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Do you attend church?
Yes 39%  39%  [ 11 ]
No 46%  46%  [ 13 ]
Can't find a suitable one 14%  14%  [ 4 ]
It's sorta like a church but... 0%  0%  [ 0 ]
Total votes : 28
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Joined: Mon Sep 11, 2006 9:18 pm +0000
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Location: Nieu-Bethesda, Eastern Cape, South Africa
Thank you All. for sharing your individual thoughts on this poll. I have not found a suitable one as yet and doubt very much if ever I will actually find a congregation of people that will fit my personal, subjective, notion of “suitability”.

In our village there is only one church. A beautiful gothic building – the Dutch Reformed Church. (I grew up in the DRC.) Until recently, I used to attend regularly with the other 25 – 35 regular attendees (although not all are members as such). Unfortunately I find it more and more disconcerting to listen to the emphasis being put on Jesus’ blood sacrifice and all the trimmings surrounding this doctrine. So, I do not really feel free to attend any more. I admire all of you who are able to do the mental gymnastics around these things, I just cannot get the knack of it. So I elect not to attend anymore.

The scribe of the congregation mentioned to me not so long ago that she is acutely aware of my absence and wondered what the reason could be. Now how on earth do I answer her without being offensive one way or another? I mustered a smile and told her that I owe her an answer. She just looked at me quizzically. Fortunately, my close circle of friends (all attending on and off some of the services), know about my involvement with TUB and also understand my discomfort with the sacrificial doctrine – due to us having had some wonderful discussions involving TUB and other biblical doctrinal matters.

So, I find my spiritual nourishment being occupied with the Papers, silent reflection, incorporating the Paradise Trinity, Christ Michael and the rest of the celestials in my day to day walk and talk. I also make use of UBIS whenever possible. Actually, the current course I’ve enrolled for, An Introduction to the Urantia Book, starts tomorrow, Monday. Studying with other students does fill a big void. Although, from a human perspective and position of Faith Son, it would be wonderful to fellowship on a regular basis with spiritually like-minded folks ... but I guess that will have to wait, as far as my situation is concerned, for the mansion worlds, and beyond.

Thanks again, Tramp, for initiating this thought provoking thread.


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Gerdean wrote:
It therefore could be loosely said that every time we get together at the table to eat and drink, if we are God-conscious, spirit-led human beings, we are participating in communion.


Gerdean,

I don't think this is a loose interpretation at all. I think this is exactly the situation to which the Master was referring. I seriously doubt he meant for a new ritual to be created with precise form and words.

Quote:
179:5.8 And this mighty occasion took place in the upper chamber of a friend. There was nothing of sacred form or of ceremonial consecration about either the supper or the building. The remembrance supper was established without ecclesiastical sanction.

179:5.9 When Jesus had thus established the supper of the remembrance, he said to the twelve: "And as often as you do this, do it in remembrance of me. ..."

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HI ARNO!

Golly mate, your in a pickle, that’s for sure!
Perhaps you should tell her that you have been living the religion of Jesus outside and to everyone. You know, sister, the Fatherhood of god and the Brotherhood of Man. No matter what, saying nothing, or saying something, your gonna be branded in some fashion if fear.

I can only imagine what a tough situation that would be… My heart goes out to you, man, to walk that fine line. Whatever you do, do it with love and it will all (eventually) work out for the best!

Al O:)


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Salutations all.

I would like to interect, if I may, on the idea and reason behind church attendance.

First of all, I would like to begin by saying that there are experiences of going to church, and there are opinions about it. That's very important to understand. For those that have not experienced it, and truly opened their hearts to it, church is nothing more than a group of people getting together for a common faith. To these desensitizes human beings, not only do they believe that church is a place for the less fortunate, but it is also a place of self-delusion.

On the contrary, to the experienced church goer, it is a place of many things. For instance, it allows one to follow the christian belief, and biblical belief, that we are to hold fast the seventh day and keep it holy, among other things. It also let's people of common faith to come together and influence each other in a positive environment, to stregthen each other in FAITH of God, and to do other things that help others through charity, and love. In other words, it is a place of giving peace through reassurance to the self, and also a place to express that same thing to others by charity, love, and faith, thereby sharing in the fruits.

However, there's a third view of this, interesting enough. As it were, church is nothing more or LESS than the act of going outside and bathing in the collective sunlight we all share. But, one thing everyone seems to miss, and forget, and I have yet to figure out why that is. Church isn't just about seeing, reading, and hearing the word of God, nor is it about taking advice from another man of equal soul status. There are so many churches now that have showed more respect for their preacher than Jesus Himself, sadly enough, because they don't feel the Spirit presence all around them, within them, and of them. The people of these churches are completely missing the point of true God worship and appreciation.

In truth, I suppose the moslems and jews have it correctly, moreso than christians insomuch as true worship is concerned. In most protestant christian churches, there is no knee bowing and no humility. Usually, the only respect given is to the preacher who is nothing more than a brother on the path. As if he could help you lead your soul better than you? As if he knew your soul better than you? As if he knew the path better than you?...The catholic church seems to be closest to true worship than protestant ones in that respect. They kneel, show humilty, show only equal respect to the preist, as simply a father of the church, or even as a father, and take part in one of the most sacred things to christianity - communion.

So, as I was saying, church is nothing more or LESS than walking outside to be a part of life, but that church in particular is a means of doing the same thing with GOD. You step into church, and, in most churches, only experience seeing the sunlight. Here's where everyone has it all wrong. If we walk outside, do we JUST see sunlight, or do we see, feel and experience it?...We do all. So, why it is seen as if we are only supposed to see the preacher, see what he is reading from, see with his imagination, see with his eyes?..Why aren't we feeling something? Well, first of all, we can all feel this, and it's called the Spirit. However, everyone seems to be blind to the Spirit, so they don't reach out for it.

I used to be protestant. I was raised that way actually. Not until I was about 24 did I become interested in catholicism, and the true tradition of christianity, and it's origins. By attending mass, for the very first time, I experienced not just a few well chosen words, but also the injection of the Holy Spirit within my heart, and soul. Not only, when walking out of mass, was I somehow spiritually energized, and cleansed, as it felt, but I was also stregthened in faith, tolerance, and in my will to remain clean. This isn't a state of mind, my friends, this is truly the taking part in the Holy Spirit, or Spirit, as I use St Paul's wording. This was done in many ways by condemning you own sin, or wrong doing, or acts of mud playing, and accepting the Spirit once you were.

So, by attending mass, or church, we do many things, but most importantly we visit the Spirit in the Spirit's office for re-attunement with it. I think this it the true reason for church. This may seem to be an opinion, but, in reality, it is a personal recorded fact deeply rooted in experience. So, next time any of you go to church, go into church like you would be going outside, and not only see things, but feel them too.

My personal opinions, and /or experiences, of attending church.

lux, vita, amor,

RS

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In and out over the years. I've attended many denominations and migrate back to the Catholic church. I go and love it for awhile and then start to feel a resentment building and have to leave. I loved taking communion, singing and the fellowship but...the hypocracy starts to show it's ugly face.
I once taught catachism for 4yrs. I had the 2nd graders and prayed and vowed not to pass on any un-truths. I never had to. I would take the children out behind the building and sit under a tree on a blanket and teach and talk with the children about God and Jesus. It was so holy. We would then go in and go a craft project. We once sent a get well card to the Pope and got signed pictures back...that was cool.

Presently I prefer to be in service to others on Sunday. I take care of 5 ladies in a elderly care home. Cook them a yummy meal and care for their needs. I love it and a very holy time for me.

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Hey Tootsie.

I believe this, for you, if the Spirit guiding you not so much to th catholic church, or church in general, but to charity, and, through the beautiful catholic church, it helps in applying that. I have also done alot of work for my parish, and they are unforgettable moments, and I know that they will not be forgotten, by me or God.

lux, vita, amor,

RS

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Thank You all for such good sharing.

P.1006 - §3 Religion has handicapped social development in many ways, but without religion there would have been no enduring morality nor ethics, no worth-while civilization. Religion enmothered much nonreligious culture: Sculpture originated in idol making, architecture in temple building, poetry in incantations, music in worship chants, drama in the acting for spirit guidance, and dancing in the seasonal worship festivals.

P.1777 - §2 … Look to your Master. Even now he is out in the hills taking in power while we are here giving out energy. The secret of all this problem is wrapped up in spiritual communion, in worship. From the human standpoint it is a question of combined meditation and relaxation. Meditation makes the contact of mind with spirit; relaxation determines the capacity for spiritual receptivity. And this interchange of strength for weakness, courage for fear, the will of God for the mind of self, constitutes worship. At least, that is the way the philosopher views it.

P.1133 - §1 The characteristic difference between a social occasion and a religious gathering is that in contrast with the secular the religious is pervaded by the atmosphere of communion. In this way human association generates a feeling of fellowship with the divine, and this is the beginning of group worship. Partaking of a common meal was the earliest type of social communion, and so did early religions provide that some portion of the ceremonial sacrifice should be eaten by the worshipers. Even in Christianity the Lord's Supper retains this mode of communion. The atmosphere of the communion provides a refreshing and comforting period of truce in the conflict of the self-seeking ego with the altruistic urge of the indwelling spirit Monitor. And this is the prelude to true worship--the practice of the presence of God which eventuates in the emergence of the brotherhood of man.

P.1221 - §7 This choosing of the Father's will is the spiritual finding of the spirit Father by mortal man, even though an age must pass before the creature son may actually stand in the factual presence of God on Paradise. This choosing does not so much consist in the negation of creature will--"Not my will but yours be done"--as it consists in the creature's positive affirmation: "It is my will that your will be done." And if this choice is made, sooner or later will the God-choosing son find inner union (fusion) with the indwelling God fragment, while this same perfecting son will find supreme personality satisfaction in the worship communion of the personality of man and the personality of his Maker, two personalities whose creative attributes have eternally joined in self-willed mutuality of expression--the birth of another eternal partnership of the will of man and the will of God.

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Joined: Fri Mar 06, 2009 3:11 pm +0000
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I have no recommendations as to what church anyone should attend.
I have heard great sermons and got the lump in my throat and the tears in my eyes. It lost a little pizazz though when I found out that most great sermons are rehearsed and re-fined and exchanged amonst the members of the clergy. Kind of like a good song list for a band. Invaluable actually in both cases .
If it helps renew the Spirit within you then who's to say yea or nay.
8)
As far as the kneeling rituals ect. are concerned I guess I missed that part in the New Testament and the Urantia Jesus papers. If there are such instructional documents someone please enlighten me.
Seventh day is Saturday, Jews got it right.

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Said Jesus: "Though human beings differ in many ways, the one from another, before God and in the spiritual world all mortals stand on an equal footing. There are only two groups of mortals in the eyes of God: those who desire to do his will and those who do not. As the universe looks upon an inhabited world, it likewise discerns two great classes: those who know God and those who do not. Those who cannot know God are reckoned among the animals of any given realm. Mankind can appropriately be divided into many classes in accordance with differing qualifications, as they may be viewed physically, mentally, socially, vocationally, or morally, but as these different classes of mortals appear before the judgment bar of God, they stand on an equal footing; God is truly no respecter of persons. Although you cannot escape the recognition of differential human abilities and endowments in matters intellectual, social, and moral, you should make no such distinctions in the spiritual brotherhood of men when assembled for worship in the presence of God."
I love this quote...worship is worship no matter where or how we do it...Aloha to all

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Hi tootsie and all,
Nice to hear from you.
I got a group around home called the Institute of Mental Physics. They have retreats , Sunday gatherings, drum circles, various speakers, and all sorts of kinda like old hippie stuff. I thought about going over there for a service at least to find out whats going on. You never know. 8)

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I polled "Yes"
Then I argued with myself.
Egotism aside, the FER allows me to consider that where a son is, a TA is with him. Where a son and a TA are, there is the potential of 'church'.

So, from that point of view, we all go to church...alot. We go five abreast with one body, TA, Holy Spirit, Spirit of Truth and one pre-morontial spirit child.

Yet, we are not church enough unto ourselves. We are called to service. We are called to serve here on Urantia, the World of the Cross. What a humbling honor to consider and what a mess we're in these days.

Forgive my attempt to divert from meaning of the poll question. No harm intended.

"Yes", and "Yes", again.

Bill


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I've attended a Catholic Church all my life (84 years), and have had reservations and felt skeptical about many of the things we are taught, one of the main issues being eating the flesh and drinking the blood of Jesus. Since discovering the Urantia Book 35 years ago, I still attend Mass, but have a different perspective regarding the Eucharist. I'm sure the rituals will never change and hope I'm not considered a heretic for preferring the Urantia Book version of what Jesus said at the Last Supper. At least, I'm quite sure Jesus himself won't mind.


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Dear Rosemary,

How nice to see you post here!!! Welcome!

I feel as you do - that Jesus is happy no matter who comes to his table in sincere faith. I would like to think that, if Catholics understood more about Jesus' presence in the Spirit of Truth, that they would be more accepting of people who want to join them in the Eucharist. It would lose its "bloody" flavor in favor of just remembering, and celebrating his presence together. Alas, that will probably not happen, as you observe - at least no time soon, but we can hope...

Again, I want to welcome you here, and hope to see you here often...


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How fragrant a post, Rosemary E,.

Wow.

I just had a baptism.

To me, thats what any rememberance of Jesus is intended to be, a baptism. I remember the first taking of communion subsequent to receiving the FER.
I wept. Openly, unashamedly...and I knew Peace. You know, that Peace that comes with spiritual affection...a witness of truth born of personal experience.

Thank you. Perhaps not oddly, I'm just now returning to these few threads. Looks to be a promising season.

Your servant,

Bill


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I have recently started doing something that has expanded my horizons greatly. Each week, I try to attend a different church. It has opened my mind spiritually in a great many ways...at the same time, I carry my own beliefs no matter where I go. Just this past Sunday, I attended Unity Church for the first time. That was a great experience in that it felt to me that the sermon was straight out of the UB.

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