommending worry and anxiety. They are the antithesis of hope, trust, faith, and the assurance ministries of The Father, Mother, AND Son within. Shouldn't THAT be the message here...and to all?


Again, you've totally missed the finer points. No one is recommending worry and anxiety. This entire discussion concerns the process by which anxiety can be abandoned. We all know it should, but it does not happen by magic. Anxiety has a purpose. The Life Carriers created a germ plasm with the potential for anxiety for a reason. The revelation of this fact is integral in understanding it, and when we understand things we have more power to control them. Sermonizing on the evil of anxiety does no one any good whatsoever. It's no different than those bible-thumping preachers who rail against all manner of sin but offer no help at all on how to overcome temptation. The Revelation has given us great help in this regard, and that is where I have been placing my emphasis, whereas I see your emphasis has been more with evangelism. We have entirely different styles.

fanofVan wrote:
Maryjo...you may parse and parcel this Revelation like Stephen as you wish and claim some parts more and less important than other parts and no reader or believer here should take any part too seriously if you dare to...but what a grave error and profound evil in my opinion. At this place, a study group of the Revelation you declare we should not take too seriously or too literally the teachings of this Epocal Revelation??!! Dear Lord.


I can't say I've ever seen such chutzpah! You are saying Maryjo's efforts here are profoundly evil! I just cannot abide by that kind of slander and personal assault. And on a woman. How dare you. Have you no shame?


Top
 Profile Send private message  
 
PostPosted:  
Offline

Joined: Sun Mar 25, 2012 5:29 am +0000
Posts: 3955
maryjo606 wrote:
BTW - nice to see you here again, Jim...
Quote:
Having consciously engaged this process many years ago, I am curious what motivates one to be so inclined as to create a theology; an intellectual understanding of such a revelation as The Urantia papers, as a necessary basis upon which to build one's character. In fact it seems counterproductive and counterintuitive and the constant confrontations exhibited here on Truthbook reveal mostly the character of theological persuasion versus the revelation of spirit embrace.


I think you have hit on something good to consider here. Words on a page are just that - words on a page . It is not always easy to translate the truth that we find in the UB into reality for our own lives. We may agree in principle, but putting truth into personal practice takes time and effort - sorrow and joy - tearing down and building back up. This process can take a very long time, but it does not mean we don't believe. It just may mean that we're doing the best we can where we are right now.

I remember having the experience of rebirth in the Spirit. It was pretty much an instant decision, but it took many, many years before I felt that I was firmly rooted in the Kingdom. Years of back-and-forth - one foot in and one foot out. My material life had to catch up with my new spiritual ideals. And in that in-between time, I was a mess a lot of the time. The spiritual life is hard work! especially if one has a lot of tearing-down to do.

Sometimes here on this forum, some of us have the tendency to browbeat others for not being able to totally embrace every truth that the book offers. Example:

Quote:
Why do you keep denying the FACTS as written in the Fifth Epochal Revelation?


Facts have to be translated into truth through experience. And just because we don't all manage to do it RIGHT NOW, or even "right" doesn't make those of us who lag behind any less valuable or any less beloved by God. We just never know the trials that a person my be going through...


Me here: the quote posted by Maryjo was from katroofjebus: "Why do you keep denying the FACTS as written in the Fifth Epochal Revelation?"

maryjo606 wrote:
Quote:
Maryjo...you may parse and parcel this Revelation like Stephen as you wish and claim some parts more and less important than other parts and no reader or believer here should take any part too seriously if you dare to...but what a grave error and profound evil in my opinion. At this place, a study group of the Revelation you declare we should not take too seriously or too literally the teachings of this Epocal Revelation??!!



I have no idea what you're talking about. I offered my experience with anxiety.

And the Adam and Eve response was simply an attempt to lighten the tone here, as nosophist points out.

Maybe you might try to lighten up a little bit yourself, fanofvan...


The teachings are just "words on a page" are they? You think accuracy of representation and study of the "words on a page" are "brow beating"? You think the teachings on anxiety and faith assurance facts that have to "be translated" into truth, and the teachings then on faith and assurance and the immaturity and need to abandon anxiety requires translation?

By the way, I am very calm and in good humor...light as a feather!! But thanks for the advice. Reversion and humor and not taking one's self too seriously are always good advice!! And most welcome. I am most grateful for the opinions of Stephen and others here which leads to such a robust examination of the Revelation and a greater understanding of such important concepts as uncertainty, anxiety, faith, and assurance.

:biggrin:

Remember the malarkey began when Stephen falsely claimed that anxiety was healthy and that uncertainty and anxiety were the same thing. But one is a cause (uncertainty) and one is a potential effect (anxiety). He also claimed that anxiety was desirable and healthy. He then declared that mortals would someday and somehow outgrow uncertainty and only when uncertainties are eliminated will anxiety end. Again, false. He then insulted my own sense of assurance and secure confidence in God by personal faith and denied my own religious experience as invalid. Kat jumped in to further insult me and attempt to portray Stephen's false declarations and misrepresentations as factual and truthful...which they are not.

This is not complicated.

Let us remember that Stephen has his self declared doubts. Stephen lacks and disbelieves in assurance. He declares uncertainties are temporary (which defies and contradicts the very foundation and meaning of free will - free will inherently results in uncertainties of both choices and outcomes - who does not know this? This is kindergarten level basic philosophy and not peculiar or specific to the UB). And he believes that anxiety and fear are positive and healthy. He does not believe he has an Adjuster and that not all people do, contradicting the UB while claiming to believe it. And he is fearful doubtful about his very survival.

Stephen is not new here or to the UB. His hundreds of posts and dozens of topics posted here over the years is a long record of his disagreements with the UB and the conflicts of his own cherished beliefs which contradict the Papers. This latest edition of his disagreements and disbeliefs is nothing new...indeed, it is quite consistent...predictable even. Why should this student body be endlessly subjected to Stephen's fears, doubts, and prejudices....when those directly contradict the UB we are here to study? Very strange.



:roll: 8)


Last edited by fanofVan on Mon May 20, 2019 8:44 am +0000, edited 1 time in total.

Top
 Profile Send private message  
 
PostPosted:  
Offline
Moderator

Joined: Sat Dec 30, 2006 9:13 am +0000
Posts: 1039
Location: Denver CO
Quote:
The teachings are just "words on a page" are they? You think accuracy of representation and study of the "words on a page" are "brow beating"?


Yes, they are words on a page. I take very seriously the injunction of the revelators about fetishism, and I will not become like those who have made other sacred works into fetishes, where the chapter and verse is so revered as to completely destroy the underlying meaning of the work.

I love The Urantia Book. It's teachings have helped me to change my life for the better. for over thirty years now. I have read the words on the pages front to back. I read them still, every day. But like any truth, mere words mean nothing if not translated, internalized, and utilized through experience.

In my view, this is one of the functions of studying the revelation...not mere trading of texts, and strict adherence to chapter and verse - but sharing how the teachings are impacting each others' real lives. We don't all see things uniformly, but it is possible to unite here in spiritual purpose by sharing our experiences with those dear words on the page...bolstering each other, supporting each other, loving each other as we strive for spiritual progress.

Not everyone who doubts or struggles is insincere or evil. I suppose we are all evil in some strict sense of the word - we live in a world filled with evil - but not sinful. And yes, I think that parsing every comment and making an effort - as you seem so often to do - to acscribe evil intent to the poster, IS browbeating. Accuracy is one thing, but again - we are individuals here, not automatons.

Instead of assuming the worst about our fellows, I prefer to assume the best, and go from there.


Top
 Profile Send private message  
 
PostPosted:  
Offline
Moderator

Joined: Sat Dec 30, 2006 9:13 am +0000
Posts: 1039
Location: Denver CO
...and BTW...

Over the years of my own experience with The Urantia Book, I have come to see it - and describe it to others - as a revelation of INFORMATION. It is information that is being revealed to us about how reality works - how the universe works - how God works in our lives - who Jesus really is. One can take it or leave it. But if one decides to "take it" and use it, it can transform one's life.

I am a living witness to its transformational power!

I assume that people here have decided to take it, rather than leave it. And that's why we're here.


Top
 Profile Send private message  
 
PostPosted:  
Offline

Joined: Sun Mar 25, 2012 5:29 am +0000
Posts: 3955
maryjo606 wrote:
...and BTW...

Over the years of my own experience with The Urantia Book, I have come to see it - and describe it to others - as a revelation of INFORMATION. It is information that is being revealed to us about how reality works - how the universe works - how God works in our lives - who Jesus really is. One can take it or leave it. But if one decides to "take it" and use it, it can transform one's life.

I assume that people here have decided to take it, rather than leave it. And that's why we're here.


I think you assume too much...especially regarding Stephen. But many others have come here only to sow fear and doubt and discord. The one you defend here now has certainly not "decided to take it" Maryjo.

This is the same mind who declares here that Lucifer was doing God's will...and despite your ill advised rebuke to me, Stephen did very specifically defend Lucifer again and not so subtly in this topic as well. You overlook a lot for Stephen's benefit. And you claim that all his prior words are without meaning and value...and yet he has been quite consistent for years here now in his opinions and beliefs and misrepresentations and contradictions. If there were no wolves in sheep's clothing, there would be no warning given for that which does not exist.

Not everyone who attends here is sincere....or a student either one. As a mod here, you might wish to consider that reality, fact, and truth. Your predecessors spent much time dealing with that reality...and with Stephen who has more locked threads than all other posters combined I believe. Hmmmmm…...wonder why?

Just sayin'.....


Top
 Profile Send private message  
 
PostPosted:  
Offline

Joined: Wed Feb 20, 2019 12:11 pm +0000
Posts: 932
fanofVan wrote:
The teachings are just "words on a page" are they?


Yes, that is correct. The words on the page are just that until they are given meaning by mind ministry. And that is exactly what Maryjo was saying, as have I said several other times on this forum. Words are data that must be translated by mind and given meaning. Each truth-seeker will glean his/her own meaning. You have yours, I have mine and Stephen has his. This is precisely what Jesus was referring to when he chastised the apostles for attempting to all "see alike," "feel alike" or "think alike". Here is the reference for your perusal:

(1591.6) 141:5.1 One of the most eventful of all the evening conferences at Amathus was the session having to do with the discussion of spiritual unity. James Zebedee had asked, “Master, how shall we learn to see alike and thereby enjoy more harmony among ourselves?” When Jesus heard this question, he was stirred within his spirit, so much so that he replied: “James, James, when did I teach you that you should all see alike? I have come into the world to proclaim spiritual liberty to the end that mortals may be empowered to live individual lives of originality and freedom before God. I do not desire that social harmony and fraternal peace shall be purchased by the sacrifice of free personality and spiritual originality. What I require of you, my apostles, is spirit unity — and that you can experience in the joy of your united dedication to the wholehearted doing of the will of my Father in heaven. You do not have to see alike or feel alike or even think alike in order spiritually to be alike. Spiritual unity is derived from the consciousness that each of you is indwelt, and increasingly dominated, by the spirit gift of the heavenly Father. Your apostolic harmony must grow out of the fact that the spirit hope of each of you is identical in origin, nature, and destiny.

fanofVan wrote:
You think accuracy of representation and study of the "words on a page" are "brow beating"?


Yes I do. Accuracy according to who Bradly? Flexibility for personal interpretation of meaning must be provided for what is described in the above reference as "spiritual originality" and "spiritual freedom". Pulpit-pounding preachers who demand strict obedience to the "letter of the law" are what you find in churches. This forum is not a church.

fanofVan wrote:
You think the teachings on anxiety and faith assurance facts that have to "be translated" into truth, and the teachings then on faith and assurance and the immaturity and need to abandon anxiety requires translation?


First of all your sentence makes no sense to me so I can't say for certainty that I have translated or interpreted what you said accurately. That being said, every person reading the Revelation will interpret facts differently according to their personal experience with truth. Facts are supposed to be integrated and correlated with truth with the help of philosophy (wisdom), as is so eloquently explained in Paper 16, Section 6. Each individual has a their own unique relationship with wisdom ministry, and hence the ability to correlate, integrate and coordinate factual reality with truth will differ, and sometimes profoundly. Just because a person's interpretation of facts differs from yours does not give you liberty to attack or disparage them or their ideas. You are, of course, absolutely free to disagree and offer your own interpretation, but no one is obliged to accept your interpretation as gospel.

fanofVan wrote:
By the way, I am very calm and in good humor. I am most grateful for the opinions of Stephen and others here which leads to such a robust examination of the Revelation and a greater understanding of such important concepts as uncertainty, anxiety, faith, and assurance.


You fooled me! I see a very irritated person. The Revelation gives us advice on what to do with petty irritations:

(1098.1) 100:4.4 In physical life the senses tell of the existence of things; mind discovers the reality of meanings; but the spiritual experience reveals to the individual the true values of life. These high levels of human living are attained in the supreme love of God and in the unselfish love of man. If you love your fellow men, you must have discovered their values. Jesus loved men so much because he placed such a high value upon them. You can best discover values in your associates by discovering their motivation. If someone irritates you, causes feelings of resentment, you should sympathetically seek to discern his viewpoint, his reasons for such objectionable conduct. If once you understand your neighbor, you will become tolerant, and this tolerance will grow into friendship and ripen into love.

Oh! and as a bonus they explain that physical facts are perceived by the senses, then mind discovers the reality of their meanings, and finally it takes spiritual experience to reveal true values. Facts (thing); Wisdom (meaning); Truth (value) – all explained in detail in Paper 16 Section 6.

(192.6) 16:6.10 Stated otherwise, the recognition of the reality of these three manifestations of the Infinite is by a cosmic technique of self-revelation. Matter-energy is recognized by the mathematical logic of the senses; mind-reason intuitively knows its moral duty; spirit-faith (worship) is the religion of the reality of spiritual experience. These three basic factors in reflective thinking may be unified and co-ordinated in personality development, or they may become disproportionate and virtually unrelated in their respective functions. But when they become unified, they produce a strong character consisting in the correlation of a factual science, a moral philosophy, and a genuine religious experience. And it is these three cosmic intuitions that give objective validity, reality, to man’s experience in and with things, meanings, and values.


Top
 Profile Send private message  
 
PostPosted:  
Offline

Joined: Wed Feb 20, 2019 12:11 pm +0000
Posts: 932
fanofVan wrote:
...and with Stephen who has more locked threads than all other posters combined I believe. Hmmmmm…...wonder why?


Could it be because you keep fighting and arguing with him? and that makes it very, very uncomfortable for the readers?


Top
 Profile Send private message  
 
PostPosted:  
Offline

Joined: Wed Feb 20, 2019 12:11 pm +0000
Posts: 932
maryjo606 wrote:
...and BTW...

Over the years of my own experience with The Urantia Book, I have come to see it - and describe it to others - as a revelation of INFORMATION. It is information that is being revealed to us about how reality works - how the universe works - how God works in our lives - who Jesus really is. One can take it or leave it. But if one decides to "take it" and use it, it can transform one's life.

I am a living witness to its transformational power!

I assume that people here have decided to take it, rather than leave it. And that's why we're here.


Amen sister!


Top
 Profile Send private message  
 
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic This topic is locked, you cannot edit posts or make further replies.  [ 360 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1 ... 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15 ... 24  Next

All times are UTC - 7 hours


Who is online

Registered users: No registered users


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You can post attachments in this forum

Search for:
Jump to:  
cron
Powered by phpBB® Forum Software © phpBB Group