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The Urantia Book explains that Andrew and Abner founded a church in Philadelphia that was loyal to the teachings of Jesus, and it survived, sending missionaries throughout Arabia, until it was overrun by Muslim armies early in the 7th century. Most likely it was a missionary from Philadelphia who met with and taught Muhammad.

Why is this relevant? Well, it explains a number of inconsistencies in the biblical record. Since Paul said nothing about what he learned in Philadelphia, we must assume he disagreed with what he was taught. John Mark, the lad who had been closely associated with Jesus and his apostles for 4 years, abandond Paul in Paul’s first missionary journey, probably because he disagreed with Paul’s teachings. And Paul did in fact teach a very strange set of cult beliefs about the relevance of Jesus’ death. He was the author of the atonement doctrine that I find so alien and pagan in nature. Jesus never taught the atonement doctrine, and Abner, Andrew, and John Mark all knew it. Therefore, Paul refused to reveal anything about the gospel teachings he learned in Philadelphia.

Even the book of Revelation (John Zebedee’s vision) reveals in the 3rd chapter that Jesus was fully pleased with only one of the seven churches mentioned - the church in Philadelphia, founded by Andrew. He found some fault with the others, all of which had been established by Paul.

Now, since the rank and file Christians during the days of Muhammad’s early life were of a more Greek Orthodox persuasion, overly honoring Mary as the “mother of God,” pushing a convoluted concept of the Trinity, claiming Jesus was the second person of that Trinity, and giving the gospel short shrift, and since the missionaries from Philadelphia, being loyal to the gospel, disagreed with them, therefore, naturally, the missionary who taught Muhammad told him of the disagreement and complained about the faults in their doctrines. Interestingly, in the Qur’an Muhammad denounced Christians for precisely those shortcomings, and in his denunciation he made it apparent that some Christians acutally believed correctly. Who would those correct Christians be? The ones in Philadelphia, of course. It is a shame that he sent his Muslim warriors into the last bastion of the gospel on earth and destroyed the church from which missionaries of that gospel had been sent to teach him.
http://bobhurt.blogspot.com/2005/07/que ... islam.html


The Urantia Book says that Abner's version of Jesus' teachings were overwhelmed by the rise of Islam. Perhaps this is because Islam's understanding of Jesus is in important ways closer to what Jesus originally taught than what later developed as Pauline Christianity. Therefore, Abner's followers had an easier time converting to Islam than converting to Pauline Christianity.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FbQt4BKMV9k

Unlike Islam and the Urantia Book, Pauline Christianity teaches that Jesus is co-equal and co-eternal with God the Father. Islam, like the Urantia Book, stresses the importance of following what Jesus taught when he was alive, instead of believing that he died for our sins. While Islam teaches that Jesus is the Messiah and that he will return someday, it is not the Jewish understanding of the Messiah as a worldly king.

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Another title frequently mentioned is al-Masīḥ, which translates to "the Messiah". This does not correspond to the Christian concept of Messiah, as Islam regards all prophets, including Jesus, to be mortal and without any share in divinity. Muslim exegetes explain the use of the word masīh in the Quran as referring to Jesus' status as the one anointed by means of blessings and honors; or as the one who helped cure the sick, by anointing the eyes of the blind, for example.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jesus_in_Islam

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:?:

And your point IS :?:


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Could it be that the followers of Abner converted to Islam because it was closer to their understanding of Jesus than what developed as Pauline Christianity?

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It is possible, but it is also possible they had this choice: convert, move out, or be
put to sleep, even though I doubt Muhammad would have approved of this, many
things have been done in the name of Islam, just as many things have been, and are
done in the name of Christianity.
I suspect the non-alcohol, non-fornication, non-adultery, non-homosexuality, non-pedophile
and more conservative morality and modesty of Islam would have appealed to Abner as it does to myself
and many others who are not impressed with the current mores in western countries, but it is
all speculative. Homosexual intimate acts are one of the worst things you can do in Islam, or in
conservative Judaism.
But Abner really had no need to convert to Islam, as what he already knew, he believed to be the truth,
and held to it faithfully, opposing James and Paul.
Muhammad was not taught by any man. Angel Gabriel or one claiming to be Gabriel first came to him,
and he received visions and inspiration afterwards for years.
Muslims will not bow to Jesus/Michael or to any man, only to the First Source/God.
Muslims also believe that Satan is alive and well on planet earth and he has an army here.
There is an evil army here, not all the universe is friendly to us.
I have considered returning to Islam. I converted to Islam several years ago. It is a beautiful religion in
many ways, but I left because they do not believe Jesus was crucified, that Judas Iscariot was crucified in
his place, that there is no Holy Spirit, and I do not believe is punishment by amputation or lashing, and
I no longer believe in male or female circumcision. However, Islam as a beautiful non-priesthood/non-clergy
way to publicly or privately worship God. Even though it is repetitive, during the motions there is freedom to
simply express many heart felt requests, thanks, or worship. The prayer rug is your portable sacred space. To
me the sisters look beautiful with head scarves, as also many Jewish and Christian women do in many parts of
the world. They also avoid many diseases by having a stricter stance on homosexual acts and heterosexual sodomy
as well as helping keep intimacy within marriage and strongly discouraging fornication and adultery.
Some of this I am mentioning to give a voice to people who value the Papers and for those like us who read the
Papers who have more conservative mores and to express our values in this regard versus feeling like we need to be
quiet as the the more liberal media promotes the opposite as the moral boundaries will not stop with same sex but
will expand to loving incest etc. in the days to come. We are in a time of increasing decadence which some call loving.
And of course, that is their choice. I just wish to express other options. Any of us can have any type of desire, but we
will not die if we don't always fulfill every thought and feeling that comes to us. I only wish to express another way.
I would love to remain Islam after what I have experienced in the outer Urantia movement in some ways, but feel for
me to return would be to deny important truths I have learned so far, and deny untruths I believe are in Islam.
And as many of you realize, by expressing these things, technically, I place myself under the death penalty in Islam.
But I don't care. I am willing to die for the truth. What I believe puts me at odds with the more liberal morals of the outer
Urantia Book movement and also with the entire realm of Islam, minus Sufi's. What to do?
I really empathize with Abner and his followers. Then throw into the mix those who had a sincere conscience about being
vegan or vegetarian vs. those who could care less and eat pig meat etc. Then also those who wished to continue observing
the Sabbath and those who wanted Sunday, and the rest who didn't care.
Please don't misunderstand any of my remarks as being unloving. The unloving card is often played when the more conservative
of us want to express our conscience on various social issues. I respect the choices of others, even though I promote otherwise.
Having practiced Islam, I can say wholeheartedly that it gives people a clear, beautiful, motivated way to worship God everyday,
throughout the day, but also with a detailed and painful Hell realms. I have considered combining Islam, the Urantia Papers, and
the Seventh-day Adventist church, and have a life with the benefits of the positive aspects of Islam prayer/worship, all the clear
truths of the Urantia Papers without the assumed current liberal outer social mores, and the health/diet and Sabbath benefits of the
SDA. But, maybe it will all have to wait until the next worlds? There is much more I would like to say, but I feel I may have already made
enemies on all sides for my views. But, please let me be me, and I will also let you be you. No persecutions, just honest views.


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An Introduction to Islam
Dr. Meredith Sprunger
Islam: The Religion of Submission to God

http://www.urantiabook.org/archive/read ... uction.htm


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Thanks for the link, coop, very well said. Thanks for all bearing with me as I have tended to vent some
in the forum, and have had a difficult time leaving Islam in the last year or so, but still wanting to
find a way in my own personal life to hold onto some of the very noble and beautiful aspects of the
religion that mesh with new understanding through the UB and of Christ Michael.


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I from islamic country, the so called moderate- malaysia; a christian citizen ,living among them. my simple conclusion is:- apologist DR Woods and Sam Samoun and Son of Hamas (youtube) truly tells what the teaching is and the Koran really is.


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And as many of you realize, by expressing these things, technically, I place myself under the death penalty in Islam.


Earth and its peoples have a long way to go. Perhaps several generations!

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What about truly moderate Muslims?

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