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The present status of the rebellion is not revealed to us by the Celestials. We are told the status has remained unchanged up to the year 1900. Let us fast forward to our present time, 2018. It is not beyond the realm of possibility more Celestials have converted to Lucifer's belief and continue to do so *See below*

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53:9.5 (611.4) Since Michael’s final bestowal no one in all Satania has desired to go to the prison worlds to minister to the interned rebels. And no more beings have been won to the deceiver’s cause. For nineteen hundred years the status has been unchanged.


Based on the plight of our world, Urantia, I venture to say there is a high likelihood more Celestials have and continue to subscribe to Lucifer's manifesto, post 1900. So I think it begs the question, if more Celestials are, in fact, being won over by sophistry, will Urantia ever be reinstated into the system circuits? Will Urantia become or has it already become a makeshift prison planet analogous to transitional world #7?

Here is an admission by a celestial that is even more telling:

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53:9.7 (611.6) ... We await the flashing broadcast that will deprive these traitors of personality existence. We anticipate the verdict of Uversa will be announced by the executionary broadcast which will effect the annihilation of these interned rebels.


So the above is not a guaranteed event. It is an anticipated event.

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Our system is under quarantine to limit the spread of sophistry/ rebellion. But we are told that our planet WILL be restored to the Satania circuits and be 'restored to the spiritual communion of the realms".

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46:8.2 (529.1) When Satania can return to the constellation fold, then will come up for consideration the readmission of the isolated worlds into the system family of inhabited planets, accompanied by their restoration to the spiritual communion of the realms. But even if Urantia were restored to the system circuits, you would still be embarrassed by the fact that your whole system rests under a Norlatiadek quarantine partially segregating it from all other systems.

46:8.3 (529.2) But ere long, the adjudication of Lucifer and his associates will restore the Satania system to the Norlatiadek constellation, and subsequently, Urantia and the other isolated spheres will be restored to the Satania circuits, and again will such worlds enjoy the privileges of interplanetary communication and intersystem communion.

46:8.4 (529.3) There will come an end for rebels and rebellion. The Supreme Rulers are merciful and patient, but the law of deliberately nourished evil is universally and unerringly executed. “The wages of sin is death”—eternal obliteration.


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The assured occurrence of the event in revelation you quote is qualified by certain conditions. For example, Lucifer must be adjudicated *see below*

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46:8.3 (529.2) But ere long, the adjudication of Lucifer and his associates will restore the Satania system to the Norlatiadek constellation...


And another qualifier is demonstrated in the syntax. Observe:

Quote:
46:8.2 (529.1) When Satania can return to the constellation fold


The word "can" signifies an ability, and it is conditioned by time: "when." It means at such a time that Satania meets certain criteria, then it "can" return to the constellation fold. Thus, Urantia is guaranteed re-admittance or "will" be readmitted; but this re-admittance is had ONLY if certain conditions are met, conditions that are enumerated in the revelations, one of which is "ADJUDICATION."

Question: Will Lucifer be adjudicated? The Celestials anticipate this event, but they do not guarantee it based on the syntax of revelation 53.9,7.


Agon D. Onter wrote:
Our system is under quarantine to limit the spread of sophistry/ rebellion. But we are told that our planet WILL be restored to the Satania circuits and be 'restored to the spiritual communion of the realms".

Quote:
46:8.2 (529.1) When Satania can return to the constellation fold, then will come up for consideration the readmission of the isolated worlds into the system family of inhabited planets, accompanied by their restoration to the spiritual communion of the realms. But even if Urantia were restored to the system circuits, you would still be embarrassed by the fact that your whole system rests under a Norlatiadek quarantine partially segregating it from all other systems.

46:8.3 (529.2) But ere long, the adjudication of Lucifer and his associates will restore the Satania system to the Norlatiadek constellation, and subsequently, Urantia and the other isolated spheres will be restored to the Satania circuits, and again will such worlds enjoy the privileges of interplanetary communication and intersystem communion.

46:8.4 (529.3) There will come an end for rebels and rebellion. The Supreme Rulers are merciful and patient, but the law of deliberately nourished evil is universally and unerringly executed. “The wages of sin is death”—eternal obliteration.

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Try the syntax found in this TUB quote:

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67:4.7 (758.5) The vast majority of all human and superhuman beings who were victims of the Lucifer rebellion on Jerusem and the various misled planets have long since heartily repented of their folly; and we truly believe that all such sincere penitents will in some manner be rehabilitated and restored to some phase of universe service when the Ancients of Days finally complete the adjudication of the affairs of the Satania rebellion, which they have so recently begun.


BB, you seem almost eager to find evidence that the Lucifer Rebellion will result in unfairness or error. Strange .....

Anyway, after reading TUB multiple times cover to cover, I have no such inclinations - only faith that justice will be served; but on God's timeline, not my own.


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Enough with trying to find out a person's motive, already, geez. smdh. I had to go through that with someone else. Ad hominems are corny, bros. So, please, leave the personal stuff out the discussion. If you cannot handle the discussion then don't participate, is my advice.

Anyway. I fail to see the point of you posting this. Adjudication is dependent on Ancient of Days making that verdict. They have not made any decision yet. So, again, the Celestials ANTICIPATE IT. As long as there are rebels roaming the system, there won't be adjudication. This is why I raised the question, post 1900, are there rebels being churned out the system?

Perhaps you should synthesize the revelations to make it make sense. You seem to ignore the ones I posted.

Agon D. Onter wrote:
Try the syntax found in this TUB quote:

Quote:
67:4.7 (758.5) The vast majority of all human and superhuman beings who were victims of the Lucifer rebellion on Jerusem and the various misled planets have long since heartily repented of their folly; and we truly believe that all such sincere penitents will in some manner be rehabilitated and restored to some phase of universe service when the Ancients of Days finally complete the adjudication of the affairs of the Satania rebellion, which they have so recently begun.


BB, you seem almost eager to find evidence that the Lucifer Rebellion will result in unfairness or error. Strange .....

Anyway, after reading TUB multiple times cover to cover, I have no such inclinations - only faith that justice will be served; but on God's timeline, not my own.



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brooklyn_born wrote:
Enough with trying to find out a person's motive, already, geez. smdh.



Why not? Jesus did so.

Quote:
152:5.3 (1704.2) “How long shall I bear with you? Are you all slow of spiritual comprehension and deficient in living faith? All these months have I taught you the truths of the kingdom, and yet are you dominated by material motives instead of spiritual considerations. Have you not even read in the Scriptures where Moses exhorted the unbelieving children of Israel, saying: ‘Fear not, stand still and see the salvation of the Lord’? Said the singer: ‘Put your trust in the Lord.’ ‘Be patient, wait upon the Lord and be of good courage. He shall strengthen your heart.’ ‘Cast your burden on the Lord, and he shall sustain you. Trust him at all times and pour out your heart to him, for God is your refuge.’ ‘He who dwells in the secret place of the Most High shall abide under the shadow of the Almighty.’ ‘It is better to trust the Lord than to put confidence in human princes.’


We are taught that understanding our neighbor's motives is a way of learning to truly love them.

Quote:
100:4.6 (1098.3) You cannot truly love your fellows by a mere act of the will. Love is only born of thoroughgoing understanding of your neighbor’s motives and sentiments. It is not so important to love all men today as it is that each day you learn to love one more human being. If each day or each week you achieve an understanding of one more of your fellows, and if this is the limit of your ability, then you are certainly socializing and truly spiritualizing your personality. Love is infectious, and when human devotion is intelligent and wise, love is more catching than hate. But only genuine and unselfish love is truly contagious. If each mortal could only become a focus of dynamic affection, this benign virus of love would soon pervade the sentimental emotion-stream of humanity to such an extent that all civilization would be encompassed by love, and that would be the realization of the brotherhood of man.


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Dude, seriously, it is TOS violation. I have been tolerating it from you because you don't do it often, but I do have my limits. Let us just abide by TOS and have some really neat and constructive discussions on TUB.

:|

Agon D. Onter wrote:
brooklyn_born wrote:
Enough with trying to find out a person's motive, already, geez. smdh.



Why not? Jesus did so.

Quote:
152:5.3 (1704.2) “How long shall I bear with you? Are you all slow of spiritual comprehension and deficient in living faith? All these months have I taught you the truths of the kingdom, and yet are you dominated by material motives instead of spiritual considerations. Have you not even read in the Scriptures where Moses exhorted the unbelieving children of Israel, saying: ‘Fear not, stand still and see the salvation of the Lord’? Said the singer: ‘Put your trust in the Lord.’ ‘Be patient, wait upon the Lord and be of good courage. He shall strengthen your heart.’ ‘Cast your burden on the Lord, and he shall sustain you. Trust him at all times and pour out your heart to him, for God is your refuge.’ ‘He who dwells in the secret place of the Most High shall abide under the shadow of the Almighty.’ ‘It is better to trust the Lord than to put confidence in human princes.’


We are taught that understanding our neighbor's motives is a way of learning to truly love them.

Quote:
100:4.6 (1098.3) You cannot truly love your fellows by a mere act of the will. Love is only born of thoroughgoing understanding of your neighbor’s motives and sentiments. It is not so important to love all men today as it is that each day you learn to love one more human being. If each day or each week you achieve an understanding of one more of your fellows, and if this is the limit of your ability, then you are certainly socializing and truly spiritualizing your personality. Love is infectious, and when human devotion is intelligent and wise, love is more catching than hate. But only genuine and unselfish love is truly contagious. If each mortal could only become a focus of dynamic affection, this benign virus of love would soon pervade the sentimental emotion-stream of humanity to such an extent that all civilization would be encompassed by love, and that would be the realization of the brotherhood of man.

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Dude,
I agree with you that TUB does not spell out with absolute certainty the details of the adjudication of Lucifer; nor does it provide a timeline that relates to our own system of time, with which to measure the future course of events related to the rebellion.

So, IMO, in relation to the title of your post "Status of the Lucifer rebellion, post 1900" we may say 'unknown'.

As agondonters, we can believe without seeing, persevere when isolated, and triumph over insuperable difficulties even when alone. It's all good!


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What rebels "roaming the system"? Supposition and rhetorical claims are not evidence. And "why" is a perfectly credible inquiry until and unless someone has a motive or agenda they wish to conceal. And asking for motive is no violation and neither is it insulting...or name calling.

Motive and agenda are not irrelevant.

And I "anticipate" sunset this evening....with certainty.


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It is all good, my dude. There is nothing wrong with having faith that this rebellion will end soon. In fact, I hope it does!

Yes, the current status is unknown. My thing is, basing on current world and social events, at least to me, more angels are defecting. But that is just my speculation.

Agon D. Onter wrote:
Dude,
I agree with you that TUB does not spell out with absolute certainty the details of the adjudication of Lucifer; nor does it provide a timeline that relates to our own system of time, with which to measure the future course of events related to the rebellion.

So, IMO, in relation to the title of your post "Status of the Lucifer rebellion, post 1900" we may say 'unknown'.

As agondonters, we can believe without seeing, persevere when isolated, and triumph over insuperable difficulties even when alone. It's all good!

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That's an interesting perspective; I can certainly understand why our current world situations might make it seem so. But honestly, take a look at the conditions of our planet throughout history ... things have always been a mess! Slavery, civil war, nukes, Nixon, Rwanda genocide, other past genocides, the Holocaust, and so on and so on. Ours is a "troubled world"; and has been ever since the Rebellion and then even moreso after the Adam and Eve default.


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yea one thing for sure the original rebellion was the catalyst that threw us off course.

Agon D. Onter wrote:
That's an interesting perspective; I can certainly understand why our current world situations might make it seem so. But honestly, take a look at the conditions of our planet throughout history ... things have always been a mess! Slavery, civil war, nukes, Nixon, Rwanda genocide, other past genocides, the Holocaust, and so on and so on. Ours is a "troubled world"; and has been ever since the Rebellion and then even moreso after the Adam and Eve default.

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True. I feel like if our genetic makeup had been effectively and thoroughly upstepped by Adam and Eve, we would be better able to cope with the challenges we face - certainly socially and with respect to the overall population's mental- and physical-health.


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brooklyn_born wrote:
The assured occurrence of the event in revelation you quote is qualified by certain conditions. For example, Lucifer must be adjudicated *see below*

Quote:
46:8.3 (529.2) But ere long, the adjudication of Lucifer and his associates will restore the Satania system to the Norlatiadek constellation...


And another qualifier is demonstrated in the syntax. Observe:

Quote:
46:8.2 (529.1) When Satania can return to the constellation fold


The word "can" signifies an ability, and it is conditioned by time: "when." It means at such a time that Satania meets certain criteria, then it "can" return to the constellation fold. Thus, Urantia is guaranteed re-admittance or "will" be readmitted; but this re-admittance is had ONLY if certain conditions are met, conditions that are enumerated in the revelations, one of which is "ADJUDICATION."

Question: Will Lucifer be adjudicated? The Celestials anticipate this event, but they do not guarantee it based on the syntax of revelation 53.9,7.


Agon D. Onter wrote:
Our system is under quarantine to limit the spread of sophistry/ rebellion. But we are told that our planet WILL be restored to the Satania circuits and be 'restored to the spiritual communion of the realms".

Quote:
46:8.2 (529.1) When Satania can return to the constellation fold, then will come up for consideration the readmission of the isolated worlds into the system family of inhabited planets, accompanied by their restoration to the spiritual communion of the realms. But even if Urantia were restored to the system circuits, you would still be embarrassed by the fact that your whole system rests under a Norlatiadek quarantine partially segregating it from all other systems.

46:8.3 (529.2) But ere long, the adjudication of Lucifer and his associates will restore the Satania system to the Norlatiadek constellation, and subsequently, Urantia and the other isolated spheres will be restored to the Satania circuits, and again will such worlds enjoy the privileges of interplanetary communication and intersystem communion.

46:8.4 (529.3) There will come an end for rebels and rebellion. The Supreme Rulers are merciful and patient, but the law of deliberately nourished evil is universally and unerringly executed. “The wages of sin is death”—eternal obliteration.



I am unsure why BB is so uncertain as to the status of the Rebellion or the certainty of its outcome. Or his apparent confusions about the effectiveness of our planetary rulers and administrators in their response to both the rebellion and default and their success in overcoming any and all obstacles and challenges!! All worlds require adjustments, fine tuning, and other forms of Plan B in their evolutionary development. What's all the worry and doubt all about?

There are no rebels, original or not, old or new...roaming about....save but one or two we know on Urantia. Any angel or other being who was foolish enough to NOW join would also face immediate internment per Michael's petition and the Ancient's decree. And the syntax claim is a simple inability to understand sentence structure...what's "anticipated" is the form of the announcement....not the contents....that is certain as confirmed in multiple other quotes.

9. Present Status of the Rebellion

53:9.1 (610.6) Early in the days of the Lucifer rebellion, salvation was offered all rebels by Michael. To all who would show proof of sincere repentance, he offered, upon his attainment of complete universe sovereignty, forgiveness and reinstatement in some form of universe service. None of the leaders accepted this merciful proffer. But thousands of the angels and the lower orders of celestial beings, including hundreds of the Material Sons and Daughters, accepted the mercy proclaimed by the Panoptians and were given rehabilitation at the time of Jesus’ resurrection nineteen hundred years ago. These beings have since been transferred to the Father’s world of Jerusem, where they must be held, technically, until the Uversa courts hand down a decision in the matter of Gabriel vs. Lucifer. But no one doubts that, when the annihilation verdict is issued, these repentant and salvaged personalities will be exempted from the decree of extinction. These probationary souls now labor with the Panoptians in the work of caring for the Father’s world.

53:9.2 (611.1) The archdeceiver has never been on Urantia since the days when he sought to turn back Michael from the purpose to complete the bestowal and to establish himself finally and securely as the unqualified ruler of Nebadon. Upon Michael’s becoming the settled head of the universe of Nebadon, Lucifer was taken into custody by the agents of the Uversa Ancients of Days and has since been a prisoner on satellite number one of the Father’s group of the transition spheres of Jerusem. And here the rulers of other worlds and systems behold the end of the unfaithful Sovereign of Satania. Paul knew of the status of these rebellious leaders following Michael’s bestowal, for he wrote of Caligastia’s chiefs as “spiritual hosts of wickedness in the heavenly places.”

53:9.3 (611.2) Michael, upon assuming the supreme sovereignty of Nebadon, petitioned the Ancients of Days for authority to intern all personalities concerned in the Lucifer rebellion pending the rulings of the superuniverse tribunals in the case of Gabriel vs. Lucifer, placed on the records of the Uversa supreme court almost two hundred thousand years ago, as you reckon time. Concerning the system capital group, the Ancients of Days granted the Michael petition with but a single exception: Satan was allowed to make periodic visits to the apostate princes on the fallen worlds until another Son of God should be accepted by such apostate worlds, or until such time as the courts of Uversa should begin the adjudication of the case of Gabriel vs. Lucifer.

53:9.4 (611.3) Satan could come to Urantia because you had no Son of standing in residence—neither Planetary Prince nor Material Son. Machiventa Melchizedek has since been proclaimed vicegerent Planetary Prince of Urantia, and the opening of the case of Gabriel vs. Lucifer has signalized the inauguration of temporary planetary regimes on all the isolated worlds. It is true that Satan did periodically visit Caligastia and others of the fallen princes right up to the time of the presentation of these revelations, when there occurred the first hearing of Gabriel’s plea for the annihilation of the archrebels. Satan is now unqualifiedly detained on the Jerusem prison worlds.

53:9.5 (611.4) Since Michael’s final bestowal no one in all Satania has desired to go to the prison worlds to minister to the interned rebels. And no more beings have been won to the deceiver’s cause. For nineteen hundred years the status has been unchanged.

53:9.6 (611.5) We do not look for a removal of the present Satania restrictions until the Ancients of Days make final disposition of the archrebels. The system circuits will not be reinstated so long as Lucifer lives. Meantime, he is wholly inactive.

53:9.7 (611.6) The rebellion has ended on Jerusem. It ends on the fallen worlds as fast as divine Sons arrive. We believe that all rebels who will ever accept mercy have done so. We await the flashing broadcast that will deprive these traitors of personality existence. We anticipate the verdict of Uversa will be announced by the executionary broadcast which will effect the annihilation of these interned rebels. Then will you look for their places, but they shall not be found. “And they who know you among the worlds will be astonished at you; you have been a terror, but never shall you be any more.” And thus shall all of these unworthy traitors “become as though they had not been.” All await the Uversa decree.

53:9.8 (611.7) But for ages the seven prison worlds of spiritual darkness in Satania have constituted a solemn warning to all Nebadon, eloquently and effectively proclaiming the great truth “that the way of the transgressor is hard”; “that within every sin is concealed the seed of its own destruction”; that “the wages of sin is death.”




So far, we have unsubstantiated suspicions and suppositions and contradictions related to the rebellion....IMO. Regardless of motive or agenda.


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Pardon me fanofVan for interjecting here again without the text, but isn't there a part that mentions how the angels, at the dawn of Lucifer's grasp for power, could simply not fathom how such an exquisite Son of God (Lanonandek) could falter? Brooklyn if this is true, then the initial tide of angelic rebellion would represent a change from a single event. After this, is the civil defence, the learning from the mistakes, and in the creation of new orders of angeln, by the Divine Minister, would possess certain immunities, beyond some education they may receive before advancing the votives of the Infinite Spirit abroad in Nebadon.

So I think you are alluding to, really the sociological dissonance which inhibits mankind's ability to work, to have asmuch opportunity to interharmonize, with angeln. suicide rates might increase because that particular individual has cut off all psychic interactions with the psychic spheres. How do we enhance angelic interaction I am only suggesting first correct the pathology in the human individuals' spiritual receptivity, thusby increasing the potency of the cosmic mind adjutants' phisiological function.

I would say, in the increasing orders of life what may be true about the angeln would have to also apply to the higher nature of mature indviduals. In the same way that the Urantia Papers mention that angeln share the higher range of emotions with mankind. Do you think that as mankind suffers, so too the seraphic planetary government, or summation of all supervising and visiting angeln, might suffer? I am not questioning your motive Brooklyn of course I am simply trying to place your theory into a reasonable mental frame with which I relate.

Angeln have their own dilemma we could hardly fathom. They might not be so affected by the Lucifer rebellion, as they are plagued by the mental stagnance, the monotyny of solidified institutions. We may indeed be the ones causing them to suffer, and I can hope that some presiding angeln will remind me of my failings, with a brutal honesty which is often difficult to bear.

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