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An open forum for general discussions of a spiritual nature where guests and readers entertain the teachings of The Urantia Book.
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This is what I have decided about life.

Sun Nov 09, 2008 9:11 am +0000

People search out religions for one reason, to secure their place in the afterlife, or next life. Everyone in their mind knows right from wrong. You know when you have done something that is wrong. Why does anyone need religion to tell them right from wrong? I do not want to belong to any faith that tells me the "rules", I already know them. I do not HAVE to believe ANYTHING, all I really have to do is try to live a life that, for the most part, I do not cause pain of any kind to another human being. I'm sure I do from time to time, but I know when I do this and I am sorry for it. I'm not going to progress at a high rate of speed to the next level, I'm just an ordinary person, I'm not perfect.
I have a lot of questions about life, but don't really expect to find the answers. Would be nice if "someone" would land right in my living room and talk to me, but NO. If I created a planet and filled it with people, I would do whatever it took to comunicate with them, If someone really wanted answers, I would give them answers. So I have to take from the silence, that you really don't need an answers. And the people who say they have spoken to midwayer's or whatever, I ask myself, what makes so much more worthy of this then me? I think that the "rules" that certain religions pose to you are bullshit. I may not get an "A" in my life test, but I don't think you need an A to pass, maybe I will just not advace as fast, but that's OK with me. If the next life is as enjoyable as this, I can wait for the one that follows.

Sun Nov 09, 2008 9:34 am +0000

Hello Debbie,

I think I understand how you feel and there are reasons that you see the world today as you see it.

You, rightly and honestly desire to see a better world, where things work the way they should. We all do. That sentiment is perfectly natural. You wonder why God has"gone to all this trouble" to set up life on a planet and then seemingly walk away, apparently leaving no one in charge to run things and to teach his new little children about how to live and what they should do and what their place is in the universe.

Well God does in fact plan and provide for just this very thing. And this system of "overseeing" is in place in full force on every normal world.

But you must understand that Earth is not among the vast majority of "normal" worlds. Life and government on this planet is not following Michael's intended life plan for inhabited worlds in his domain. I say Michael rather than God the Father, as the local creations are administered by the Local Universe Creator Sons of the Michael Order. Yet God the Father still is here and sees all and knows all as His direct presence is here in the entity of the Thought Adjusters who indwell each of us.

Our planet was unfortunately involved in the Lucifer Rebellion some 250,000 years ago. The results of this disasterous event plunged our world into isolation and quarantine from the system circuits. They removed the superhuman teachers and influences that we would have otherwise enjoyed.

In other words, if it were not for the Lucifer Rebellion, we would have a full planetary superhuman government here, leading, teaching and guiding us. Things today in our 2008 would have little resemblance to the way the world looks now. The UB describes the probable "normal-today" appearance as looking as if we were suddenly transported to a material paradise somewhere.

Debbie, what else can I say? All of this is revealed and explained in great and exhausting detail in the book. I have seen you say in another post how difficult it is for some reason for you to read the book. I can't help that I'm sorry. I would only suggest that you find, you learn a way to get through reading the book. No one can come over and do this for you. You must do it yourself.

Read one page a day. Can you do that? One page? You are not under any pressure to read the whole book in a month, a year...any time period. It IS a big book. So what. Read one page a day if that is all you can do. In 2,097 days you'll be though it.

I'm sure you've heard this old saying: "God helps those who help themselves."

It is true, He will help you. Jesus will help you. The Holy Spirit and The Spirit of Truth will help you. Your guardian angel will help you. But you must be industrious. You must help yourself.

One page a day

If I may be so bold to speak for everyone here Debbie, we love you and we wish the best for you.

Ask us how we can help.....other than coming over to your house and doing it for you. That is thing none of us can do.

Peace and love,


OK Vann, I got the message

Sun Nov 09, 2008 10:06 am +0000

I know what you are saying; If I would just read the book, then all these things that I am at offs with will be answered. What I was trying to say was, what if I don't read the book, What if I had never heard of the book, I am still OK.
Life is like anything else, the more information you have about it, the better your judgement will be. With that being said, yes I will read the book, and be better off for doing so. BUT, if I don't read it, If stay confusied about many things, I will still advance, not just as fast.
There are no experts in life better than you own thought adjuster.

Sun Nov 09, 2008 10:11 am +0000

Hi Debbie,

Yeah I hear ya. The UB states that how you think is more important than what you do.

Interesting that you note reliance in your Thought Adjuster! Well you must admit that you would have never of heard of, or know anything about having a Thought Adjuster if you had not learned about it in the book or was told of them by somebody else who did have the book :smile:

Another name for same think

Sun Nov 09, 2008 10:17 am +0000

I would not have called it a "thought adjuster", I would have called it "my conscience"

Sun Nov 09, 2008 10:24 am +0000

Hi Debbie,

Well I hear again.....but you would have called it wrong. The UB discourss on conscience too which is a separate thing.

Look I don't wish to begin a disagreement with you. You also mentioned earlier not feeling able to quickly advance spiritually or even in just (cosmolgical) knowledge.

So who is asking you to or why do feel that is being implied?

The UB does not advocate over-rapid advancement attempts. It in fact advocates the opposite. Slow growth is best. Timely, sure progress.

Just hang in there and live each day faithfully and loyally. You'll get there!

I just posted this quote earlier today in another thread:

"Loyal persons are growing persons, and growth is an impressive and inspiring reality. Live loyally today--grow--and tomorrow will attend to itself. The quickest way for a tadpole to become a frog is to live loyally each moment as a tadpole" pg 1094


Tell me where to read about "Lucifer" in TUB

Sun Nov 09, 2008 10:29 am +0000

Lucifer?, Why did God allow him here? I want to read about this. If this changed things for us, then there must have been a reason. I want to know what the reason was for allowing this. Where is this in the UB? Yes, I already know, If I would read the book I would know, but quide me to what I am looking for.

Sun Nov 09, 2008 10:36 am +0000

Hi Debbie

Gladly I will point :smile:

Papers 53 and 54

Start on page 601

53 tells all about the rebellion and 54 describes the resulting problems, conditions and solutions.


Sun Nov 09, 2008 11:12 am +0000

Hello dkr315d,

In your first sentence you said "People search out religions for one reason, to secure their place in the afterlife, or next life." Later you wrote "Life is like anything else, the more information you have about it, the better your judgement will be." I've provided several quotes from TUB here to exemplify why yes, having more information does provide better judgment particularly relating to your comment that there's just one reason for a religious search. You'll notice though that none of these quotes say anything about an afterlife. Hang in there, you're doing fine.

The Zoroastrians had a religion of morals; the Hindus a religion of metaphysics; the Confucianists a religion of ethics. Jesus lived a religion of service. All these religions are of value in that they are valid approaches to the religion of Jesus. Religion is destined to become the reality of the spiritual unification of all that is good, beautiful, and true in human experience. (5:4.7)

Primitive religion was largely a material-value consciousness, but civilization elevates religious values, for true religion is the devotion of the self to the service of meaningful and supreme values. As religion evolves, ethics becomes the philosophy of morals, and morality becomes the discipline of self by the standards of highest meanings and supreme values─divine and spiritual ideals. And thus religion becomes a spontaneous and exquisite devotion, the living experience of the loyalty of love. (92:7.5)

Religionists are of no more value in the tasks of social reconstruction than nonreligionists except in so far as their religion has conferred upon them enhanced cosmic foresight and endowed them with that superior social wisdom which is born of the sincere desire to love God supremely and to love every man as a brother in the heavenly kingdom. An ideal social order is that in which every man loves his neighbor as he loves himself. (99:2.4)

True religion is a meaningful way of living dynamically face to face with the commonplace realities of everyday life. But if religion is to stimulate individual development of character and augment integration of personality, it must not be standardized. If it is to stimulate evaluation of experience and serve as a value-lure, it must not be stereotyped. If religion is to promote supreme loyalties, it must not be formalized. (99:4.3)

Sun Nov 09, 2008 3:40 pm +0000

p642:4 56:7.4 It should be noted that ascending mortals may experience the impersonal presence of successive levels of Deity long before they become sufficiently spiritual and adequately educated to attain experiential personal recognition of, and contact with, these Deities as personal beings.
Last edited by Bonita on Fri Mar 20, 2009 5:23 pm +0000, edited 1 time in total.

Sun Nov 09, 2008 4:49 pm +0000

Hey Deb!

You know what is a super easy to get thru the Urantia Book?? Get the Big hard cover one with the DVD. The DVD is an AUDIO version of the book! If your car is MP3 ready, all ya need to do is make CD's of the DVD (about a hundred or so... No, not that many!) and listen to it on the way to and from work. That's what I do. Now I look forward to going to work! If you don't have an MP3 ready car stereo, you could buy one, of talk to one of your computer geek friends (or someone here at TruthBook?) and see how to convert the MP3 CD's into regular “audio” format. You could also download it onto an IPOD too or something.

But the point is, it makes it a painless way to seep in the cool messages in this book. Yeah, it's definitely a robo-guy on the horn, but he reads along OK, and it's a great alternative to squinting at the tiny little writing in the book.

Another thing I do is, when I am working out, I'll take a printed (8.5 X 11) download from the Urantia Book and read it while I am stair-stepping or riding the exercise bike for 20 minutes. Sometimes when I am done I will "accidentally" leave it at the gym. Who knows, someone else might get a kick out of reading it when I'm done. The good thing about the downloading onto regular paper is it comes out 12-font, which my old eyes can handle allot better.


Sun Nov 09, 2008 6:00 pm +0000

Hey Deb,

You wrote:

"If I created a planet and filled it with people, I would do whatever it took to comunicate with them, If someone really wanted answers, I would give them answers. So I have to take from the silence, that you really don't need an answers"

From what I understand from the UB, God DOES do whatever he can to communicate with us - normal worlds have a resident Adam and Eve, have a Planetary Prince, have temples to the Father and a Garden of Eden. People don't have to search and search in the darkness for God - he is there from the get-go. On this really messed up planet, we have bupkus...and it is hard to navigate the spiritual life here.

Yes - read all about Lucifer, and the defult of our Adam and Eve. You'll get a real clear understanding of just why things are the way they are here. It is not God's fault, and it is not your fault, and it's not my fault, but it is what it is, and we are still paying the price for others' misdeeds.
We do need answers - at least I do, and that is why The UB has been such a gift to my life. Just understanding WHY things are so hard here helps to make it better...

BUT - there is a silver lining. Did you know that many celestial beings actually ENVY the mortals of Urantia? They envy that we get to forge out our faith in God through experience, because that means that once we get it, it is ours forever. We EARN our faith and we EARN our eternal life as few other planetary mortals do. We are called agondonters:

50:7.2 On Jerusem the ascenders from these isolated worlds occupy a residential sector by themselves and are known as the agondonters, meaning evolutionary will creatures who can believe without seeing, persevere when isolated, and triumph over insuperable difficulties even when alone.

Other beings think we are pretty darn special.

So, even when it is hard and frustrating, hang in there, and keep up the good fight. You are worth it, and the reward is worth it...

Sun Nov 09, 2008 8:39 pm +0000

Debbie, I love the way your mind works. Our life paths may be different, but we share similar thought processes.

So, what's it really all about, anyway?

Its is all about uniquely created beings, experiencing unique growth as they achieve their perfection potentials. That is the reason it all seems so complicated; because our experiences are by design, unique. That spark of Divinity God gives us, is our commonality, and destiny as well. All the pain and delight in our individual lives, is not lost, but eternally registered in God the Supreme. Our individual struggles to find God, ultimately define our worth. And so, ultimately, "being the best tadpole" we know how to be, is what is important. Our destiny of becoming a "frog" is already a certainty.


Bro Dave

Tue Nov 11, 2008 10:31 pm +0000

Hi...another way that I enjoy is to get the daily quote from this wonderful site and to click on the page and read that. Sometime if it's long...I will print it out to read during lunch break in the park...it's amazing how uplifting and spot on it is for me in the moment...

Wed Nov 12, 2008 8:47 am +0000

Hi Tootsie,

Have you tried the "Listen" link on the quote? This gives the audio section from which the quote is lifted. The quote is usually just part of a sentence or maybe two sentences. The audio link gives the full paragraph and sometimes the one preceding or following so that the full context of the concept is given. Adds a lot to the Quote of the Day.

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