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Yes, such thought is deemed racist, but I look at it like this: For thousands of years, the prevailing thought was much different, in the opposite way. Real racism was a fact of life. Still is in a lot of places. So the natural tendency is to overreach, to over-correct. Its like a pendulum, it swings in both directions. It just that there are so many pendulums and they are all swinging in every direction, so we are all over the map. Its crazy, but its also a lot of fun.
Me, I'm in that stage of the game where the thought Adjuster is called the Thought Controller, so maybe that's why it takes a lot to get me excited... I see all the bad, I acknowledge it. I don't ignore it, I actively fight it with the way I live my life. But then I let go.
I mean maybe North Korea is gonna nuke us before I go, who knows? That's some really bad $hit, much worse than dumping a few thousand more tons of coal pollution into the atmosphere. But is fretting about it going to make it stop? No! That's why I live my life as each moment was my last, loving and learning and never letting go, but then letting go completely to embrace whatever comes next. There is no point in grueling, and worrying about things. Even if it is that ol' rascal, the Devil, what are you gonna do about it? I'm not much into group positive vibes scaring off the boogie man, I'm more into personal religious experience showing me the way to God.
A very wise old guy once told me when I was a kid that life is like a wave. If you paddle too fast, the wave breaks on top of your head. If you paddle too slow, you miss the wave. You've got to paddle just right to make the drop then ride it for all its worth.


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It would stand to reason that the situation with N. Korea would be supervised by The Most Highs. And perhaps the U.S. administration is really on top of it providing the necessary technical safeguards even to the point of dismantling any threat seconds after such threat is called into play. Something very powerful must actually be in place to give the U.S. president the supreme confidence to declare: "It's not going to happen".

I've mentioned it before, it has been documented that U.S. and Soviet missile silos have been systematically temporarily put out of operation by invisible forces. The reason that was done may be either a dress rehearsal or a message or both.

Important N. Korean defectors declare that that regime's days are numbered. They feel that it will collapse under its own weight soon.


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the abnormal and unsalvable are described in the previous paragraph and elsewhere in the papers as the feeble-minded "idiots" unable to make normal choices and incapable of knowing and worshiping god...when even a UB reader can't get that right and instead twists the words out of context to fit a political agenda it's very clear that the world at large is not ready for these ideas.

better to start work on the failings of this presupposition:

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Representative government presupposes an intelligent, efficient, and universal electorate.


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Makalu wrote:
when even a UB reader can't get that right and instead twists the words out of context to fit a political agenda it's very clear that the world at large is not ready for these ideas.



alwilliams767 wrote:
Yes, Trump is leading the charge backwards.


Makalu wrote:
...it's fueled by the same attitudes and platitudes spewed on right-wing talk radio for decades...it's good for making money and getting votes but it's not an effective problem solver for the economic issues at hand.



I agree, but you failed to mention the "inferior mortals", the "socially unfit" and the "morally degenerate" strains of evolving humanity.

nodAmanaV wrote:
(52:2.12) It is neither tenderness nor altruism to bestow futile sympathy upon degenerated human beings, unsalvable abnormal and inferior mortals. There exist on even the most normal of the evolutionary worlds sufficient differences between individuals and between numerous social groups to provide for the full exercise of all those noble traits of altruistic sentiment and unselfish mortal ministry without perpetuating the socially unfit and the morally degenerate strains of evolving humanity. There is abundant opportunity for the exercise of tolerance and the function of altruism in behalf of those unfortunate and needy individuals who have not irretrievably lost their moral heritage and forever destroyed their spiritual birthright.



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toto wrote:
Makalu wrote:
when even a UB reader can't get that right and instead twists the words out of context to fit a political agenda it's very clear that the world at large is not ready for these ideas.



alwilliams767 wrote:
Yes, Trump is leading the charge backwards.


Makalu wrote:
...it's fueled by the same attitudes and platitudes spewed on right-wing talk radio for decades...it's good for making money and getting votes but it's not an effective problem solver for the economic issues at hand.



I agree, but you failed to mention the "inferior mortals", the "socially unfit" and the "morally degenerate" strains of evolving humanity.

(52:2.12) It is neither tenderness nor altruism to bestow futile sympathy upon degenerated human beings, unsalvable abnormal and inferior mortals. There exist on even the most normal of the evolutionary worlds sufficient differences between individuals and between numerous social groups to provide for the full exercise of all those noble traits of altruistic sentiment and unselfish mortal ministry without perpetuating the socially unfit and the morally degenerate strains of evolving humanity. There is abundant opportunity for the exercise of tolerance and the function of altruism in behalf of those unfortunate and needy individuals who have not irretrievably lost their moral heritage and forever destroyed their spiritual birthright.

[/quote]

Me here: you also say/ask above:

(52:2.12) It is neither tenderness nor altruism to bestow futile sympathy upon degenerated human beings, unsalvable abnormal and inferior mortals. There exist on even the most normal of the evolutionary worlds sufficient differences between individuals and between numerous social groups to provide for the full exercise of all those noble traits of altruistic sentiment and unselfish mortal ministry without perpetuating the socially unfit and the morally degenerate strains of evolving humanity. There is abundant opportunity for the exercise of tolerance and the function of altruism in behalf of those unfortunate and needy individuals who have not irretrievably lost their moral heritage and forever destroyed their spiritual birthright.



"I wonder just who is this fascist, right-wing Mighty Messenger who wrote paper 52.

"degenerated human beings"? Is he referring to 'bad hombres'?

"unsalvable abnormal and inferior mortals"? Is he referring to the likes of ISIS?

"perpetuating the socially unfit and the morally degenerate strains of evolving humanity"? Is he referring to 'sanctuary' cities?"

Me again: I must confess my confusion by such questions and personal opinions offered within the questions and any form of the perversions of racism or fascism related to anyone's understanding of the Papers.

This and related quotes have nothing whatsoever to do with anybody's race, color, culture, religion, language, intelligence, education, social strata, or immigration status. It has to do with those who lack empathy, sympathy, altruism, and are social predators and leeches whose own egos cannot be tamed by the Spirit nature. And I think it relates to those genetically defective people which wisdom and experience would cause society to reduce and prevent further breeding contributions to future generations, at least until science/medicine can provide genetic/cellular repairs and contributions to overcome certain inherited traits.

I don't find the politicalizations truthful or helpful regarding what's "going on in our world right now?" I agree that's what's going on has been going on for a million years so far and it will continue to go on throughout all the Mortal Epochs of evolutionary progress. Objectivity is simply too difficult for some who cannot recognize or overcome their personal, local, and recent bias. When I was growing up, we did drills in grade school rehearsing for the rain of ICBMs that were sure to come. JFK, RFK, MLK, black protesters of church ladies and ministers and students attacked on TV by dogs and beaten by police, college students shot down by the Guard, Viet Nam claiming poor boys, especially black ones, strange fruit still hanging in the South....the good ole days! No child could escape the great probabilities of early death, mayhem, and destruction....The Eve of Destruction was just one such theme song of the times. Shall we cast back to the Holocaust or the Great War to seek out glory days compared to today?

Those so focused on the patches of evil against the background of light are in danger of becoming the morally degenerate by letting fear and anxiety and personal superiority to overwhelm faith and trust.

To brooklynborn: I was happy to see your name here again but I am puzzled by your post. You said:

"Real life events will force many UB readers, specifically the rigid literalist and hardliners, to recalibrate their interpretation of the papers. Caligastia is very real and very powerful right now. Downplaying his effect and influence on human existence is a major mistake."



Me here: Lots to consider here. Your claim that literalists need to recalibrate their interpretation suggests that the authors did not mean what they wrote or did not write what they meant. That opinion must inevitably then mean that there are non-literal interpretations of the Papers which penetrate the words into another meaning. And of course this requires an interpreter or priest to tell us what the words written truly mean since they do not mean what they say. A peculiar surrender of the obvious for the mysterious and the superiority of some over others and the need for such ones by the rest of us. Very weird.

The second part of your claim demonstrate blame shifting from unwise and immature and self centered choices and the consequences inherent by such choices and surrenders the sovereignty of the person to the boogeyman "devil". The Papers clearly and redundantly say otherwise...but then only a literalist might think so. But worse than blaming the devil for the repercussions of error and sin, would be to blame the devil for the evil and sin as well as the consequences of evil. This shows a clear lack of faith and trust in our own individual inviolate free will and also a mistrust of the Most Highs and all who minister to this Shrine of Nebadon. But again, only a literalist might find such comfort and confidence in the words actually written in the Papers....otherwise any priest might convince us that we are in grave danger personally and the whole world.

Bleak. Grim. Sad. Sorry to hear it BB. But best wishes nonetheless.

Bradly


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socially unfit, morally degenerat etc are just some of the other adjectives that the UB uses, often all together, to describe the one group of subnormal minds


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Rather than getting the pendulum swinging too hard with the political agenda stuff, how about we stick to the agenda the revelators clearly wrote into what the Urantia Book says. Let's take a look and see how what it says, is relevant to what's really going on.


(71:2.17) 8. Universal suffrage. Representative government presupposes an intelligent, efficient, and universal electorate. The character of such a government will ever be determined by the character and caliber of those who compose it. As civilization progresses, suffrage, while remaining universal for both sexes, will be effectively modified, regrouped, and otherwise differentiated.

I'm sure we can agree that there's a problem if too many of the electorate, not to mention too many who represent the electorate, have "irretrievably lost their moral heritage and forever destroyed their spiritual birthright" and are like the walking dead. These kind of people should be subdued, and not "revered as fetish personalities".

(52:2.11) An idiot does not have much chance of survival in a primitive and warring tribal social organization. It is the false sentiment of your partially perfected civilizations that fosters, protects, and perpetuates the hopelessly defective strains of evolutionary human stocks.


Take the word racism as another example. Although the word racism is bantered about a lot these days, the term or idea isn't the same as it used to be, even recently. It has now evolved from the traditional "race, color, culture, religion, language, intelligence, education, social strata, or immigration status" thing, as you put it Bradly, into the idea that if anyone doesn't agree with this now well established way of thinking and supports another idea; for example, that perhaps when it comes to tolerance "overmuch sympathy and pity may degenerate into serious emotional instability" you are a racist.


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You are talking about "unfit individuals", where in reality the issue is whether information fits the narrative of the company in which you are conversing. Please stop bringing the conversation into issues of racial or class hatred.

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fanofVan wrote:
Me again: I must confess my confusion by such questions and personal opinions offered within the questions and any form of the perversions of racism or fascism related to anyone's understanding of the Papers.


As a student of the Papers you should suffer from lessening confusion, not more. All opinions are personal if one is a person. We must seek for the understanding of other's understanding of the Papers.


fanofVan wrote:
This and related quotes have nothing whatsoever to do with anybody's race, color, culture, religion, language, intelligence, education, social strata, or immigration status. It has to do with those who lack empathy, sympathy, altruism, and are social predators and leeches whose own egos cannot be tamed by the Spirit nature.


I respect your opinion on this but this begs the question; can a mental defective of the level of an "idiot" be educated or be considered intelligent or even achieve any acceptable level of social strata or linguistic ability? So what does this and related quotes mean exactly?


fanofVan wrote:
And I think it relates to those genetically defective people which wisdom and experience would cause society to reduce and prevent further breeding contributions to future generations, at least until science/medicine can provide genetic/cellular repairs and contributions to overcome certain inherited traits.


I would like your personal opinion on how you would define "genetically defective people". What would "cause society to reduce and prevent further breeding.."? Are you talking about the use of force?

Also, what do you think would include some of the inherited traits that should be overcome? Is such a list to be compiled by an individual or a committee?


fanofVan wrote:
I don't find the politicalizations truthful or helpful regarding what's "going on in our world right now?"


And yet you call for policies to cause society to act in some way. Do I understand you correctly?


fanofVan wrote:
Objectivity is simply too difficult for some who cannot recognize or overcome their personal, local, and recent bias.


Objectivity is impossible for the human mind. Even Jesus refused to judge. Lets get over this pipe dream of "objectivity".



fanofVan wrote:
When I was growing up, we did drills in grade school rehearsing for the rain of ICBMs that were sure to come. JFK, RFK, MLK, black protesters of church ladies and ministers and students attacked on TV by dogs and beaten by police, college students shot down by the Guard, Viet Nam claiming poor boys, especially black ones, strange fruit still hanging in the South....the good ole days! No child could escape the great probabilities of early death, mayhem, and destruction....The Eve of Destruction was just one such theme song of the times. Shall we cast back to the Holocaust or the Great War to seek out glory days compared to today?


I suggest you heed your own admonitions.

fanofVan wrote:
Those so focused on the patches of evil against the background of light are in danger of becoming the morally degenerate by letting fear and anxiety and personal superiority to overwhelm faith and trust.


What of the children of Aleppo or the carnage ongoing in the streets of our inner cities? Are these but tiny 'patches of evil'? Are not 'patches' worthy of our empathy and altruism?


fanofVan wrote:
This and related quotes have nothing whatsoever to do with anybody's race, color, culture, religion, language, intelligence, education, social strata, or immigration status. It has to do with those who lack empathy, sympathy, altruism, and are social predators and leeches whose own egos cannot be tamed by the Spirit nature.


fanofVan wrote:
And of course this requires an interpreter or priest to tell us what the words written truly mean since they do not mean what they say. A peculiar surrender of the obvious for the mysterious and the superiority of some over others and the need for such ones by the rest of us. Very weird.


And which would you wonder yourself to be, Bradly? An interpreter or a priest?


fanofVan wrote:
But again, only a literalist might find such comfort and confidence in the words actually written in the Papers....otherwise any priest might convince us that we are in grave danger personally and the whole world.


Brady, are you a literalist? If so, then why do you dole out interpretations of the Papers and give priestly advice?


fanofVan wrote:
Bleak. Grim. Sad. Sorry to hear it BB. But best wishes nonetheless.


Wow, do you have any trust in your brother BB?


Louis


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SEla_Kelly wrote:
You are talking about "unfit individuals", where in reality the issue is whether information fits the narrative of the company in which you are conversing. Please stop bringing the conversation into issues of racial or class hatred.

The reality of the issue is that I'm conversing with some who are turning what the Urantia Book says about unfit individuals into a conversation that fits their narrative that it's an issue of racial or class hatred.

Please stop bringing the conversation into the shadow of a hair's turning.


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This truthbook article about race in TUB is relevant and informative on this point. Race, as a differentiating factor among people on earth today really does not exist. So there is no point in emphasizing race when discussing the topic of "unfit, defective, degenerate, and antisocial stocks".

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Consider that there's probably not a person alive on the planet who doesn't have some blue ancestry (as well as some of each of the other colors) in their makeup — there's nothing exclusive to the so-called white race. There is no "black" race on Urantia, just as there are no other pure races. The indigo race, a deep purple hue appeared about 500, 000 years ago along with the other 5 colored races. Africans are of mixed racial heritage just like the rest of humanity, being a mixture primarily of the remnants of the indigo, orange, and green races.

There have been 9 pure-line races over the million year human history of the planet. None exist today — we're well on our way to full racial blending to fulfill the destiny of a one race world. Of the original 6 colored races can you point to one which The Urantia Book holds above the others? The answer is no. In fact The Urantia Book describes the attributes and shortcomings of each race as well as defining their superior and inferior traits. The only race to be given comparatively high marks is the red race which has nearly been obliterated.


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My position on the papers is that its authors are not here in their persons to dictate exactly what its words truly mean. So it is not a matter of what the authors mean, Brad (it's good to see you). I believe it is left to you and your TA to sort out its meaning, and that is a very personal and subjective undertaking. Further, I have pointed out a UB reference in the past demonstrating how celestials impose figurative meanings onto revelation (32:3.6). So there is precedence to show that an alternative approach to reading the UB is available and perfectly acceptable. But that is not an argument I endeavor to rehash.

I do believe real life events will force people to reinterpret UB words as reality should reflect the content of the papers and vice-versa. Otherwise, the book is a worthless work of fiction. The fact is, there are future events predicted in the papers that should come to pass. And if they do not, either revelation is patently false or the human interpretation is in error.

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brooklyn_born wrote:
My position on the papers is that its authors are not here in their persons to dictate exactly what its words truly mean. So it is not a matter of what the authors mean, Brad (it's good to see you). I believe it is left to you and your TA to sort out its meaning, and that is a very personal and subjective undertaking. Further, I have pointed out a UB reference in the past demonstrating how celestials impose figurative meanings onto revelation (32:3.6). So there is precedence to show that an alternative approach to reading the UB is available and perfectly acceptable. But that is not an argument I endeavor to rehash.

I do believe real life events will force people to reinterpret UB words as reality should reflect the content of the papers and vice-versa. Otherwise, the book is a worthless work of fiction. The fact is, there are future events predicted in the papers that should come to pass. And if they do not, either revelation is patently false or the human interpretation is in error.


Greetings BB!! It has been my experience that every new reading brings new discoveries of meaning based on "real life events" between readings; or so it so for those who incorporate the teachings....that's why I don't find any singularity in understanding or interpreting. To believe the book says what it says and means what it says (literalism) still does not deliver uniformity of understanding....so I agree it is up to each student to "sort out its meaning" by help with the TA and Spirit of Truth and reason and experience....with a good measure of trust, insight, and prayer!

32:3.6 (361.1) The farther down the scale of life we go, the more difficult it becomes to locate, with the eye of faith, the invisible Father. The lower creatures — and sometimes even the higher personalities — find it difficult always to envisage the Universal Father in his Creator Sons. And so, pending the time of their spiritual exaltation, when perfection of development will enable them to see God in person, they grow weary in progression, entertain spiritual doubts, stumble into confusion, and thus isolate themselves from the progressive spiritual aims of their time and universe. In this way they lose the ability to see the Father when beholding the Creator Son. The surest safeguard for the creature throughout the long struggle to attain the Father, during this time when inherent conditions make such attainment impossible, is tenaciously to hold on to the truth-fact of the Father’s presence in his Sons. Literally and figuratively, spiritually and personally, the Father and the Sons are one. It is a fact: He who has seen a Creator Son has seen the Father.

I'm still not getting the encouragement to read the text figuratively by this text....but oh well!! The authors claim the Papers to be factual and historically accurate and given to eliminate error and reduce confusion...so how does a metaphorical or figurative presentation help in such a stated objective?

The key to truth is through a grasp of meaning and value....so whatever contributes to that is a good thing. There is only one reality and a few gazillion perspectives of its limited appreciation. I'm glad to share your perspective anytime BB....I know you seek truth as much as myself or anyone else.

As to what's really going on in our world right now....still seems to be well described in the Paper on the Mortal Epochs with the uniqueness of our world's progress through the evolution of time....now with all spiritual endowments at work.....it seems brotherhood is the next most important transition to accomplish to reach another transformative epoch.....some see lots of signs of such and some see all the failures of such....depends on your point of view I guess. Half full? Half empty? It's always mystified me when the author says we're past the worst of materialism...80 years ago. Perplexing.

(578.1) 50:6.1 The isolation of Urantia renders it impossible to undertake the presentation of many details of the life and environment of your Satania neighbors. In these presentations we are limited by the planetary quarantine and by the system isolation. We must be guided by these restrictions in all our efforts to enlighten Urantia mortals, but in so far as is permissible, you have been instructed in the progress of an average evolutionary world, and you are able to compare such a world’s career with the present state of Urantia.

(578.2) 50:6.2 The development of civilization on Urantia has not differed so greatly from that of other worlds which have sustained the misfortune of spiritual isolation. But when compared with the loyal worlds of the universe, your planet seems most confused and greatly retarded in all phases of intellectual progress and spiritual attainment.

(578.3) 50:6.3 Because of your planetary misfortunes, Urantians are prevented from understanding very much about the culture of normal worlds. But you should not envisage the evolutionary worlds, even the most ideal, as spheres whereon life is a flowery bed of ease. The initial life of the mortal races is always attended by struggle. Effort and decision are an essential part of the acquirement of survival values.

(578.4) 50:6.4 Culture presupposes quality of mind; culture cannot be enhanced unless mind is elevated. Superior intellect will seek a noble culture and find some way to attain such a goal. Inferior minds will spurn the highest culture even when presented to them ready-made. Much depends, also, upon the successive missions of the divine Sons and upon the extent to which enlightenment is received by the ages of their respective dispensations.


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(578.1) 50:6.1 The isolation of Urantia renders it impossible to undertake the presentation of many details of the life and environment of your Satania neighbors. In these presentations we are limited by the planetary quarantine and by the system isolation. We must be guided by these restrictions in all our efforts to enlighten Urantia mortals, but in so far as is permissible, you have been instructed in the progress of an average evolutionary world, and you are able to compare such a world’s career with the present state of Urantia.


Interesting. Since the revelators do describe people on a neighboring planet then apparently that planet is also under quarantine and therefore it is permitted to give that information to us. It sure feels to me that we on the Earth are quickly approaching the types of issues the people of that planet have been dealing with.

72:1.1 (808.4) Notwithstanding all these planetary handicaps a very superior civilization is evolving on an isolated continent about the size of Australia. This nation numbers about 140 million. Its people are a mixed race, predominantly blue and yellow, having a slightly greater proportion of violet than the so-called white race of Urantia. These different races are not yet fully blended, but they fraternize and socialize very acceptably. The average length of life on this continent is now ninety years, fifteen per cent higher than that of any other people on the planet.

72:1.3 (808.6) These people are self-sustaining, that is, they can live indefinitely without importing anything from the surrounding nations. Their natural resources are replete, and by scientific techniques they have learned how to compensate for their deficiencies in the essentials of life. They enjoy a brisk domestic commerce but have little foreign trade owing to the universal hostility of their less progressive neighbors.

72:10.2 (818.5) These people are passing out of the negative into the positive era of law. Recently they have gone so far as to attempt the prevention of crime by sentencing those who are believed to be potential murderers and major criminals to life service in the detention colonies. If such convicts subsequently demonstrate that they have become more normal, they may be either paroled or pardoned. The homicide rate on this continent is only one per cent of that among the other nations.

72:11.4 (819.3) Although these people maintain a powerful war establishment as a defense against invasion by the surrounding hostile peoples, it may be recorded to their credit that they have not in over one hundred years employed these military resources in an offensive war. They have become civilized to that point where they can vigorously defend civilization without yielding to the temptation to utilize their war powers in aggression. There have been no civil wars since the establishment of the united continental state, but during the last two centuries these people have been called upon to wage nine fierce defensive conflicts, three of which were against mighty confederations of world powers. Although this nation maintains adequate defense against attack by hostile neighbors, it pays far more attention to the training of statesmen, scientists, and philosophers.


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I've said before that there's particular significance that Paper 72 is included in the revelation. The implications are clear. We need to be careful not to allow western civilization to be overrun by misplaced ideals and their undesirable results.

(160:4.14) Success may generate courage and promote confidence, but wisdom comes only from the experiences of adjustment to the results of one's failures. Men who prefer optimistic illusions to reality can never become wise. Only those who face facts and adjust them to ideals can achieve wisdom. Wisdom embraces both the fact and the ideal and therefore saves its devotees from both of those barren extremes of philosophy—the man whose idealism excludes facts and the materialist who is devoid of spiritual outlook. Those timid souls who can only keep up the struggle of life by the aid of continuous false illusions of success are doomed to suffer failure and experience defeat as they ultimately awaken from the dream world of their own imaginations.


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