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 Post subject: Time After Time
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130:7.5 Animals do not sense time as does man, and even to man, because of his sectional and circumscribed view, time appears as a succession of events; but as man ascends, as he progresses inward, the enlarging view of this event procession is such that it is discerned more and more in its wholeness. That which formerly appeared as a succession of events then will be viewed as a whole and perfectly related cycle; in this way will circular simultaneity increasingly displace the onetime consciousness of the linear sequence of events.

130:7.6 There are seven different conceptions of space as it is conditioned by time. Space is measured by time, not time by space. The confusion of the scientist grows out of failure to recognize the reality of space. Space is not merely an intellectual concept of the variation in relatedness of universe objects. Space is not empty, and the only thing man knows which can even partially transcend space is mind. Mind can function independently of the concept of the space-relatedness of material objects. Space is relatively and comparatively finite to all beings of creature status. The nearer consciousness approaches the awareness of seven cosmic dimensions, the more does the concept of potential space approach ultimacy. But the space potential is truly ultimate only on the absolute level.

130:7.7 It must be apparent that universal reality has an expanding and always relative meaning on the ascending and perfecting levels of the cosmos. Ultimately, surviving mortals achieve identity in a seven-dimensional universe.

This is an excerpt of what Jesus said on a "Discourse of Time and Space" at Carthage.

What is circular simultaneity as Jesus describes time? I believe that Jesus was telling us that time is not a line but circles, all at the same time. This does not mean that time travels around in circles but that time is the circle itself. These time circles expand and we should think of time in this way rather than a time line.

Why should this matter at all, you might ask?

As we try to validate the science in TUB with current scientific discoveries, it is of interest that we have discovered that time is circular and not linear. Yet no one has come to that realization.

Pi is that transcendental number that relates a circle to the straight length around a circle called its circumference. You can interchange circle with sphere in all of this if you like since they are both governed by this infinite expression, Pi (3.14...).

All calculations of motion use this number in a fashion that assumes that time is linear.

Both in rocket science and quantum mechanics, big problem have cropped up in the vicinity of Pi, although no one new why. In the space program, the engineers began seeing real life failures of the equations from the beginning. In the late 1950's, the American program headed by Werner van Braun began admitting major equation failures. Rockets simply weren't where they were supposed to be, but only when curved trajectories were involved. The first rocket to orbit the Earth were late by huge amounts, indicating the equations were wrong by something over 20%. The Russians found the same problem. In press releases, they indicated (and still do) that the problem was with the propellants, but behind the scenes they pursued other possibilities. Just as they assign equation failure now to dark matter, the the 1960's they asked themselves if this rocket problem was caused by unknown ethers or forces of nature. As far as I know, they still have not solved it. As it turns out, the failures in the rocket equations are nearly almost exactly the same size as the gap between Pi (3.14...) and 4.

A similar problem arose in quantum mechanics. Since quantum particles move in orbits (curved trajectories), the same sort of equation failures occurred there. Mainstream science admits it has had to ditch classical geometry and resort what is called the Manhattan metric to solve some quantum problems. This is curious since in the Manhattan metric, the value used for Pi is 4 and not 3.14...

They have unwittingly discovered that time is circular and not linear just as Jesus taught (TUB), but mainstream science does not even know it!

You may ask, what is the connection?

It all has to do with the impossible task of squaring the circle. TUB tells us that not even God can do the strange thing called squaring the circle.

Curvature cannot be straightened or rectified. Projection from the infinite to the finite is a one way street. If science uses time as linear in an equation describing a curved trajectory, the resulting error will be off by the difference between the circumference of a circle and the perimeter of a square that fits perfectly inside the square and share the same center. In other words, a circle of diameter 1 inscribed inside a square of sides 1, has a circumference of 3.14..., or Pi. The square has a perimeter of 4.

4 - 3.14... / 4 = 21.5% This is nearly precisely the error found in the rocket science and quantum mechanical calculations.

This does not for a minute change the value of Pi. There just needs to be this correction when calculations of motion are utilized.


TUB has come along and corrected this confusion but science has not caught on. They are content with coming up with ad hoc theories to try and explain the errors and failure.

The age long notion of linear time must be abandoned and we must realize what Jesus has taught; that time is circular simultaneity.


Last edited by toto on Sun Oct 16, 2016 3:28 pm +0000, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: Time After Time
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Dictionary.com.....


cycle
[sahy-kuh l]


1.
any complete round or series of occurrences that repeats or is repeated.
2.
a round of years or a recurring period of time, especially one in which certain events or phenomena repeat themselves in the same order and at the same intervals.
3.
any long period of years; age.



Taken from 130:7.5 above:

That which formerly appeared as a succession of events then will be viewed as a whole and perfectly related cycle;


They say that as we get older time seems to go faster because when we were young time seemed to move slowly.
I suppose in this short life we really don't get to feel that cylical time phenomenon, not enough has taken place, not enough history.


Make the time sometime and read the entire paper 130.7 section. I am at times truly shocked at how much valuable life saving information can be had in just the smallest parts of the UB. When have I ever taken the time out to really discover what someone else wants done.


also from 130.7.....

“Become interested in your fellows; learn how to love them and watch for the opportunity to do something for them which you are sure they want done,” and then he quoted the olden Jewish proverb — “A man who would have friends must show himself friendly.”


Toto, I found this post fascinating and confirming. I cannot count how many times someone has pointed out something from the UB that is so far ahead of us it boggles the mind.


Thank You for this.

Paul


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 Post subject: Re: Time After Time
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118:5.1 The omnipotence of Deity does not imply the power to do the nondoable. Within the time-space frame and from the intellectual reference point of mortal comprehension, even the infinite God cannot create square circles or produce evil that is inherently good.

This Mighty messenger felt the need to include this bit of knowledge within this seemingly unrelated context. Time is in a very confused state with us humans. TUB is here also to correct confusion.

We are told that mind has a differential relation with time as it relates to space and that is what I wish to explore next.

Thank you Paul for your understanding of my presentation. As to the snail's pace of progress, all that can be said is, "all in good time". The virtue of patience is in the practice of patience. I will make one statement of encouragement, however. The expanding Universe is in acceleration. It is not even a steady speed. We don't always feel or appreciate it as we do not feel or appreciate that as we step on this holy ground we are accelerated even when apparently standing still. This acceleration is physical and spiritual. Gravity is that acceleration.


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 Post subject: Re: Time After Time
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i'm no mathemagician but i think the error in using straight lines to calculate the circumference of a circle is in the ability to calculate pi to infinity (ever decreasing degrees of approximation) and the manhattan grid metric uses straight lines zig-zagging to approximate a circle also. I know nothing about the early rocket anomalies but i think there are greater obstacles to overcome in the scientific linear view of time such as the fact we view reality with a time-bound mental framework and that everything we know has a beginning and an end.

I think the bit about god making square circles is a logical construct not geometrical. But I appreciate any effort to reconcile current science with TUB.

I find the concept of circular simultaneity best understood as the everlasting NOW containing all of the past and all of the future as mentioned in the following text...and also the bits about the lengthening of the time-unit of maturity is something i think we can all witness and grasp within our own mortal experience. :smile:

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118:1.1
1. Time and Eternity


It is helpful to man’s cosmic orientation to attain all possible comprehension of Deity’s relation to the cosmos. While absolute Deity is eternal in nature, the Gods are related to time as an experience in eternity. In the evolutionary universes eternity is temporal everlastingness—the everlasting now.

The personality of the mortal creature may eternalize by self-identification with the indwelling spirit through the technique of choosing to do the will of the Father. Such a consecration of will is tantamount to the realization of eternity-reality of purpose. This means that the purpose of the creature has become fixed with regard to the succession of moments; stated otherwise, that the succession of moments will witness no change in creature purpose. A million or a billion moments makes no difference. Number has ceased to have meaning with regard to the creature’s purpose. Thus does creature choice plus God’s choice eventuate in the eternal realities of the never-ending union of the spirit of God and the nature of man in the everlasting service of the children of God and of their Paradise Father.

There is a direct relationship between maturity and the unit of time consciousness in any given intellect. The time unit may be a day, a year, or a longer period, but inevitably it is the criterion by which the conscious self evaluates the circumstances of life, and by which the conceiving intellect measures and evaluates the facts of temporal existence.

Experience, wisdom, and judgment are the concomitants of the lengthening of the time unit in mortal experience. As the human mind reckons backward into the past, it is evaluating past experience for the purpose of bringing it to bear on a present situation. As mind reaches out into the future, it is attempting to evaluate the future significance of possible action. And having thus reckoned with both experience and wisdom, the human will exercises judgment-decision in the present, and the plan of action thus born of the past and the future becomes existent.

In the maturity of the developing self, the past and future are brought together to illuminate the true meaning of the present. As the self matures, it reaches further and further back into the past for experience, while its wisdom forecasts seek to penetrate deeper and deeper into the unknown future. And as the conceiving self extends this reach ever further into both past and future, so does judgment become less and less dependent on the momentary present. In this way does decision-action begin to escape from the fetters of the moving present, while it begins to take on the aspects of past-future significance.

Patience is exercised by those mortals whose time units are short; true maturity transcends patience by a forbearance born of real understanding.

To become mature is to live more intensely in the present, at the same time escaping from the limitations of the present. The plans of maturity, founded on past experience, are coming into being in the present in such manner as to enhance the values of the future.

The time unit of immaturity concentrates meaning-value into the present moment in such a way as to divorce the present of its true relationship to the not-present—the past-future. The time unit of maturity is proportioned so to reveal the co-ordinate relationship of past-present-future that the self begins to gain insight into the wholeness of events, begins to view the landscape of time from the panoramic perspective of broadened horizons, begins perhaps to suspect the nonbeginning, nonending eternal continuum, the fragments of which are called time.

On the levels of the infinite and the absolute the moment of the present contains all of the past as well as all of the future. I AM signifies also I WAS and I WILL BE. And this represents our best concept of eternity and the eternal.

On the absolute and eternal level, potential reality is just as meaningful as actual reality. Only on the finite level and to time-bound creatures does there appear to be such a vast difference. To God, as absolute, an ascending mortal who has made the eternal decision is already a Paradise finaliter. But the Universal Father, through the indwelling Thought Adjuster, is not thus limited in awareness but can also know of, and participate in, every temporal struggle with the problems of the creature ascent from animallike to Godlike levels of existence.


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 Post subject: Re: Time After Time
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toto, can you give any references for us to dig further into exactly where the mathematics didn't work and how the investigators determined that?

Also, did you find where the seven dimensions are described?


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 Post subject: Re: Time After Time
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Riktare wrote:
toto, can you give any references for us to dig further into exactly where the mathematics didn't work and how the investigators determined that?

Also, did you find where the seven dimensions are described?


1http://www.enterprisemission.com/Von_Braun.htm
2http://www.thespacereview.com/article/1224/1

As for the seven dimensions, they are stated in the quotes above but not described anywhere in TUB that I know of.


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 Post subject: Re: Time After Time
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Makalu wrote:
i think there are greater obstacles to overcome in the scientific linear view of time such as the fact we view reality with a time-bound mental framework and that everything we know has a beginning and an end.


I agree that this lies at the heart of our problem. We create lines with beginnings and endings by bounding them with points that denote starting and stopping. What we fail to realize is that a line is truly infinite in both directions. When we bound a line we are making an infinite construct finite.


Makalu wrote:
I think the bit about god making square circles is a logical construct not geometrical.


You may be completely correct about this. I am fond myself of using geometrical constructions as analogies and metaphors.


Makalu wrote:
I find the concept of circular simultaneity best understood as the everlasting NOW containing all of the past and all of the future as mentioned in the following text...and also the bits about the lengthening of the time-unit of maturity is something i think we can all witness and grasp within our own mortal experience.


Do you consider the 'everlasting NOW' to be synonymous with eternity? TUB mentions that the absolute of time is eternity. Considering that time is circular simultaneity, a circle taken to its absolute is on one end is a point and on the other end, a line.

Taking a circles to its absolute is analogous to making its radius zero, a point; and on the other absolute, making the circle's radius infinite, a line. I would consider a circle with radius that is neither zero or infinite to be "the fragments of which are called time".

Thank you for the quote, it really adds to the discussion.


Last edited by toto on Mon Oct 17, 2016 9:58 am +0000, edited 2 times in total.

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 Post subject: Re: Time After Time
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i consider the concept of the everlasting now a good attempt to grasp something beyond our reach (the concept of eternity) but not synonymous no. I think we're able to glimpse eternity due to the presence of the divine TA within but unable to grasp it due to our inability to recognize/respond to intervening morontial and absonite realities. It's not expressed explicitly in the UB but i wonder if the seven dimensions we are to eventually experience are three finite, three absonite and one absolute.


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 Post subject: Re: Time After Time
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12:5.5 Relationships to time do not exist without motion in space, but consciousness of time does. Sequentiality can consciousize time even in the absence of motion. Man's mind is less time-bound than space-bound because of the inherent nature of mind. Even during the days of the earth life in the flesh, though man's mind is rigidly space-bound, the creative human imagination is comparatively time free. But time itself is not genetically a quality of mind.

I have always wondered what the author was telling us when they point out a difference between how the human mind is less time-bound than space bound. Could it be that this differential explains how we grow and move, as when it is said that, "In Him we live and move and have our being"?


Last edited by toto on Mon Oct 17, 2016 1:57 pm +0000, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: Time After Time
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The circle that time reveals is the journey that God made to become inside each of us, and to have brought our existences into his source of consciousness. It is the circle of your existence, which intellectually is described as a succession (of experiences that have brought maturation upon your personality).

_________________
to the Underlaying Unity of All Life so that the Voice of Intuition may guide Us closer to Our Common Keeper


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 Post subject: Re: Time After Time
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SEla_Kelly wrote:
The circle that time reveals is the journey that God made to become inside each of us, and to have brought our existences into his source of consciousness. It is the circle of your existence, which intellectually is described as a succession (of experiences that have brought maturation upon your personality).


Mr. Kelly, would you include spiritual experiences in the context of your remarks above?


118:3.1 Only by ubiquity could Deity unify time-space manifestations to the finite conception, for time is a succession of instants while space is a system of associated points. You do, after all, perceive time by analysis and space by synthesis. You co-ordinate and associate these two dissimilar conceptions by the integrating insight of personality. Of all the animal world only man possesses this time-space perceptibility. To an animal, motion has a meaning, but motion exhibits value only to a creature of personality status.

Are you willing to say that a succession of instants is like a succession of experiences? What would you say is an "instant" and can it be experienced?


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 Post subject: Re: Time After Time
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Thanks to everyone for a most interesting discussion. While I am not educated enough to provide any scientific or mathematical models/constructs for consideration, long ago in my Zen days, I came to see time as a combination of both line and circle: consider the child's toy - the slinky. All the "circles" are lineally attached going round and round but at the same time there is lineal progress in the round and round from either end to the other end (that is, until you connect both ends - then you have another element of circularity - a double loop). The space in between the links however is a truer measurement of "distance" traveled in/by the circle with that distance or spread (to me) denoting the "progress" in-time.

Times of regression and status quo keeps the links tightly together, seeming to endlessly repeat with little "progress" or distance traveled over lineal "time". While progressive moments of culture, religion, science, etc. provide more space between the circles. Status quo is a "short" slinky while progress is the "stretched" slinky.

While these actions often stretch and shrink the circular progress of the whole in cycles over time through the mortal epochs, I can personally "see" those links separate wider from the printing press to the moon landing, and now, the advent of instant and universal global communication is providing some real "stretch" of slinky "progress"....or meaningful and lasting change.

Sorry if the analogy is faulty....and I know it is. But it does allow the mind (or at least MY mind) to visualize how lines can also be circles with lineal progressions at the same time and not be closed loops (as in a chain for example).

8)

Just read toto's questions to SEla: I would say that my slinky analogy certainly relates to my spiritualization experience too. I've had seasons where it just seemed round and round I go with no large distance achieved, while other times great strides are experienced by the choices and priorities in my life. The aging comment earlier by another really struck me too as my lineal movement through time seems to accelerate as I get older which offers its own sense of "distortion" to my time experience. When eleven years and eleven months old, that twelfth month before my twelfth birthday was a very, very long time....longer it seemed than the time between birthdays today. The seasons now race by with ease. It seems there is always more and more to do with less and less time - a complete illusion I surmise.


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 Post subject: Re: Time After Time
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fanofVan wrote:
I came to see time as a combination of both line and circle:


This is most insightful. Circle is a central point with radial extension. The circle is curved but the radius is a line. So, the line and the circle are coexistent and codependent. In fact, as I described previously, when the radius, a line, is taken to infinity, the circle becomes a line and loses all of its curvature. This, I would argue, is the absolute of time, or eternity.


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 Post subject: Re: Time After Time
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Thanks....one of the interesting things about a slinky is that the radius does not change - the distance of the slinky from end to end is a distortion of the space between the "circles". Same with both time and distance - the space between the circles does not increase/decrease the lineal distance of progress measured along the continuum.

Don't know how any of this relates to the discussion - perhaps just a paradigm shift - but I appreciate everyone's insights....and patience with me.

8)


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 Post subject: Re: Time After Time
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Thanks to all of you for your interest in this topic.

11:8.2 The center and focal point of absolute material gravity is the Isle of Paradise, complemented by the dark gravity bodies encircling Havona and equilibrated by the upper and nether space reservoirs. All known emanations of nether Paradise invariably and unerringly respond to the central gravity pull operating upon the endless circuits of the elliptical space levels of the master universe. Every known form of cosmic reality has the bend of the ages, the trend of the circle, the swing of the great ellipse.

We must remind ourselves that although TUB says "the trend of the circle" in the same sentence as "the swing of the great ellipse", all motion that we can observe is elliptical. These are the orbits of our Sun's planets. Paradise is elliptical in shape and this is curious because an ellipse has geometrically two foci and not one focal point. An elliptical orbit does not have a single radius of curvature like a circle but infinite radii of curvature. And this radius of curvature is changing at every instant of motion along the path of the ellipse.

This is perfectly analogous to the space motions of the Master Universe. The Universes revolved around Paradise as they breath in 2 billion year cycles. The radius of the Universe is constantly changing. At present, the universe of universes is getting bigger.

This can be said to be analogous to a circle that is getting bigger and bigger over time. Of course, in half a billion years, the circles will be getting smaller and smaller over time.

Curious that these jumps in circle size seem to be smooth and continuous but must actually be composed of quantum jumps. These jumps occur in an instant.


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