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Tigran you cannot have it both ways though. You acknowledge that the last of those 10 days is the real pentecost, but that last day also happens to be the day the spirit of truth came, it is the day of pentecost.


Quote:
3. What Happened at Pentecost

(2062.10) 194:3.1 Many queer and strange teachings became associated with the early narratives of the day of Pentecost. In subsequent times the events of this day, on which the Spirit of Truth, the new teacher, came to dwell with mankind, have become confused with the foolish outbreaks of rampant emotionalism.


The entire significance of Pentecost to millions of followers is the day that its the day that the Holy Spirit (Spirit of Truth) was sent into mankind. So that final 10th day is the day of Pentecost it is the day that the Spirit of Truth came.

Quote:
What is Pentecost?

For Christians, Pentecost is a holiday on which we commemorate the coming of the Holy Spirit on the early followers of Jesus.


Originally Pentecost was a Jewish holiday that was 50 days.


Quote:
1. The Pentecost Sermon

(2060.1) 194:1.1 The apostles had been in hiding for forty days. This day happened to be the Jewish festival of Pentecost, and thousands of visitors from all parts of the world were in Jerusalem. Many arrived for this feast, but a majority had tarried in the city since the Passover. Now these frightened apostles emerged from their weeks of seclusion to appear boldly in the temple, where they began to preach the new message of a risen Messiah. And all the disciples were likewise conscious of having received some new spiritual endowment of insight and power.


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Quote:
What does the word “Pentecost” mean?

The English word “Pentecost” is a transliteration of the Greek word pentekostos, which means “fifty.” It comes from the ancient Christian expression pentekoste hemera, which means “fiftieth day.”

But Christians did not invent the phrase “fiftieth day.” Rather, they borrowed it from Greek-speaking Jews who used the phrase to refer to a Jewish holiday. This holiday was known as the Festival of Weeks, or, more simply, Weeks (Shavuot in Hebrew). This name comes from an expression in Leviticus 23:16, which instructs people to count seven weeks or “fifty days” from the end of Passover to the beginning of the next holiday (pentekonta hemeras in the ancient Greek translation of the Hebrew Scripture).

Shavuot was the second great feast in Israel’s yearly cycle of holy days. It was originally a harvest festival (Exod 23:16), but, in time, turned into a day to commemorate the giving of the law on Mt. Sinai. This day became especially significant for Christians because, seven weeks after the resurrection of Jesus, during the Jewish celebration of Shavuot/Pentecost, the Holy Spirit was poured out upon his first followers, thus empowering them for their mission and gathering them together as a church.


The Spirit of Truth came on the day of this Jewish Holiday as indicated in the book. That is clearly the pentecost they are talking about.


This all happens on the same day.


Quote:
5. The Master’s Ascension

(2057.3) 193:5.1 It was almost half past seven o’clock this Thursday morning, May 18, when Jesus arrived on the western slope of Mount Olivet with his eleven silent and somewhat bewildered apostles. From this location, about two thirds the way up the mountain, they could look out over Jerusalem and down upon Gethsemane. Jesus now prepared to say his last farewell to the apostles before he took leave of Urantia. As he stood there before them, without being directed they knelt about him in a circle, and the Master said:

(2057.4) 193:5.2 “I bade you tarry in Jerusalem until you were endowed with power from on high. I am now about to take leave of you; I am about to ascend to my Father, and soon, very soon, will we send into this world of my sojourn the Spirit of Truth; and when he has come, you shall begin the new proclamation of the gospel of the kingdom, first in Jerusalem and then to the uttermost parts of the world. Love men with the love wherewith I have loved you and serve your fellow mortals even as I have served you. By the spirit fruits of your lives impel souls to believe the truth that man is a son of God, and that all men are brethren. Remember all I have taught you and the life I have lived among you. My love overshadows you, my spirit will dwell with you, and my peace shall abide upon you. Farewell.”

(2057.5) 193:5.3 When the morontia Master had thus spoken, he vanished from their sight. This so-called ascension of Jesus was in no way different from his other disappearances from mortal vision during the forty days of his morontia career on Urantia.

(2057.6) 193:5.4 The Master went to Edentia by way of Jerusem, where the Most Highs, under the observation of the Paradise Son, released Jesus of Nazareth from the morontia state and, through the spirit channels of ascension, returned him to the status of Paradise sonship and supreme sovereignty on Salvington.

(2057.7) 193:5.5 It was about seven forty-five this morning when the morontia Jesus disappeared from the observation of his eleven apostles to begin the ascent to the right hand of his Father, there to receive formal confirmation of his completed sovereignty of the universe of Nebadon.
6. Peter Calls a Meeting

(2057.8) 193:6.1 Acting upon the instruction of Peter, John Mark and others went forth to call the leading disciples together at the home of Mary Mark. By ten thirty, one hundred and twenty of the foremost disciples of Jesus living in Jerusalem had forgathered to hear the report of the farewell message of the Master and to learn of his ascension. Among this company was Mary the mother of Jesus. She had returned to Jerusalem with John Zebedee when the apostles came back from their recent sojourn in Galilee. Soon after Pentecost she returned to the home of Salome at Bethsaida. James the brother of Jesus was also present at this meeting, the first conference of the Master’s disciples to be called after the termination of his planetary career.

(2058.1) 193:6.2 Simon Peter took it upon himself to speak for his fellow apostles and made a thrilling report of the last meeting of the eleven with their Master and most touchingly portrayed the Master’s final farewell and his ascension disappearance. It was a meeting the like of which had never before occurred on this world. This part of the meeting lasted not quite one hour. Peter then explained that they had decided to choose a successor to Judas Iscariot, and that a recess would be granted to enable the apostles to decide between the two men who had been suggested for this position, Matthias and Justus.

(2058.2) 193:6.3 The eleven apostles then went downstairs, where they agreed to cast lots in order to determine which of these men should become an apostle to serve in Judas’s place. The lot fell on Matthias, and he was declared to be the new apostle. He was duly inducted into his office and then appointed treasurer. But Matthias had little part in the subsequent activities of the apostles.

(2058.3) 193:6.4 Soon after Pentecost the twins returned to their homes in Galilee. Simon Zelotes was in retirement for some time before he went forth preaching the gospel. Thomas worried for a shorter period and then resumed his teaching. Nathaniel differed increasingly with Peter regarding preaching about Jesus in the place of proclaiming the former gospel of the kingdom. This disagreement became so acute by the middle of the following month that Nathaniel withdrew, going to Philadelphia to visit Abner and Lazarus; and after tarrying there for more than a year, he went on into the lands beyond Mesopotamia preaching the gospel as he understood it.

(2058.4) 193:6.5 This left but six of the original twelve apostles to become actors on the stage of the early proclamation of the gospel in Jerusalem: Peter, Andrew, James, John, Philip, and Matthew.

(2058.5) 193:6.6 Just about noon the apostles returned to their brethren in the upper chamber and announced that Matthias had been chosen as the new apostle. And then Peter called all of the believers to engage in prayer, prayer that they might be prepared to receive the gift of the spirit which the Master had promised to send.

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boomshuka, Everything you say is correct, except the last sentence, namely "this all happens on the same day". No, the Pentecost that year was on 28 May and the day of ascension was 18 May, so it is not the same day.

Please clarify your proof that "it all happened on the same day", as the way I see it is that it did NOT happen on the same day but with a 10-day gap in between.

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Look how this story flows together. If you re-read the bolded parts it should help you see that this is all on the same day. Jesus ascends in the early morning and on the same day Peter calls a meeting.

Quote:
5. The Master’s Ascension

(2057.3) 193:5.1 It was almost half past seven o’clock this Thursday morning, May 18, when Jesus arrived on the western slope of Mount Olivet with his eleven silent and somewhat bewildered apostles. From this location, about two thirds the way up the mountain, they could look out over Jerusalem and down upon Gethsemane. Jesus now prepared to say his last farewell to the apostles before he took leave of Urantia. As he stood there before them, without being directed they knelt about him in a circle, and the Master said:

(2057.4) 193:5.2 “I bade you tarry in Jerusalem until you were endowed with power from on high. I am now about to take leave of you; I am about to ascend to my Father, and soon, very soon, will we send into this world of my sojourn the Spirit of Truth; and when he has come, you shall begin the new proclamation of the gospel of the kingdom, first in Jerusalem and then to the uttermost parts of the world. Love men with the love wherewith I have loved you and serve your fellow mortals even as I have served you. By the spirit fruits of your lives impel souls to believe the truth that man is a son of God, and that all men are brethren. Remember all I have taught you and the life I have lived among you. My love overshadows you, my spirit will dwell with you, and my peace shall abide upon you. Farewell.”

(2057.5) 193:5.3 When the morontia Master had thus spoken, he vanished from their sight. This so-called ascension of Jesus was in no way different from his other disappearances from mortal vision during the forty days of his morontia career on Urantia.

(2057.6) 193:5.4 The Master went to Edentia by way of Jerusem, where the Most Highs, under the observation of the Paradise Son, released Jesus of Nazareth from the morontia state and, through the spirit channels of ascension, returned him to the status of Paradise sonship and supreme sovereignty on Salvington.

(2057.7) 193:5.5 It was about seven forty-five this morning when the morontia Jesus disappeared from the observation of his eleven apostles to begin the ascent to the right hand of his Father, there to receive formal confirmation of his completed sovereignty of the universe of Nebadon.

6. Peter Calls a Meeting

(2057.8) 193:6.1 Acting upon the instruction of Peter, John Mark and others went forth to call the leading disciples together at the home of Mary Mark. By ten thirty, one hundred and twenty of the foremost disciples of Jesus living in Jerusalem had forgathered to hear the report of the farewell message of the Master and to learn of his ascension. Among this company was Mary the mother of Jesus. She had returned to Jerusalem with John Zebedee when the apostles came back from their recent sojourn in Galilee. Soon after Pentecost she returned to the home of Salome at Bethsaida. James the brother of Jesus was also present at this meeting, the first conference of the Master’s disciples to be called after the termination of his planetary career.

(2058.1) 193:6.2 Simon Peter took it upon himself to speak for his fellow apostles and made a thrilling report of the last meeting of the eleven with their Master and most touchingly portrayed the Master’s final farewell and his ascension disappearance. It was a meeting the like of which had never before occurred on this world. This part of the meeting lasted not quite one hour. Peter then explained that they had decided to choose a successor to Judas Iscariot, and that a recess would be granted to enable the apostles to decide between the two men who had been suggested for this position, Matthias and Justus.

(2058.2) 193:6.3 The eleven apostles then went downstairs, where they agreed to cast lots in order to determine which of these men should become an apostle to serve in Judas’s place. The lot fell on Matthias, and he was declared to be the new apostle. He was duly inducted into his office and then appointed treasurer. But Matthias had little part in the subsequent activities of the apostles.

(2058.3) 193:6.4 Soon after Pentecost the twins returned to their homes in Galilee. Simon Zelotes was in retirement for some time before he went forth preaching the gospel. Thomas worried for a shorter period and then resumed his teaching. Nathaniel differed increasingly with Peter regarding preaching about Jesus in the place of proclaiming the former gospel of the kingdom. This disagreement became so acute by the middle of the following month that Nathaniel withdrew, going to Philadelphia to visit Abner and Lazarus; and after tarrying there for more than a year, he went on into the lands beyond Mesopotamia preaching the gospel as he understood it.

(2058.4) 193:6.5 This left but six of the original twelve apostles to become actors on the stage of the early proclamation of the gospel in Jerusalem: Peter, Andrew, James, John, Philip, and Matthew.

(2058.5) 193:6.6 Just about noon the apostles returned to their brethren in the upper chamber and announced that Matthias had been chosen as the new apostle. And then Peter called all of the believers to engage in prayer, prayer that they might be prepared to receive the gift of the spirit which the Master had promised to send.


Here is the bible story. It confirms this all happened on the same day. This entire story in the bible is a parallel of what is in TUB. I think its interesting just how close the bible actually is on this account.

Quote:
Acts of the Apostles 1.1-11

In the first book, Theophilus, I wrote about all that Jesus did and taught from the beginning until the day when he was taken up to heaven, after giving instructions through the Holy Spirit to the apostles whom he had chosen. After his suffering he presented himself alive to them by many convincing proofs, appearing to them over the course of forty days and speaking about the kingdom of God. While staying with them, he ordered them not to leave Jerusalem, but to wait there for the promise of the Father. ‘This’, he said, ‘is what you have heard from me; for John baptized with water, but you will be baptized with the Holy Spirit not many days from now.’

So when they had come together, they asked him, ‘Lord, is this the time when you will restore the kingdom to Israel?’ He replied, ‘It is not for you to know the times or periods that the Father has set by his own authority. But you will receive power when the Holy Spirit has come upon you; and you will be my witnesses in Jerusalem, in all Judea and Samaria, and to the ends of the earth.’ When he had said this, as they were watching, he was lifted up, and a cloud took him out of their sight. While he was going and they were gazing up towards heaven, suddenly two men in white robes stood by them. They said, ‘Men of Galilee, why do you stand looking up towards heaven? This Jesus, who has been taken up from you into heaven, will come in the same way as you saw him go into heaven.’




Quote:
Acts of the Apostles 1.12-26

Then they returned to Jerusalem from the mount called Olivet, which is near Jerusalem, a sabbath day’s journey away. When they had entered the city, they went to the room upstairs where they were staying, Peter, and John, and James, and Andrew, Philip and Thomas, Bartholomew and Matthew, James son of Alphaeus, and Simon the Zealot, and Judas son of James. All these were constantly devoting themselves to prayer, together with certain women, including Mary the mother of Jesus, as well as his brothers.

In those days Peter stood up among the believers (together the crowd numbered about one hundred and twenty people) and said, ‘Friends, the scripture had to be fulfilled, which the Holy Spirit through David foretold concerning Judas, who became a guide for those who arrested Jesus— for he was numbered among us and was allotted his share in this ministry.’ (Now this man acquired a field with the reward of his wickedness; and falling headlong, he burst open in the middle and all his bowels gushed out. This became known to all the residents of Jerusalem, so that the field was called in their language Hakeldama, that is, Field of Blood.) ‘For it is written in the book of Psalms,
“Let his homestead become desolate,
and let there be no one to live in it”;
and
“Let another take his position of overseer.”
So one of the men who have accompanied us throughout the time that the Lord Jesus went in and out among us, beginning from the baptism of John until the day when he was taken up from us—one of these must become a witness with us to his resurrection.’ So they proposed two, Joseph called Barsabbas, who was also known as Justus, and Matthias. Then they prayed and said, ‘Lord, you know everyone’s heart. Show us which one of these two you have chosen to take the place in this ministry and apostleship from which Judas turned aside to go to his own place.’ And they cast lots for them, and the lot fell on Matthias; and he was added to the eleven apostles.


Quote:
Sabbath day's journey: supposed to be a distance of 2,000 cubits, or less than half-a-mile, the distance to which, according to Jewish tradition,

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Regarding the issue of the time gap. It is generally regarded that Pentecost is 10 days after Jesus ascension. So it all lines up well with the 50 day Pentecost. The authors do not state that Pentecost is 10 days after Jesus' ascension but using all the other dates given that Chris brings up in his Pdf, you can extrapolate the exact dates.

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Pentecost 101
Everything You Need To Know About Pentecost in the Catholic Church

By Scott P. Richert, About.com Guide
Ads:

Intercessory Prayer
Prayer for the Day
Spiritual Teaching
Holy Spirit
Pray to God

After Easter Sunday, Christmas is the second-greatest feast in the Christian liturgical calendar, but Pentecost Sunday is not far behind. Coming 50 days after Easter and ten days after the Ascension of Our Lord, Pentecost marks the descent of the Holy Spirit on the apostles. For that reason, it is often called the "the birthday of the Church."

Through the links in each of the sections below, you can learn more about the history and practice of Pentecost in the Catholic Church.
Pentecost Sunday
"A mosaic of Pentecost, Cathedral of Saint John the Baptist, Parma, Ohio. (Photo © Scott P. Richert)"(Photo © Scott P. Richert)

Pentecost Sunday is one of the most ancient feasts of the Church, celebrated early enough to be mentioned in the Acts of the Apostles (20:16) and St. Paul's First Letter to the Corinthians (16:8). It supplants the Jewish feast of Pentecost, which took place 50 days after the Passover and which celebrated the sealing of the Old Covenant on Mount Sinai.

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According to Chris Halvorson, the forty days the apostles are said to have been "in hiding" (194:1.1) were from April 18 (10 days after Passover!) to May 27 (inclusive). However, according to TUB by the time the apostles left Jerusalem for Galilee (at April 17), they were already in hiding and did no public preaching (188:3.1, 192:0.1). So, TUB clearly doesn’t support Chris’ view.

If at the Jewish festival of Pentecost the apostles were in hiding for forty days since the death of Jesus at April 8 (coincidentally the day before Jewish Passover), then Pentecost would be forty (not fifty) days after Jewish Passover at May 18 (not May 28); the same day as the last (morontia) appearance of Jesus on earth and his subsequent ascension. I don’t see a 10 day gap anywhere in TUB’s narration of the events following the death of Jesus.

TUB also doesn’t support Kiwi’s theory that Essene Passover would be at wednesday April 5. Even if true, it would still be 6 or 7 days short of a period of fifty or forty-nine days (seven weeks) between Passover and Pentecost.

The only possible explanation I see is that a transcription error occurred in 194:1.1; forty days should be forty-nine days. In that case, Pentecost would be at May 28 and there would be a 10 day gap between Paper 194 section 0 and section 1..


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Bart wrote:
According to Chris Halvorson, the forty days the apostles are said to have been "in hiding" (194:1.1) were from April 18 (10 days after Passover!) to May 27 (inclusive). However, according to TUB by the time the apostles left Jerusalem for Galilee (at April 17), they were already in hiding and did no public preaching (188:3.1, 192:0.1). So, TUB clearly doesn’t support Chris’ view.

If at the Jewish festival of Pentecost the apostles were in hiding for forty days since the death of Jesus at April 8 (coincidentally the day before Jewish Passover), then Pentecost would be forty (not fifty) days after Jewish Passover at May 18 (not May 28); the same day as the last (morontia) appearance of Jesus on earth and his subsequent ascension. I don’t see a 10 day gap anywhere in TUB’s narration of the events following the death of Jesus.

TUB also doesn’t support Kiwi’s theory that Essene Passover would be at wednesday April 5. Even if true, it would still be 6 or 7 days short of a period of fifty or forty-nine days (seven weeks) between Passover and Pentecost.

The only possible explanation I see is that a transcription error occurred in 194:1.1; forty days should be forty-nine days. In that case, Pentecost would be at May 28 and there would be a 10 day gap between Paper 194 section 0 and section 1..



Edit: 188 does say the apostles where in hiding, but I don't think this is the same 40 day continuous marathon stretch of hiding.
Quote:
(2014.4) 188:3.1 Throughout this Sabbath day the disciples and the apostles remained in hiding, while all Jerusalem discussed the death of Jesus on the cross. There were almost one and one-half million Jews present in Jerusalem at this time, hailing from all parts of the Roman Empire and from Mesopotamia. This was the beginning of the Passover week, and all these pilgrims would be in the city to learn of the resurrection of Jesus and to carry the report back to their homes.


191.0.1 Does state the apostles where in hiding. This is also one of the passages Chris quoted in his pdf.
Quote:
2045.1) 192:0.1 BY THE time the apostles left Jerusalem for Galilee, the Jewish leaders had quieted down considerably. Since Jesus appeared only to his family of kingdom believers, and since the apostles were in hiding and did no public preaching, the rulers of the Jews concluded that the gospel movement was, after all, effectually crushed. They were, of course, disconcerted by the increasing spread of rumors that Jesus had risen from the dead, but they depended upon the bribed guards effectively to counteract all such reports by their reiteration of the story that a band of his followers had removed the body.

(2045.2) 192:0.2 From this time on, until the apostles were dispersed by the rising tide of persecution, Peter was the generally recognized head of the apostolic corps. Jesus never gave him any such authority, and his fellow apostles never formally elected him to such a position of responsibility; he naturally assumed it and held it by common consent and also because he was their chief preacher. From now on public preaching became the main business of the apostles. After their return from Galilee, Matthias, whom they chose to take the place of Judas, became their treasurer.

(2045.3) 192:0.3 During the week they tarried in Jerusalem, Mary the mother of Jesus spent much of the time with the women believers who were stopping at the home of Joseph of Arimathea.

(2045.4) 192:0.4 Early this Monday morning when the apostles departed for Galilee, John Mark went along. He followed them out of the city, and when they had passed well beyond Bethany, he boldly came up among them, feeling confident they would not send him back.

(2045.5) 192:0.5 The apostles paused several times on the way to Galilee to tell the story of their risen Master and therefore did not arrive at Bethsaida until very late on Wednesday night. It was noontime on Thursday before they were all awake and ready to partake of breakfast.

The apostles fled Galilee Monday morning which is April 17. That is what kept them out of sight of the Jewish leaders who were in Jerusalem. The entire time they where in Jerusalem they were being spied on. It wasn't until they left that city that they were safe from their eyes. 40 days after April 18 is Pentecost when the TUB authors state the Apostles came out of hiding. Therefor their leaving Jerusalem has to be the beginning of the 40 period of hiding.

The reason we know that Monday was April 17, is because the authors tell us what day it was just prior on that Saturday. The Apostles left on the 17th but they may not have made it out of the main area until the 18.
Quote:
(2042.5) 191:5.1 Thomas spent a lonesome week alone with himself in the hills around about Olivet. During this time he saw only those at Simon’s house and John Mark. It was about nine o’clock on Saturday, April 15,

May 27th is 40 days later. Jesus' ascension was May 18.

Quote:
(2057.3) 193:5.1 It was almost half past seven o’clock this Thursday morning, May 18,


So there is a 10 day time gap naturally in the papers. The authors do not tell us about this 10 day time gap but its considered a fact to bible readers that Pentecost is 10 days after the ascension. Chris is saying that the authors don't need to put in stuff we have already figured out on our own.

This is how readers of the bible know that Pentecost is 10 days after ascension. I just took this from a Catholic website.

Quote:
There were 10 days between His ascension and Pentecost. How do we know
this? Jesus arose from the dead on the Feast of Firstfruits (See: Q: #117 for
more on this). A "wave offering" was made on this day (Lev 23:9-10). The Feast
of Weeks, also known as Pentecost (from the Greek word "Pentekoste" meaning
fiftieth) began 50 days after the wave offering (Lev 23:15-16)(Deut 16:9-10).
Jesus was on the Earth for 40 days before His ascension (Acts 1:3). Therefore,
50-40= 10 days.


The way TUB was written is sort of a mimic of the bible. Even the Chapters of Genesis are covered in the Adam and Eve papers, in the Machiventa papers and in the Planetary Prince papers. The authors are using the bible a ton. But sometimes they want the reader to figure things out on their own they don't make everything obvious.

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boomshuka wrote:
… The apostles fled Galilee Monday morning which is April 17. That is what kept them out of sight of the Jewish leaders who were in Jerusalem. The entire time they where in Jerusalem they were being spied on. It wasn't until they left that city that they were safe from their eyes. 40 days after April 18 is Pentecost when the TUB authors state the Apostles came out of hiding. Therefor their leaving Jerusalem has to be the beginning of the 40 day period of hiding. …
Boom, can you provide any TUB quote that supports this..?


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@Bart Pentecost is 10 days after Jesus ascension and the apostles where said to come out of hiding on pentencost. Jesus tarried on earth for 40 days before his ascension. The apostles came out of hiding on Pentecost. There is no other date that the apostles could have started that 40 day hiding marathon, its the only date that fits. Pentecost literally means 50. There is no other way to manipulate the dates. There is literally no way the apostles could have been in that 40 day hiding any earlier or later then the date I provided. Unless you think the authors have made a mistake somewhere.

Jesus ascended on May 18th.
Quote:
2055.1) 193:3.1 Early Thursday morning, May 18, Jesus made his last appearance on earth as a morontia personality. As the eleven apostles were about to sit down to breakfast in the upper chamber of Mary Mark’s home, Jesus appeared to them and said:


Therefor pentecost has to be May 28th, which is the same day the apostles came out of hiding. So all we have to do is take away 40 days from Pentecost and we are left with the 18th of April. The significance of the 18th is that it would have been about the time the Apostles finally left Jerusalem out of sight of the Jewish leaders they were said to be hiding from in TUB.

Regarding the 17th. The authors tell us the day of the week on Saturday which is on the same paper. The Apostles let on Monday.


Quote:

(2042.5) 191:5.1 Thomas spent a lonesome week alone with himself in the hills around about Olivet. During this time he saw only those at Simon’s house and John Mark. It was about nine o’clock on Saturday, April 15,


So Monday must be the 17th.


There is 3 main numbers in play. Pentecost:50 days, Jesus time on Urantia: 40 days, Apostles in hiding 40 days. There is only one way to make all those numbers fit together considering the authors give us the date of Jesus ascension. The reason so many TUB readers find an error here is that the authors of TUB leave out the 10 days, they just don't mention that time gap. That is the apparent error readers have trouble with because Pentecost means 50 days. The only missing part of the puzzle is that the 10 day gap is already a biblical fact. So the authors do not have to repeat something that is already a fact. Therefor there is no error.

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This topic is reminding me of the book Jesus and the Essenes by Delores Cannon. Has anyone read it?

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Hi Bart - really appreciate your input.
Bart wrote:
TUB also doesn’t support Kiwi’s theory that Essene Passover would be at wednesday April 5. Even if true, it would still be 6 or 7 days short of a period of fifty or forty-nine days (seven weeks) between Passover and Pentecost.

The idea (I think) is that the Essene Passover was Wednesday 29 March (which is not mentioned in the UB - granted) and that 50 days after this is Thursday 18 May (which is of course mentioned).

How did you get Essene Passover at 5 April?

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Yoder777 wrote:
This topic is reminding me of the book Jesus and the Essenes by Delores Cannon. Has anyone read it?

No but I think the bit in the UB where it says:
Quote:
137:7.12 All of these parties and sects, including the smaller Nazarite brotherhood, believed in the sometime coming of the Messiah. They all looked for a national deliverer. But Jesus was very positive in making it clear that he and his disciples would not become allied to any of these schools of thought or practice. The Son of Man was to be neither a Nazarite nor an Essene.
is quite telling. It's almost as if it's saying that some people at the time thought it possible that Jesus could have become a Nazarite or an Essene if he'd wanted to. At least, more possible than aligning himself with any of the other sects.

And the early church Essene similarity is strong:
Quote:
137:7.8 The Essenes were a true religious sect, originating during the Maccabean revolt, whose requirements were in some respects more exacting than those of the Pharisees. They had adopted many Persian beliefs and practices, lived as a brotherhood in monasteries, refrained from marriage, and had all things in common. They specialized in teachings about angels.


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kiwi2 wrote:
… How did you get Essene Passover at 5 April?
Hi Kiwi. You said Essene Passover was on a Wednesday, so I simply took the first Wednesday before April 8, 30 AD (the date of passover in TUB). But you’re right, March 29 would also be a Wednesday and it would be exactly 50 days before the date of Jesus’ ascension in TUB (May 18). Nevertheless (as you agree) this is not supported by TUB..


Last edited by Bart on Thu Aug 22, 2013 7:40 am +0000, edited 1 time in total.

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boomshuka wrote:
@Bart Pentecost is 10 days after Jesus ascension and the apostles where said to come out of hiding on pentencost. Jesus tarried on earth for 40 days before his ascension. The apostles came out of hiding on Pentecost. There is no other date that the apostles could have started that 40 day hiding marathon, its the only date that fits. Pentecost literally means 50. There is no other way to manipulate the dates. There is literally no way the apostles could have been in that 40 day hiding any earlier or later then the date I provided. Unless you think the authors have made a mistake somewhere. …
Well, I already suggested that the forty days in 194:1.1 might somehow be a human transcription error..

Anyway, there is another indication that your interpretation might be correct. According to TUB, by the time the apostles left Jerusalem for Galilee (at April 17) they were already in hiding (188:3.1) and did no public preaching (192:0.1). However, in 192:0.5 it states: "The apostles paused several times on the way to Galilee to tell the story of their risen Master and therefore did not arrive at Bethsaida until very late on Wednesday night." This indicates that around April 18 the apostles were (temporarily) out of hiding. It may then be not too far fetched to suppose that the forty days of hiding mentioned in 194:1.1 refers to a second period of hiding which started after April 18 and which would place Pentecost at May 28..


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It could be that they were trying to hide in Jerusalem. But where not really successfull until they left Jerusalem. If I am hiding around the corner from someone and they know I am standing around the corner, I suppose I am not really hiding very well. It could be that they were not really doing a good job of being hidden until they left. Before that it could have been a hit and miss thing.

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Here’s a slightly different explanation by Peter Holley. He argues that between Jewish Passover and Pentecost the apostles were a total of ten days out of hiding. Hence, the forty instead of fifty days of hiding in 194:1.1. He concludes: "The Urantia Book is made to be studied, and conundrums like this are mind-candy to whet our appetites for it!"

http://beamsdoorway.bizland.com/urantia ... n_pent.htm


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