Urantia Book Forum

Urantia Book Discussion Board : Study Group
It is currently Wed Apr 01, 2020 8:30 pm +0000

All times are UTC - 7 hours




Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 251 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7 ... 17  Next
Author Message
PostPosted:  
Offline

Joined: Sun Aug 03, 2014 5:02 am +0000
Posts: 937
Location: Brooklyn NY
quil, I am losing my patience now. I said I believe TUB was channeled. But how does that equate to endorsing it? If I said I believe a woman was raped by so and so, does it mean I endorse rape? Dude either you don't know the meaning of the words you use or you have a very warped way of reasoning things out. I am not going over this again so please do not ask if me I believe TUB was channeled. Now... I am asking you to stop accusing me of endorsing channeling on this forum as it is an outright lie on me. Very disrespectful and uncool.




quil wrote:
BB, once again your logic is completely contorted. Let me state it plainly: IF you think The UB was channeled, THEN that means you believe channeling is real. THUS you endorse its reality. No apology from me to you is necessary for pointing out this very obvious deduction from the claims you have made previously.

But I will apologize to the board: sorry for getting this discussion off track. I am reminded of the following words of the Master:

Quote:
146:2.13 (1640.2) 12. All believers in this gospel should pray sincerely for the extension of the kingdom of heaven. Of all the prayers of the Hebrew scriptures he commented most approvingly on the petition of the Psalmist: “Create in me a clean heart, O God, and renew a right spirit within me. Purge me from secret sins and keep back your servant from presumptuous transgression.” Jesus commented at great length on the relation of prayer to careless and offending speech, quoting: “Set a watch, O Lord, before my mouth; keep the door of my lips.” “The human tongue,” said Jesus, “is a member which few men can tame, but the spirit within can transform this unruly member into a kindly voice of tolerance and an inspiring minister of mercy.
Perhaps one day I can live up to this ideal. Until then, please bear with me.

_________________
BB, the Urantian Gnostic606


Top
 Profile Send private message  
Reply with quote  
PostPosted:  
Offline

Joined: Sun Aug 03, 2014 5:02 am +0000
Posts: 937
Location: Brooklyn NY
quil since you lie on me and refuse to apologize I bid you peace and will no longer communicate with you.

_________________
BB, the Urantian Gnostic606


Top
 Profile Send private message  
Reply with quote  
PostPosted:  
Offline

Joined: Wed Oct 17, 2012 9:55 am +0000
Posts: 432
Dude, grow up. You'll get far in life expecting everyone to apologize when you want them to. Don't forget your ball on your way home.


Top
 Profile Send private message  
Reply with quote  
PostPosted:  
Offline

Joined: Sun Aug 23, 2015 9:23 am +0000
Posts: 818
Gentlemen,

I'd like to go back to this issue of mysticism. Don't you think there are many types of mysticism? Some mystics practice self-hypnosis and go into a trance; some mystics seek for inaccessible, hidden knowledge, some mystics attempt to channel deities and others attempt to merge themselves with the absolute.

I think what the Papers are trying to say is that not all forms of mysticism are useful methods to discover God's will, which is all we humans should be doing. Looking for God is admirable, but not all methods of looking enable a person to find him. Most forms of mysticism result in a state of self-delusion rather than open up a process of self-realization.

We are told in Paper 91 that mysticism, as the technique of cultivating the consciousness of the presence of God, is praiseworthy. But not all forms of mysticism are praiseworthy. Some lead to isolation, feelings of indescribable ecstasy, romantic daydreaming and fanaticism.

Much, as I see it, depends on the level of sincerity and trust one has in God as well as the depth of desire to discover his will. Personally, I think a simple and sincere prayer works best.

In Friendship,
Rexford


Top
 Profile Send private message  
Reply with quote  
PostPosted:  
Offline

Joined: Sun Aug 03, 2014 5:02 am +0000
Posts: 937
Location: Brooklyn NY
Rexford wrote:
Gentlemen,

I'd like to go back to this issue of mysticism. Don't you think there are many types of mysticism? Some mystics practice self-hypnosis and go into a trance; some mystics seek for inaccessible, hidden knowledge, some mystics attempt to channel deities and others attempt to merge themselves with the absolute.

I think what the Papers are trying to say is that not all forms of mysticism are useful methods to discover God's will, which is all we humans should be doing. Looking for God is admirable, but not all methods of looking enable a person to find him. Most forms of mysticism result in a state of self-delusion rather than open up a process of self-realization.

We are told in Paper 91 that mysticism, as the technique of cultivating the consciousness of the presence of God, is praiseworthy. But not all forms of mysticism are praiseworthy. Some lead to isolation, feelings of indescribable ecstasy, romantic daydreaming and fanaticism.

Much, as I see it, depends on the level of sincerity and trust one has in God as well as the depth of desire to discover his will. Personally, I think a simple and sincere prayer works best.

In Friendship,
Rexford



Well stated and I agree with every point you make.

_________________
BB, the Urantian Gnostic606


Top
 Profile Send private message  
Reply with quote  
PostPosted:  
Offline

Joined: Wed Oct 17, 2012 9:55 am +0000
Posts: 432
I would add though, that mysticism is altogether praiseworthy in the relative sense. If sincerity of heart is there, then yes, I will concede that some mysticism is preferable to no effort to reach God at all.

Paper 91 also gives us a litmus test for true religious experience resulting from some forms of mysticism.

They continually remind us, though, that prayer is the surest way to a religious experience. Jesus never resorted to mysticism because he never had to. And neither do we. Through the gift of revelation, we know the better way...


Top
 Profile Send private message  
Reply with quote  
PostPosted:  
Offline

Joined: Sun Aug 23, 2015 9:23 am +0000
Posts: 818
quil,

I agree with you. The best approach to God is the way Jesus did it. Any other method is suspect. In Paper 100 they say that the healthiest attitude is reflective worship and the prayer of thanksgiving. Personally, I've always been content with that approach, especially thanksgiving.

Going back to the opening quote of this topic which refers to "liberated but controlled channels of creative imagination" – I think the channel is the gateway to the soul and that the gateway is best opened by controlled reflection on truth, beauty and goodness through prayer and worship.

As for liberated, I'm still coagulating my thoughts on that, so please bear with me. In Paper 132 we're told that faith is the inspiration of the spiritized creative imagination. I'm wondering if "spiritized" and "liberated" are somehow related. After all, it is the Spirit, the Spirit of Truth, who sets us free. (Papers 34, 52, 141, 143, 155, 174)

I especially like what we are told in Papers 143 and 155: if the spirit indwells us, we are not bondslaves of the flesh, but free and liberated sons of the spirit; and, the religion of the spirit leaves us forever free to follow the truth wherever the leadings of the spirit takes us. Also, in 143 we're told that by faith the spirit transforms us and we become the temples of God's indwelling.

So, it is faith that leads to the indwelling Spirit and the Spirit is what liberates and spiritizes our minds. I think faith is the controlling feature and it plays a critical part in opening up, or liberating the channel to our souls. And within the soul it is possible, through co-creative imagination, to be inspired and spiritized by the Adjuster. It looks like it takes two to have true creative imagination.

At this point, I think, it becomes a positive feedback loop, provided a faithful attitude of reflective worship and thanksgiving is maintained. Self-hypnotic trances cannot do this. A trance is the self feeding the self. There is no divine input from another personality or pre-personality. I think that's what makes it delusional. It's not possible to have communion with yourself. Isn't that what they mean by navel gazing? I'm certain it takes two to create, which is why they call it co-creation.

Still Thinking,
Rexford


Top
 Profile Send private message  
Reply with quote  
PostPosted:  
Offline

Joined: Wed Sep 12, 2012 2:07 am +0000
Posts: 964
Nicely put Rexford


Top
 Profile Send private message  
Reply with quote  
PostPosted:  
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Sun Jun 20, 2004 12:40 pm +0000
Posts: 2565
The Urantia Book

Paper 108

Mission and Ministry of Thought Adjusters

http://www.urantia.org/urantia-book-sta ... -adjusters

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FG1NrQYXjLU


Top
 Profile Send private message  
Reply with quote  
PostPosted:  
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Sun Jun 20, 2004 12:40 pm +0000
Posts: 2565
Brother brooklyn_born

You say ,

'' I said I believe TUB was channeled.''

You can believe what you wish of course yet ,

I think you misunderstand ...

http://www.urantiabook.org/archive/mjs_ ... a-book.htm

The Author's Account
The first account of the origin of The Urantia Book lies within its own pages. We are told the papers were authorized by high deity authorities and written by numerous supermortal personalities. These papers are designated as the Fifth Epochal Revelation to our planet, Urantia. Dated from 1934 A. D., the five epochal revelations are: (1) Dalamatia—500,000 years ago; (2) Adam and Eve—37,848 years ago; (3) Melchizedek—1980 B. C.; (4) Jesus—7 B. C.; and The Urantia Book —1934-35 A. D.

The authors (revelators) acknowledge the difficulty of portraying the realities of eternity in the language of time. We are told severe limitations were placed on the knowledge they were permitted to share with us. They explain that all time-space revelation is partial and incomplete, needing to be periodically upstepped in the process of planetary development.

In general terms the authors discuss the problems they encountered communicating between their spiritual level of universe reality and our material level of mortal existence. They reveal that they made contact through the Thought Adjuster (indwelling spirit of God) of a particular human being on our world. We are assured, however, that this Thought Adjuster's communication technique is not related to "spiritualism," "mediumship," or "channeling." Specific details are not discussed.


Top
 Profile Send private message  
Reply with quote  
PostPosted:  
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Sun Jun 20, 2004 12:40 pm +0000
Posts: 2565
http://www.urantia.org/urantia-foundation/history

'' Several members of this group who participated in the preliminary "contacts" which led up to the appearance of the Urantia Papers, had had considerable experience in the investigation of psychic phenomena. This group early arrived at the conclusion that the phenomena connected with the personality, who was later associated with the Urantia Papers, was in no way similar to any other well-known type of psychic performance - such as hypnosis, automatic writing, clairvoyance, trances, spirit mediumship, telepathy, or double personality.

It should be made clear that the antecedents of the Urantia Papers were in no way associated with so-called spiritualism -- with its seances and supposed communication with spirits of departed human beings.''


Top
 Profile Send private message  
Reply with quote  
PostPosted:  
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Sun Jun 20, 2004 12:40 pm +0000
Posts: 2565
148:8.3 (1666.2) About this time there arrived at the Bethsaida encampment a trance prophet from Bagdad, one Kirmeth. This supposed prophet had peculiar visions when in trance and dreamed fantastic dreams when his sleep was disturbed. He created a considerable disturbance at the camp, and Simon Zelotes was in favor of dealing rather roughly with the self-deceived pretender, but Jesus intervened and allowed him entire freedom of action for a few days. All who heard his preaching soon recognized that his teaching was not sound as judged by the gospel of the kingdom. He shortly returned to Bagdad, taking with him only a half dozen unstable and erratic souls. But before Jesus interceded for the Bagdad prophet, David Zebedee, with the assistance of a self-appointed committee, had taken Kirmeth out into the lake and, after repeatedly plunging him into the water, had advised him to depart hence — to organize and build a camp of his own.


Top
 Profile Send private message  
Reply with quote  
PostPosted:  
Offline

Joined: Thu Feb 19, 2015 5:23 pm +0000
Posts: 641
coop wrote:
148:8.3 (1666.2) About this time there arrived at the Bethsaida encampment a trance prophet from Bagdad, one Kirmeth. This supposed prophet had peculiar visions when in trance and dreamed fantastic dreams when his sleep was disturbed. He created a considerable disturbance at the camp, and Simon Zelotes was in favor of dealing rather roughly with the self-deceived pretender, but Jesus intervened and allowed him entire freedom of action for a few days. All who heard his preaching soon recognized that his teaching was not sound as judged by the gospel of the kingdom. He shortly returned to Bagdad, taking with him only a half dozen unstable and erratic souls. But before Jesus interceded for the Bagdad prophet, David Zebedee, with the assistance of a self-appointed committee, had taken Kirmeth out into the lake and, after repeatedly plunging him into the water, had advised him to depart hence — to organize and build a camp of his own.


Well, this may have been the first recorded case of water boarding. Be careful, BB. They may come after you for using the word trance. :lol:


Top
 Profile Send private message  
Reply with quote  
PostPosted:  
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Sun Jun 20, 2004 12:40 pm +0000
Posts: 2565
Yeah , how little we have Evolved eh ?

Devolution ?

There is hope to change tho eh

To Light an life


Last edited by coop on Tue Sep 08, 2015 2:23 pm +0000, edited 1 time in total.

Top
 Profile Send private message  
Reply with quote  
PostPosted:  
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Sun Jun 20, 2004 12:40 pm +0000
Posts: 2565
Urantia is said to be known

as the world of the cross

and we are told that we are semi civillised and greatly
retarded ,,,


Top
 Profile Send private message  
Reply with quote  
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 251 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7 ... 17  Next

All times are UTC - 7 hours


Who is online

Registered users: No registered users


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You can post attachments in this forum

Search for:
Jump to:  
Powered by phpBB® Forum Software © phpBB Group