Jim says above: "My attempt in these endeavors is to seek reality by recognition of value rather than by understanding of meaning. Spiritual reveals value while intellectual only reveals meaning."
Interesting. I wonder why one might think you even can seek or find or know reality by "recognition of value rather than by understanding of meaning"? Can these be separated somehow? Is there value without meanings? Isn't reality an integration and harmonization of fact, meaning, and value?
Mind is the source of meaning and who is the source of mind? The Third Source and Center, the Infinite Spirit, the Conjoint Actor, AND God the Spirit - all names for the same Deity/Personality of the Paradise Trinity (see Paper 9 & 10).
One who seeks meanings does not forsake values. And the one who seeks values cannot forsake meanings and actually discover value either.
9:0.4 [Part I]
Throughout the universes the agencies of the Conjoint Actor ceaselessly manipulate the forces and energies of all space. Like the First Source and Center, the Third is responsive to both the spiritual and the material. The Conjoint Actor is the revelation of the unity of God, in whom all things consist — things, meanings, and values; energies, minds, and spirits.
9:1.4 [Part I]
The Universal Father presides over the realms of pre-energy, prespirit, and personality; the Eternal Son dominates the spheres of spiritual activities; the presence of the Isle of Paradise unifies the domain of physical energy and materializing power; the Conjoint Actor operates not only as an infinite spirit representing the Son but also as a universal manipulator of the forces and energies of Paradise, thus bringing into existence the universal and absolute mind. The Conjoint Actor functions throughout the grand universe as a positive and distinct personality, especially in the higher spheres of spiritual values, physical-energy relationships, and true mind meanings.
He functions specifically wherever and whenever energy and spirit associate and interact; he dominates all reactions with mind, wields great power in the spiritual world, and exerts a mighty influence over energy and matter. At all times the Third Source is expressive of the nature of the First Source and Center.
9:4.6 [Part I]Mind transmutes the values of spirit into the meanings of intellect; volition has power to bring the meanings of mind to fruit in both the material and spiritual domains. The Paradise ascent involves a relative and differential growth in spirit, mind, and energy. The personality is the unifier of these components of experiential individuality.
Me here: Indeed, the attempt to unravel these 3 elements of personalized experience is to weaken the results and to defy unity and harmony and balance and integration - the very goal and task of reality and experiential wisdom. To seek one over the others is irrational we are told. It is to choose mono-vision or a one-eyed perspective of reality over the more powerful and real stereoscopic vision available to us.
16:6.10 [Part I]
In the local universe mind bestowals, these three insights of the cosmic mind constitute the a priori assumptions which make it possible for man to function as a rational and self-conscious personality
in the realms of science, philosophy, and religion. Stated otherwise, the recognition of the reality of these three manifestations of the Infinite is by a cosmic technique of self-revelation. Matter-energy is recognized by the mathematical logic of the senses; mind-reason intuitively knows its moral duty; spirit-faith (worship) is the religion of the reality of spiritual experience. These three basic factors in reflective thinking
may be unified and co-ordinated in personality development, or they may become disproportionate and virtually unrelated in their respective functions. But when they become unified, they produce a strong character consisting in the correlation of a factual science, a moral philosophy, and a genuine religious experience. And it is these three cosmic intuitions that give objective validity, reality, to man's experience in and with things, meanings, and values.
16:7.8 [Part I]Man's moral nature would be impotent without the art of measurement, the discrimination embodied in his ability to scrutinize meanings.
Likewise would moral choosing be futile without that cosmic insight which yields the consciousness of spiritual values. From the standpoint of intelligence, man ascends to the level of a moral being because he is endowed with personality.
100:1.7 [Part III]
Religion cannot be bestowed, received, loaned, learned, or lost. It is a personal experience which grows proportionally to the growing quest for final values. Cosmic growth thus attends on the accumulation of meanings and the ever-expanding elevation of values.
But nobility itself is always an unconscious growth.
100:1.8 [Part III]
Religious habits of thinking and acting are contributory to the economy of spiritual growth. One can develop religious predispositions toward favorable reaction to spiritual stimuli, a sort of conditioned spiritual reflex. Habits which favor religious growth embrace cultivated sensitivity to divine values, recognition of religious living in others, reflective meditation on cosmic meanings, worshipful problem solving, sharing one's spiritual life with one's fellows, avoidance of selfishness, refusal to presume on divine mercy, living as in the presence of God.
The factors of religious growth may be intentional, but the growth itself is unvaryingly unconscious.
100:2.2 [Part III]Spiritual growth is first an awakening to needs, next a discernment of meanings, and then a discovery of values.
The evidence of true spiritual development consists in the exhibition of a human personality motivated by love, activated by unselfish ministry, and dominated by the wholehearted worship of the perfection ideals of divinity. And this entire experience constitutes the reality of religion as contrasted with mere theological beliefs.
Me here: Indeed...we may NOT discover values without discerning meanings....first.
This is the problem with SEla's "theory"....it ignores facts and their meanings to propose and perpetuate a fantasy without meaning OR value related to the reality presented in the UB!! It is unreal and unrelated to reality as presented in the UB and attempts to ignore facts and meanings well established by the UB. Again...it is fine to believe whatever you will and create fantasies in support of and which articulate one's beliefs....but we gather here to study a specific source and discover a well articulated set of knowledge, meanings, and values....not personal fantasies which defy and contradict the source and set of what we share here.
This is what the human mind does when it lacks knowledge and facts...it invents them. Just please also invent your own terms and concepts for your own definitions and fantasies rather than steal terms and concepts from the UB for misrepresentation and falsification to support such fantasies of invention....there is no value without meanings....and the terms chosen by SEla already have specific and well defined meanings. There is no meaning or value in such a fantasy here. Thanks anyway.
We study here that which claims to be given to us to eliminate confusions and errors of knowledge and fact to better discover true meanings and values. One does not need to believe the claims made but it is grave error to purposely distort and defy the facts presented (which can ONLY create confusion and promote error) when at a site which exists for the express purpose of the STUDY of those facts, meanings, and values.
And there is no value without meanings either. Just sayin'......